NHS/Term-time contract

[JokerOfTwo]

Hello,

Has anyone successfully been given a term time only contract from the NHS?

Background: currently on my 2nd Maternity leave, will return in October (officially ends 3rd week of August but using leave to extend) I work in a specialist role as a band 6 - the team is made up of 6’s/7’s/8’s. I currently work full time (37.5) but would like to drop to 31.5 (this isn’t a problem) it’s a Monday - Friday job.

My eldest DC will start school in September, and my leave will just not cover the school holidays, my husband works for the police (he’s not a police officer) but due to strict operational requirements, chronic staffing shortages, him having “on call” shifts and high demand during peak times leave requests can easily/often be declined.

My mum works full time (lives 3+ hours an away) and In-laws have made it politely clear they don’t not want to be child care for several weeks a year.

I’ve looked at/asked about holiday camps for the top 3 schools I’ve applied & they all just seem a bit flimsy, they start at 9am finish at 3, only run Mon - Thurs, not available every break & the waiting lists are long, this just seems like a disaster waiting to happen to rely on these when I just don’t have the back up if it falls through.

On top of this even though I’ll have to take this time off work my youngest will be in private nursery (contracted to 51 weeks a year) so I’ll be paying for him to attend even when he doesn’t need to (because I’ll be off work) whereas if I put him the school nursery he’ll have the same time off as eldest & it’ll save me £400 a month, this is my average bill currently with a child in nursery even with “30 hours free”

Please note I’ve not spoken to my ward manager/matron about this, so really looking for advice on approaching the situation.

And as tempting as it is to say things like “work it out between you and other mums” or “I made it work back in the day” I’m really just wanting advice on if people have been granted it & what were the circumstances.

Not everybody has the same support systems or local/community support in place as others.

So the NHS must bend over to accommodate you while you view your husband’s job as untouchable. You work in a NHS service that can function without you for 6 weeks school summer hols? Hmm ok.

It’s a Hybrid type service, we are physically based in the hospital, but our provision is mainly servicing primary care referrals.

My DH is great and is also exploring all the ways we can attempt to manage childcare when the eldest starts school.

I don’t run the service single handedly, I’m part of a team.

You seem angry, maybe you got a shit time when it came to flexibility & childcare, and I’m truly sorry if that happened to you.

And the NHS bends over backwards for people all the time, usually those that don’t deserve it… you only have to interview someone on a redeployment list to see that.

I changed my hours in NHS when children were young and moved to p/t 19 hours per week, one long shift every weekend and one early ( on ward) when DP did drop off. This was on ITU and worked, well before went Mon to Fri in school nursing p/t 30 hrs, ( not term time only)but had to meticulously plan AL. Also picked up some agency work. My main advice would be don’t hand in notice to NHS as such and try and keep any NHS contract going if you can, for pension purposes.. might seem far away now and it probably is, but I am so thankful I carried on with multiple changes of hours and roles, still keeping the contract going and it’s paid off now kids are older and I’m lucky enough to be old enough (!) to have been able to partially retire and take some pension now.

Hi thanks for your reply, when you transitioned to schools nursing were you an adult nurse?

‘On call’ applies to many jobs.

My DH is a Director (Education and Young People) with the council. He is on call to command emergency situations, should they arise.

Not used often, as emergency situations, thankfully don’t happen often, but has to be ready to take charge of anything that might happen ( flooding, fire, large scale accident etc).
Has to be contactable and within easy, quick travel. Can’t have a drink or be involved in anything where he couldn’t leave (performing in amdram, some sports etc).

Yeah “on calls” are common in some areas of employment & are often integrated into people’s salaries with call out payments on top, I think the commenter misunderstood how “on calls” work & I think she/he thought whenever you are not in work you are “on call” which would be insane.

To be fair the OP is in an extremely niche role/ service! The NHS is well known for cutting off its nose to spite it’s face in terms of recruitment and retention ….not least the issue with graduating midwives/ nurses/ ahp’s / medics being unable to find first posts whilst we lament the challenge of recruiting experienced staff and continue the unethical practise of poaching overseas trained clinicians. Though I would agree it is a classic example of the parent in the “girl career” needing to find the workaround around rather than the parent in the “boy career”.

Thank you, it is a niche role, it’s difficult to recruit into as a certain set of skills are required, we are a service thats commissioned when a large Trust requires a specific accreditation, i.e we are bonus to the directorate.

The only workaround for DH would be to leave his role, his contract requires full time and on-calls, he’s got free will of course and could leave and find another job but he loves it, as do I - I love my job I’d be sad to leave, but the realistic factor is I have the ability to at least ask for some flexibility he doesn’t. If he was in my job he’d be asking for the contract change.

OP I think you’ve had some v good advice here from lots of posters. Your replies are becoming quite defensive but people are just pointing out different possibilities and what questions your trust may ask you. I appreciate you see this as workable, from the outside it doesn’t look as straightforward as it may from your perspective.

I do think your husband needs to be thinking as broadly and creatively as you are, because it is your career and earning power that will be affected by this decision. You are talking about making huge changes in your working life, and I appreciate how difficult things are logistically, but this is not just your problem to solve. I think he needs to be less rigid about his job and prioritise the children like you are. For what it’s worth I’m speaking from experience - I sacrificed career opportunities for my children; my husband’s career was untouched.

I’m not sure if it’s defensiveness or I’m just very comfortable in what my role is & feel confident in commenting on it’s flexibility, why are women portrayed as angry when actually I’m just secure in the knowledge of what my work requires.

I don’t think I’d be called defensive if I was a man answering the questions that have been given me.

Ive enjoyed reading the replies, it’s given me lots of feedback and potential scenarios I may face when discussing this with work.

Often on posts like this you have people commenting who skim read the OP and don’t look at the replies… which has happened when people have told me to just use holiday clubs/parents/unpaid parental leave

DH and I are working together to create a solution, but sometime in life there will people in jobs that are more flexible than others, it’s completely logical for me to ask for the flexibility given my employer.

The only department I can think where this might work is something like the Lymphoedema Clinic where they stop new referrals for things like mat leave. Which seems weird to me when patients are out there needing support and an NHS service can just stop and start as it sees fit.
I think if you are in a service like this, you’ve got a reasonable chance of term time working being agreed and you won’t know if you don’t try, so definitely put a case together and ask.

Hi, coincidentally a friend works as a Lymphoedema CNS and she manages her own work load as well, not sure what they did with her patients on Mat leave, but again no one covered her position when she was off and she doesn’t seem to be the pariah of the team since her return - so could assume there’s no resentment to them possibly managing her patients when she was on leave if that was the case - I’ll have to ask.

This is such a typical Mumsnet thread!

OP: Here are the facts but I have one very specific question that I would appreciate you answering.

Mumsnet: Are you sure that those are the facts? Why aren’t you doing it like this? Are you being selfish/unreasonable/causing societal harm by requesting this? Why can’t your DH can do it?

OP: These are the reasons why X, Y and Z do not apply, as explained in my OP

Mumsnet: We don’t believe you and have been working in this field for umpteen years.

OP: retreats from Mumsnet, exhausted but perhaps able to salvage a couple of useful tips to take away…

I work for the NHS on a permanent term time only contract. I am in the Speech and Language team though, not hospital based, so it might depend on your role. Several of my team work term time only, some all year round (the team ranges from B3/4/5/6/7s). I started the role on these terms though, not asked to change from a different contract so wouldn’t know if that makes a difference as well. Our head of service (B8a) works term time only too.

It was the “NHS bending over backwards” that killed me off 😆

I’m 37 & have been qualified for nearly 16 years, started my training in the NHS at 18 (16 if you count NHS cadets) but yeah it’s the NHS bending over backwards for me not me busting my butt: unpaid OT, lates, weekends, Christmases, unsafe staffing ratios, mentoring multiple students, violent patients, conferences (in my own time) etc, but yeah, I’m just delusional and all this time it’s the NHS bending over backwards for me.

Side note, MN would have you think the NHS is made up of the gravy train crew with “very generous” annual leave, but truthfully most people who work for the NHS are rational, kind & don’t care what others do.

Thank you, seems to be an ongoing theme for SALT…. Maybe it’s the most progressive/family centred AHP to be.

In the short term can you go back in September rather than October so you can take half term and Christmas (and maybe some days if ill children).

@JokerOfTwo Hello, yes adult trained, did do the SCPHN course ( the one for school nurses and HVs) and did part time over 2 years, which was a bit of a battle to get agreed, but worked out well and you are paid, prob a B5 rate tho, and then B6 on passing. Still work with YP in different role, but not school nursing.

Also, do you have any private schools nearby? We used them for holiday childcare, they were 8-6 like nursery not 9.30-2.30 like some places.

School health teams and health visiting may be the best options.