Today's by-election... how do you think it will go?

[Westfacing]

A few months back according to the media it was Reform's for the taking - now it's a three-way bet between Labour, Greens and Reform

Despite many people voting on sectarian grounds, the combined % of left leaning vote in Gorton and Denton yesterday was lower than it was at the last GE. In fact it is the lowest % of left leaning vote there has ever been in that particular consistency.

I find that all very heartening.

I think you raise an important distinction here between right and left wing politics.

Left wing politics, starting with Marx is founded on the concept of oppressor and oppressed, rich and poor or bourgeoisie and proletariat.

The stronger side is always the bad guys and the weaker side always the good guys regardless of the circumstances.

Interestingly Israel was viewed as the good guys by the left in 1948 when they were the weak side surrounded by strong Arab States, but that all changed when Israel kept winning wars.

So in the recent conflict Israel is viewed by the left as the bad guys, despite being horrifically attacked by Hamas, because they are the strong side.

In addition there is equally a strong anti semetic angle to this as well, if the genuine concern is for the loss of civilian life then why isn't there greater concern for the loss of civilian life in Sudan, where more people were killed in two weeks than the entire Gazan conflict?The answer is that there are no Jews involved, it's simply Muslims massacring other Muslims and Christians.

If the genuine concern is about unfair detention then why isn't there greater concern for the Uighur people who are kept in actual concentration camps with mosques being levelled. The answer is that there are no Jews involved, it's just Chinese detaining Muslims.

If the genuine concern is for ill treatment of refugees then why aren't more people concerned about Pakistan forcibly deporting 1.5 million Afghan refugees back to Afghanistan. The answer is that there are no Jews involved.

The Green Party represents a very dangerous far left / woke / Islamist / anti semetic political movement all wrapped up in a fluffy front of caring about climate change and polar bears.

Woke up to a deja view George Galloway 'up the Gaza' result once again - how did it come to this?

Who is voting for unfettered drugs, brothels, porn and illegals?

Thankfully they wont get in in my area, but Labour must be so dire to lose this seat.

The Greens got in because of the Islamic vote. The deputy leader of the Greens is Mothin Ali, who when elected in Leeds, shouted Allahu Akbar.

How low can Keir go?

It’s not odd at all. People manning polling stations are community members and may well be happy to turn a blind eye.

Im more inclined to listen to the independent observers who were concerned enough to write a same day report.

Yet a white working class woman won, hardly a "traditional" choice if you want to blame the Tories dire performance and Reform losing on Muslims....

I have worked as an election monitor - your are not allowed to report any observations while the polls are open, it is interference in the process. Also I have frequently observed 'family voting' where the polling staff have not done anything, in fact not even appeared to notice.

It should also be pointed out that the monitors will have had no idea who this people were voting for so any attempt by one party to make political capital out of it is meaningless.

Mothin Ali fronted a lot of the campaign material.

I don’t care about the fluffy green stuff.

l care about the things you deride.

@1dayatatime you make very interesting points. I don't know why the left is so blind to atrocities and oppression in other countries and just keeps the focus on Israel.

So he doesn’t have one? Straight to ‘Green’ politics is it? Not as ‘cultured’ as PP may have hoped.

Why wouldn’t Muslims vote for a woman in your view?

I'm not sure now, based on the results, that Burnham would have won - Labour came a very poor third.

I think those who were always going to vote Reform would still have done so, with maybe a few potential Greens sticking with Labour if he'd been the candidate.

The loss still sits with Starmer though due to his uselessness as a PM.

All I know is if there was a General Election tomorrow I would struggle with picking a party.
Local elections coming up and I'm genuinely concerned that Reform will get in so will probably vote Labour to stop them. I've always voted but it's getting to the point of I don't want to vote for any of them!

Most people couldn't pick their local MP out in a line up.

I usually like your posts, even if i don't always agree.

But on this, no, not at all.

Its about right and wrong, the Hamas slaughter, is/was evil as is their ideology BUT killing 10s of 1000s of innocent people because a relative minority murdered is not justified.

Neither is the annexing of the West Bank, where murder and ethnic cleansing is happening without a terrorist attack and where the West does nothing and pro Israeli lobby cheer.

Plus, it will guarantee more and even bloodier attacks from whatever replaces Hamas, both in Israel and across the West.

I live in the area and the voting division has everything to do with politics and very little to do with the economy. Both areas are poor/below average income.

The difference is that Denton is occupied by people who are less educated and more likely to be racist or backwards-looking, i.e. typical Brexit/Reform voters.

The Gorton/Longsight side is a mix of educated young people and Labour voters who are fed up of the current government for a wide range of reasons.

As someone who lives in the local area, I'm glad the Greens have won. I would have felt dirty, embarrassed and sullied if we had voted in a Reform MP.

Apparently Hannah Spencer entered politics in order to call for a ban on dog racing (she keeps rescued greyhounds) which is very commendable, but she and the Greens have reversed their policy of calling for a ban on hideously inhumane ritual slaughter. The Greens are a captured party, I don't know why anyone on the left is revelling in this result.

Even so the vast majority voted for left leaning parties.

Given the election was held against a background of the rise of a far right party with massive financial resources and seemingly unlimited access to the media, I still think that is heartening.

Not revelling as such, just pleased that Reform didn't win

You are being naïve if you don't acknowledge that Muslim women due to their religion are under more pressure & expectation to obey their husbands than the average white woman.

If Gaza wasn't a big factor then why did Green Party activists in Gorton and Denton ran an Urdu-language campaign targeting Muslim voters, criticising Labour and Reform over Gaza?

Why did the Green campaign leaflets feature candidate Hannah Spencer wearing a red and black keffiyeh while posing in front of a mosque?

Written in Urdu, the pamphlet calls for voters to: ‘Push the falling walls one more time. Labour must be punished for Gaza. Reform must be defeated and Green must be voted for. Vote for the Green party for a strong Muslim voice.’

Agreed, I'm not revelling but pleased and relieved.

We're all heartened then! I'm delighted that Starmer has had the kicking he deserves - losing one of his top safe seats.

For a long time I didn't either, but I'm starting to think the obvious answer is the correct one.

So it’s an uneducated area but the Greens won?