Ds is five and can’t use cutlery

[toohotwiththeheatingon]

He uses his fingers generally; it’s awful when you see him grabbing fistfuls of food 🤢

I’ve just lost it with him after half his dinner ended up on the floor. Seriously feel like I’ve got a weaning baby.

Not sure what to do tbh.

My DS 17yrs has severe dyspraxia and often still uses his fingers to eat food, if it’s feasible.

I insist on him using cutlery when we’re eating out but we try to choose foods that can be eaten with fingers, where possible, such as pizza.

It’s not laziness as he’s extremely hard working and conscientious with school work and his music. Forcing him to use cutlery when we’re at home seems overly cruel to me.

OP and think you are getting a lot of judgy comments so here is some solidarity. My DS (7) stuffs his food in his mouth with his hands, yes even spat Bol, and displays various barbaric table manners. He can’t sit still. His sisters (older and younger) are much better. In my opinion it’s a mixture of behaviour (he can do better when motivated but chooses not to) and poor fine motor skills (younger sister had better handwriting). It’s gross but I am just assuming he will get there eventually as with most things they develop more abilities with age and he will eventually become self conscious and not deliberately behave disgustingly.

we don’t eat with the kids because they need their dinner at 5pm when one of us is still at work (different person on different days) and DH and I like to eat non bland, warm food together in the evening and have a chat. Honestly having a meal with my DH is more important to me than DS manners. We just do t take him to restaurants. So shoot me.

You mentioned him slouching when he sits, do you think he could be hypermobile?

Sit with them at the big table

remind constantly to use cutlery if using fingers

if need be show him how to eat /cut up food

@toohotwiththeheatingon you are doing the right thing to address your son’s table manners now.

Many years ago I dated a man in his thirties who had clearly never been taught how to eat nicely. The first and only time we went out for a meal I became aware of just how bad his table manners were. He mixed all his food together into a slop, shovelled his food in with a fork, dropped food on the table and make loud chewing/chomping noises while he ate. He gobbled the meal very quickly and was putting huge amounts of food into his mouth in one go. He couldn’t seem to use cutlery in the correct way and I had to ask him to please not talk while his mouth was full. He slurped his tea at the end of the meal as a final thing to put me off. It was absolutely revolting!

Losing it with him without ever patiently teaching him to use them is really shit.

Well, he was picking up huge handfuls of food, cramming it into his mouth and a lot of it was not going in and falling on the floor which is why I shouted at him (that is what I meant by ‘lost it’) - he was being very silly and annoying, and making a mess.

One thing to use fingers but another rather to cram food in like that!

He needs to sit at a big table and learn to sit there while he and others are eating. He may find cutlery hard so try different types. Do not accept mess, he is too old for that but accept it might be a slow process and you need to model good eating. Mix things he can eat with his hands like pizza with other foods where the expectation is he uses a fork or spoon. He needs to relearn and be praised for doing well.

Maybe break it down, teach the skills in isolation. Finding a way to sit and eat with him will help but also maybe try some Montessori style games. Set up two nice little bowls, put raw rice or something in one and show him how to spoon it from one bowl into the other. Or like 3 marbles. Really small task separated completely from mealtimes.

This is how they work on fine motor control in school. They'll pull a child aside for 5 mins and give them a little task like threading cocktail sticks into a holder through a tiny hole or using tweezers to move pom poms between bowls. No reason you can't do similar little things at home to support cutlery skills, literally 2-5 mins a day. Change the activity or material whenever he loses interest. We had couscous going for months once.

Montessori would set out everything on a little tray, show the entire exercise, have them repeat and leave the tray out for the child to access freely, but you don't have to go the whole hog. A more casual DS, come and do this while I peel the carrots might work better.

Oh my god, I can't believe I've never thought of this 🤦 my little one who is possible SEN is a complete fidget at a table, this is an excellent idea. Thanks for posting this, I'm praying it works 🙏

DS is autistic and has EDS, so he has a lot of coordination and motor skills challenges. We've had OT input on and off for years, some of the things that helped

Theroputty - like playdoh but different levels of resistance. We followed a program of different actions with it for 3 months, and it did help with his hand control.

Making biscuits with fork hole patterns - got him practicing in situation away from dinner battles. Also putting cutlery in the mud kitchen and get him mixing potions, or anything else away from meals that you think would appeal.

Special cutlery - think someone has already put a link up thread, they do help

Achievable targets - eating they whole meal with knife and fork might feel to 'big' to even start. Maybe start with "use your fork for the mash, then you can pick up the rest", then gradually increase mash & peas, etc

Eat together at the table.
If he’s too short get a cushion for him to sit on.
Model proper eating and repeat that he needs to use his cutlery.

My DS is almost six and terrible with using .
cutlery. He will use a spoon with wheatbix, yogurt etc but only after a lot of telling him to so. Meal times are still a struggle but he is fussy and eats chips , pizza, fish fingers etc so nothing to messy . Whereas my son whose just one tries to use a fork and spoon already, which actually made me breath a sigh of relief as it does make me question is it mu parenting sometimes.
Anyhow my 5yo is in the middle of been referred for possible ADHD/Autism, we (and teachers) aren't sure which and its quite mild, but i definitely think the cutlery is a part of it especially watching my one year old.

@Throman yes my two year old sits nicely with a knife and fork and spoon! It’s funny how different they are.

It's absolutely basic.
You sit at the table with your children and show them how it's done. How to hold a knife and fork, how to pass things, how to chew, putting down the knife and fork whilst speaking - with an empty mouth.

There are no short cuts. There are no low bars. It's modelling and expectation 100% of the time. If they behave like pigs at the table, they leave the table and lose some privileges.

I say that as a mother to a now 27 year old who is dyspraxic and has ADHD. It took her longer than my NT child and there were no scenes or losing it, but she had decent table manners from dot, even if cutlery was a struggle and she needed more help with cutting.

It is a parent's responsibility to ensure their DC grow up civilised, that the export model is acceptable and that the children need never be unsure about what to do at any table or unsure about how to handle any food or any piece of cutlery.

When did you start trying to get him to use a spoon and fork? They don’t magically wake up one day being able to do it, the dc you see able to use a knife and fork (and yes at 5 most dc can use knives) will have been weaned using a spoon from a few months old, progressing to a spoon and fork around a year, lots of misses, parents having to help sometimes with complicated food, but by 2 they should be basically feeding themselves, by 4 adding in cutting themselves. BUT for families who didn’t add spoons young, did finger food for an extended period, they will not have as much dexterity, not does disability, simply not enough practice. The good news is you can get there but you will need to use all the tricks including good old fashioned bribery, star charts, dessert, new book whatever does it for your dc. If after a few months they are still struggling then they may have something delaying them but I’m seeing the 4 year olds at work can’t use forks and their parents openly admit they don’t bother, fingers are easier - fine whatever but don’t leave it to school to teach them!

Aw poor thing. Can you try with just a spoon? Or maybe a spoon and a fork?

they don’t magically wake up knowing they do in fact; DD did, despite my slovenly parenting.

My daughter would grab the spoon off me from quite a young age and attempt to start shovelling it in! Yes there was a LOT of mess but I let her get on with it.

Ps my dd has dyspraxia, asd and serious food issues, it was a hard slog. We always ate as a family at the table and had booster cushions until mid primary school, being too low makes dexterity difficult

I think that’s an awful thing to do. He may just start gobbling food up too fast and potentially choking. He will also develop a bad association with food and you!

I don’t think this is that difficult to solve but you are going to have to put a bit of conscious work and effort into it, OP.

Do a proper (quiet) assessment of where he’s at over the next few days. Can he use a spoon for eg yoghurt. Can he stab a potato with a fork?

Get those two sorted first. You will likely have to sit on the floor at the kids table and oversee it till he gets there. If he physically can’t then I would ask the GP for an OT referral.

If he CAN do it but won’t, then you’re in the realm of sanctions. No tv/screen time/pudding/favourite toy etc if he mucks about it. Pick a high value sanction and stick to it rigidly for a week or two.

Once you’ve got him sitting at the table better and consistently using a spoon and fork, move onto proper grips and cutting with a knife.

Also: try and give yourself 10 mins sit down with a cuppa before mealtimes, so you’re not trying to do it whilst frazzled.

Have you considered a chair like a Tripp Trapp? Feels like a big kid chair but the adjustable height and footrest makes it much more comfortable for wiggly kids and with feet able to rest on something, they will be less wiggly. I’d also do small portions to start and possibly say no more until using a fork 🤷‍♀️.

He doesn’t care re sanctions. It can be a challenge. We’ll see how he gets on.

I was going to comment that he will pick it up with encouragement, but then remembered watching an episode of 'Come Dine With Me' yesterday evening and there was a young man eating so awkwardly like a caveman who'd never seen cutlery before, didn't seem to know how to hold the knife and fork, or even how to wield them, and I thought 'why has he never been taught how to use cutlery'. So I hope your wee lad gets to grips with it soon! Good luck.