Mumsnetters voting Reform

[Illjustplayostrich]

Mumsnet mothers have always leaned Labour. Now Reform is ahead

https://www.thetimes.com/article/dbd39087-465c-4587-9eaa-292606ffb775?shareToken=a99daa444e8bc0f9444cca2bf01f3851

I'm slightly startled by this. I'm a centrist, slightly more right leaning perhaps but frankly I'm open to any government who will get a firm grip on the public finances and go about growing the economy in a sustainable way. My impression of this site is that it's definitely more left leaning and and Reform enthusiasts tend to get shouted down. Personally, I think we should be talking about them a lot more as it's highly likely they will form part of the next government.

My impression is that they are promising the earth but don't have people with the necessary skill set to make that happen. I really worry that they will get voted in and find out that they can't fix all the problems within 18 months, leading to yet more disillusionment amongst voters.

"...starting to strain..."?
We're WAY past that point.

Eh? I literally said that I understood how conditions helped for Trump, etc. to thrive - although that in no way is the full picture. I definitely don’t think these things happen in a vacuum: I hate it and despise their politics, but I understand how we got here.

What I also see are the same people who voted for Brexit, thought Johnson was an entertaining maverick, who are now going for Reform, who voted for a vague abstract idea about ‘something different - a change - a protest’ which has screwed us all over. I also see people saying racist things and supporting people on the far-right, outraged at being called racist or far-right. A bit like when the rioters were blaming ‘two-tier Keir’ for them looting Greggs and hurling bricks at police officers.

Probably true, although it could get worse. On one side is total clampdown on citizens the other citizens get politicians to do as wanted and the old systems are out.

We’ve a fair way to go I reckon

You'll find the vast majority didn't support the riots, despite the white heat after Southport. Interestingly, there were riots at Harehills just before, the left bent over backwards not to criticize those.
Asylum hotels demos within reason haven't broken out into general misbehaviour, although some scenes have been ugly.
Stiff sentences after Southport had their effect.
Has Starmer learnt? Does he even begin to understand anger in the country?
I don't doubt had Sunak won in 2024, he'd be taking the brunt.
Even now, Starmer is planning new council housing for migrants.
Yet he's happy to spread the far right epithet to anyone who's opposed because they're for migrants.
The left will not learn. They only choose to try and teach. Try to teach citizens to be "better" people. It's a sickness with the blank slate atheist socialist creed.
And so a very big part of Middle Britain is saying "enough". And that if Labour are gonna call them far right for opposing illegal migration or trans ideology etc, they'll vote for what they're being told is a far right party.

Yes...3.5 years to the GE.

It's really interesting to read all these responses from long term Mumsnet terms who have turned to Reform. They are so knowledgeable of the details. Possibly more informed than Nigel himself.
I was just expecting many long term names to be saying how Nigel is the light and the way.
Good to read.

I have a bit of Anecdata with this thread after speaking with my window cleaner last night. He is certainly ticking all the boxes. He works hard, runs an effective business and supports his family. He has a severely disabled daughter who will never work and never has.

This man is a natural conservative. He is a sole trader - and under pressure. He is losing local contacts with the Conservative council under efficiencies. His daughter is repeatedly pulled back in to have her disability benefits reassessed. She has severe brain damage. When this happens he has to be patronized by the officials who are “assessing” even though he’s been told many times it should not happen again.

And he is extremely angry about immigration. He does not understand why the limitations in other countries (Spain, Denmark) were not applied here. He does not understand why.

What is really clear is that not much about modern Britain and the state that is working for him. He has given up voting for anyone. He hates the Conservative Party and Labour.

Your use of ‘ugly’ is doing a lot of heavy-lifting.
Although I agree with you, I think most people were against the riots that Farage helped to inflame.

Who are the ‘long term mumsnetters’ you’re referring to?

Can you be specific

The ones who are turning to Reform as that's what the thread is about. The title of the thread. It's good to see all the recognisable names that have shifted over and to understand their reasons why.
I thought it would be more of a Nigel thing like when I dreamt about George W Bush a couple of years ago and woke up loving his twinkling eyes. But there people on this thread who are so informed it's impressive.

I don't think that would be wise as it might stray into breaking Talk guidelines. You wouldn't want Luddite26 to get on the wrong side of mnhq, I'm sure.

I don’t know who you mean when you say ‘recognisable names’. Who are you referring to?

Don’t allude then, why be coy?

The pp doesn’t know who is voting for what, as much as some think so.

Been there done that @PandoraSocks and it was a lonely month before I went grovelling back for the hand slap.
I'm not alluding to anything. Usually on threads you recognise people on similar threads.
I recognise some names on here but not many considering the thread is about all the Mumsnet terms who are voting reform and those who are are very knowledgeable as most people I speak to say they are voting for Nigel or the guy from Mansfield who went from Labour to Tory now Reform big gun (sorry can't remember his name brain fog). I've never heard anybody be so detailed about the policies so good on these Mumsnet long timers for being so engaged. We like it on here a bit of engagement as everyone knows because they've been here for years.

But assessments will go thru the roof when Reform Tory coalition gets to work on the welfare state. Will he vote Reform knowing this?
Just like will those DE social class Clacton residents largely on benefits vote for the man who'll promise to take them away?

Lee Anderson?

Well I’m posting and if you mean you know who I’m voting for I’ll be blunt and say you don’t.

As for ‘regulars’ or ‘recognisable’ or whatever I think many will avoid engaging in this and just vote as they want without censure.

And those who’ve joined the thread who have said more about it are welcome because it’s an open site with more than one view.

As far as migration goes people DID get what they voted for to a certain extent.

The discussion in the lead up to the Brexit referendum (on the news and in my family) was mostly concern about the numbers of migrants coming from the EU, particularly Eastern Europe combined with possible future migrants from Turkey if they joined. One of the big arguements was that a "points based system like Australia has" would be preferable to just letting anyone from the EU in and that leaving the EU would enable the UK to set its own rules. Even Farage was pushing that line. (Of course I am sure there were people who voted Brexit because they didn't want too many brown looking people but that was never well thought through and I don't think the majority of Brexit voters were stupid racists)..

I don't like the Tories but that's one thing they did follow though on. After leaving EU citizens no longer had the same rights to move to the UK to work and instead we introduced a system where rights to move to and work in the UK was assigned to people with skills deemed as being "in demand". That's exactly what lots of people had said they wanted pre Brexit. That's what they got. So instead of EU citizens more people from elsewhere came. And because they were coming from further they were more likely to bring their familes. Plus because quite a lot of jobs were deemed in demand the quotas were quite high for those professions. Good news if you want a roofer. Less good if you are a British roofer. That's what the Boris wave was.

People got what they said they wanted in 2016. If it isn't working out I don't think it's wrong to want to try something different - sometimes 'politics is trial and error and I don't think changing your mind about points based migration makes you stupid. But the narrative of "people are being ignored over migration" is false. What is happening is people like Farage keep moving the goal posts so they can continue to stir up trouble.

I think you'll find Starmer's pig headed refusal to try and make this country work is a bigger match on the petrol can than anything Farage might have to say.
What was his response after Southport? "Adolescence" on a loop in schools, banning sale of pointy ended knives.
It's empty, vacuous, policy-less, virtue signalling, instead of hard headed solutions that fuel anger, plus the drip drip of snide suggestions that a big proportion of voters are far right.

@1984Now
He has given up voting for anyone. He was particularly rude about the Conservatives (and Starmer who he does not like). Mentioned local Conservative clients (politicians) who told him to vote for them. He was incensed at that.

TBH, I felt his anger concealed a fair amount of despair. I cannot comprehend having to justify my child’s benefits over and over again in these circumstances. Over decades.

He was angry about Brexit, how it was done, the rate of immigration and why no one had managed it before we left the EU. He is not a stupid man, but an angry one. Angry people will eventually stop listening to mainstream politicians.

The Southport killer was of African descent but born in Wales to parents who had migrated legally and apparently contributed to society. I am not sure what, in terms of migration laws, could have prevented it. I do think better spending on youth mental health services (this in no way excuses what he did) or more joined up/competent/resources public services could have caught him earlier as he was clearly building up to something. But I always get a bit hmmm when conversations about migration levels shift to crimes committed by people who were born or lived their whole lives here because at that point it starts to look like it's not really JUST concern about migration. And like it might be people saying it's a problem with certain ethnicities/backgrounds. But done in such a way if someone disagrees they can counter "you can't.say it's racist to be concerned about migration" the old Motte and Bailey.

You confirm something I've thought about for a while. The consensus seems to be that we're building to a GE of massive proportions, 1979 on steroids. Maybe even a record turnout (certainly much higher than 2024).
I thought this for a while, but I'm less sure now.
Farage and Polanski may weaponise some motivated turnout, but LOTS of Labour and Tory natural voters may just not turn out on the day (second GE running for poor Tory support).
The malaise in politics engagement is so deep that not even naturally motivational speakers like Farage and Polanski may have an effect.
Your window cleaner is a likely example.
If that's true, we go from a turnout of 59% in 2024 to 55%, or God forbid closer to 50%, in 2029, Farage gets an even more "loveless landslide" than Starmer, or there's a cobbled together left rainbow coalition propping up a crippled Starmer minority Labour administration, our problems escalate.

The argument is more whether we should have a senior ranking officer in the Rwandan civil war in our country, and why the son was caught OVER TEN TIMES in public with knives, made constant threats he was going to kill, and nothing was done about him.
This isn't an argument about migration per se, it's about why we let a war criminal get asylum here, and why politically correct authorities did nothing about a youth screaming clear and present danger caught in school and on the bus with a knife repeatedly.
This is what the left just do not understand. That there can be people we choose to deny the blessing of citizenship to, and why the criminal justice system is not just unfit for purpose but non existent.
War criminal...come in!
Catch you with a knife and no justice...how about several more times.
For me, Britain is not the country I once knew.
Not because of black and brown faces, the usual accusations from the left.
It's because any semblance of fair play and obligations is gone.
Caught with a knife ten times, nothing happens.
Men allowed in women's spaces, nothing happens.
Get burgled repeatedly, nothing happens.
Do 22mph in a 20mph zone, 3 points on your licence.
Argue as a female nurse of a male doctor in your changing room, all Hell breaks loose.

@1984Now - maybe. Notably he didn’t mention Reform. I live in a Conservative area (very!) and Reform are not liked by the locals. I think people are weary of the promises made by politicians full stop. They do not believe them, and Reform’s “big policies” are regarded with suspicion.

What they do want is to be listened to. And I suspect most in my area are centrists who do not find any kind of extreme ideas attractive, excepting one area which is covered in England flags. Even then when you look at this place it is desperate.

You may be right on turnout because I don’t think most people are attracted to Reform but their voters will be highly motivated. As it is, you can see council tax going up by maximum amounts in Reform led councils despite the promises. They cannot deliver either.

On criminal justice I just have to say it is so basic. It needs money. Lots of it, from the police upwards. The system is devastated. It is one of the worst things the Tories did. Criminal justice is like the health service. You have to fund it. As it is there will be even further cuts under this government.

You don’t need new laws. You need enforcement which means police. It means properly paid prosecutors and defence teams and rehabilitation as well as punishment. We do know how to do it well. But doing it on the cheap will never work.