When a ill relative says "don't visit" at what point would you ignore that?

[DyslexicPoster]

Not me and not my choice so in this case I will not be ignoring their wishes at all.

Mil has had a stroke. Yesterday told dh not to come up until he knew more. Mil has got worse over night. Dh won't go up unless he's cleared it with his dad. But he will go regardless of wishes at some point if things get much worse. At what point, I don't know as we hoping for the best right now.

Just wondering where it comes a point where you say "look dad, mums not going to be bouncing fit next week I want to see her with my own eyes"

If it was my mum in hospital I'd go straight away whatever she said. Things are not looking fantastic but not hideous either. Right now. Would only go against wishes if it was utterly bleak? Or respect wishes at all costs? If it was your parent and you was on good terms?

A previous relative we have done this for and didn't see them at all as was their wish. But you don't get closer than sibling, parent, child.

It's very much all being said because they don't want to put dh out. Not because he isn't welcome. His dad is totally burnt out by the sound of things.

Had this with gran. We was only asked to go once she had lost consciousness and on EOL pathway.

But it isn't the patient who's saying this. It's the husband, and we don't know if his gatekeeping is what OP's MIL wants.

If I’m honest, I would be offering your Dh a lift up there and finding him a place to stay/short term rent very near the hospital. I’m aware that I’m lucky my work would let me take a day’s carers leave.

Then he can just say to his dad, ‘I’m a few minutes away for a couple of weeks and I’d really like to pop in, the grandchildren are worried and would like an update.’

I work for a team on the stroke pathway. This is going to be a marathon not a sprint, but tbh I think both his dad and his mum will be able to recover better with family support.

I would go yesterday! A few years back my mum was in a coma and for a few days the doctors thought she would die as she didn’t respond to medicine and was getting worse. I was flooded with messages from family and friends and only replied every day or so as my brain was in crisis management mode where I was only focused on my mum and what she needed. A handful of people were very demanding and stressing me out by demanding updates when there was nothing really new. I was being very very positive and telling everyone and myself that it would all be okay and told the doctors that they didn’t know my mum when they told me they thought she wouldn’t make it. I was right but I could have easily have been wrong - my crisis management style is going into organisational mode, super positive, everything is going to be fine, focus on paperwork and organising logistics, no sad thoughts that will make me lose focus. Some relatives booked to visit without asking me but they booked into a hotel and honestly it was great because I then had support and had some relief and was also felt more able to actually grieve and allow myself to be upset.

Your FIL might be in super positive crisis management mode and forcing himself not to think about any negative possibilities. You should absolutely go but stay in a hotel or airbnb so he doesn’t have an extra stress of hosting people at a time of stress. Go and bring food, make him cups of tea, see what they both need! Your FIL will need support too as he is currently doing it all alone and is likely so incredibly stressed and pushing down his fears.

Physio after a stroke is usually a long affair, my friend’s dad was getting physio for almost a year after his and while he has mostly recovered mentally and physically he never went back to 100%. His wife can no longer go away for a weekend without someone being there as he is a but weak now and needs help with some things, they also had to get a cleaner as he can’t manage any housework or anything strenuous. They are likely just at the start of a long road to recovery and have more hard moments ahead of them.

The thing I was worried about when I first posted was I feared mil was dieing. So your not cleared to go when your being told its very serious by fil. At what point do you go? Do you respect that up to or even for the funeral? If your not needed at any point what does that say about the entire parent / child relationship? Knowing your dad blocked you seeing your critically ill mum? Or your mum.didnt want you there then passed away. We don't know.

I'm hoping at best fil is in crisis mode rather than genuinely not wanting his son there. If it's the latter the relationship will never recover. If he genuinely refuses support on what lies ahead then that sends a clear message we can't unsee.

I honestly don't/ can't belive it's that. But it's a very depressing thought.

I'm glad your DH will visit his ailing mother.

She will be happy to see him and DH can assess whether his father will welcome some support.

Yes I think it's for the best. The plan is to go to their home. Then from their ask fil again if he can see mum. If fil says no go from there.

He's going on his own after dropping the eldest at uni so there's no added ( now adult) grandchild. The oldest kids know. Keeping it all from the youngest as what can we say anyway? We don't know enough to say anything.

If she can't walk she won't safely manage stairs and so she'll be either stuck upstairs in the house (near the loo?) or they'll need to sort out a bed and commode downstairs (if no downstairs loo/shower room). It all sounds so passive tbh and sadly I know from family experience that someone needs to advocate for MILs best interests (your DH if FIL is useless) and make sure things are in place for her care/support at home when she's discharged. Sounds like they're very much sticking their heads in the sand about how long it'll take for her recovery (which may not ever get back to where she was prestroke) and the physical/emotional support PIL will both need.

Your DH needs to investigate

I’ve been in that position too and I hope if I ever am discharged from hospital when I’m older, I’ll have someone advocate for me.

Sadly if FIL is saying he’ll do all of the care, then SS and the Hospital will let him, even if he doesn’t fully understand the implications of what he’s saying.

And I do understand those saying respect their privacy but in this case I think the DH in question really does need to go to his DP’s home and check that his DF is coping as well as he says he is.

Your DH might need to check an OT referral has gone through. His mum might need grab rails, stairlift etc. If your FIL doesn't seem on top of things now then it will only get worse once she's home.

Nor me. My FIL downplayed any illness MIL had, even when she was clearly dying when we visited. I didn’t trust him one bit, an incredibly selfish man who could only think of himself.
Sadly DH is of similar ilk 🤬🙄

I'm still surprised that dh hasn't visited if im honest. If his dad did take massive offence at his son turning up I'd be happier knowing I did all I could and the relationship was over tbh.

I think fil is in denial and dh is just happy taking that as gospel too as it's more comfortable than reality. Neither dh or fil I think grasp the tissue dies when starved of oxygen and brain cells don't regenerate like a toenail. Yes you can form new pathways and learn to compensate but dead brain cells do not recover or grow back. However it's not the right time either to lecture them ( I have a Biology degree and I do tend want to know facts when I see this isn't the norm. People want hope, comfort and to varrying degrees not reality)

Somewhere deep down inside I do have to wonder if any of them care about other after this it's so unlike what I would do. If my sister was critically ill I would ignore my bil. I'd just need ten minutes and be told to fuck off than never say goodbye to someone I loved. My kids, my sibling. My parents. Rules of stiff upper lip can go to hell. Anyone else? Absolutely I'd respect it.

But I know my kids, my sister and my parents would all want me there. I even said months ago to my sister if her dog died and she told me she didn't want to see anyone I would leave it a few days then she could tell me to piss off to my face. She agreed it's what you do. Turn up. Make some tea. See with your own eyes and leave before your tea gets cold if you misjudged it.

What's?worse? A well ment mistake with your parent or apathy?

I'm trying to.put it to the back of mind until he sees her. I can't do anything or help any of them right now. I also suspect if they do need support to cope we won't be able to anyway.

Personally I'd go to the hospital and ask the ward staff to ask mum if she wants to see him. If he sees dad first, he's likely to be blocked from seeing her. It's not for his dad to decide for his mum.

And in the unlikely event that his mum doesn't want to see him, at least he'll probably be able to get some information on her condition from them.

Well, each to their own, but if anyone turns up in my dying days, I'll be summoning up what little energy I might have and telling them to get out. The "sitting round the bedside" model of a Dickensian novel is not going to happen when I die!

But she isn't dieing. At what point can he go now? When she is fully recovered? When she is on top form? What if she never gets back to top form?

Unfortunately in another shit turn of events fil has said she can go home. He is not convinced this is for the best.

She couldn't walk without falling yesterday in front of physio. Now today they have said she is confident on stairs.

Fil said the bleed has not stopped but stroke and neuro team.both said that's fine to go home bleeding.

Fil asked when he should worry - was told when she unconscious and un able to be woken. Or so confused she doesn't know who he is. Until that point don't call for help. There's no OT assessment of the home and there is nothing further planned.

I would turn up to wherever she is with something for them (milk, teabags or some flowers etc) this would be an excuse to either leave them there or if you felt it necessary and appropriate push your way in (if you see what I mean).
My dad who is in his 70’s has done something similar in a bad situation so pretended to be driving by and needed a wee urgently, once I was in I was able to help him out with everything but had I kept texting him he would have said no don’t come.

Just go down, I don't know why you are waiting for the worst to happen before you visit, if she is ok atleast you can see her and wish her well and have your hearts at ease, and if she's not doing well, then seeing her before she's unconscious or dead is surely better.
Please stop hesitating just go

It doesn't sound like a safe discharge to me. If it were my DM I'd be kicking up a stink! Is your DH going to pop in and see how they're coping when she's home?

Keep on trying to ring fil but he won't answer. But he is chatting on WhatsApp and now agreed that we cab involved to try to block the discharge and seems relived now and grateful for the help.

Right now I feel like going there myself. Hopefully we can block the discharge in time.

Wtf?? Is there going to be a package of care?

Honestly, can you both go up there? I have been the useless passive/shocked relative at times and some other relatives turning up and at least asking questions can shake the passive one out of their mindset.

This is an absolute disaster in the making. I would head straight over there tomorrow and be telling the hospital she cannot be discharged without a proper assessment. Say that FIL is going away for an indefinite short break if need be to buy you time so there’ll be no one home to discharge her to.
He may not want you there but guess who’ll be first port of call at some ungodly hour when the first fall occurs or crisis hits.

Spoken to fil and mil on face time tonight. We drafted a letter to pals which he sent and ccd us in.

I think from the sounds of it he has been pushing all along but not getting satisfactory answers. But this was the last straw to accept help so we will be going up now. Dh said in the letter it's unacceptable to discharge his mum and that's gone to pals as is from dh and his dad.

Mil seems happy but definitely not herself but such a relief to see her smiling. Fil is bending over backwards trying to help her as i knew he would, but it's such a relief to see them both firsthand.

So while this is a bad development we all know we won't leave any stone unturned which is relief. Wish we had gone sooner but as fil said, hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Thanks for keeping me sane

I wouldn’t take any risks. I would go asap!

Have you spoken to the Discharge Clerk yet? The phrase i mentioned before “this sounds like an unsafe discharge” usually helps. Make sure you mention that to Pals as well if that’s the route you’re taking.

Hospitals don’t like readmissions so will usually react to that phrase.

I had a stroke 21 months ago, mine was from a blood clot, ct, mri, physio, ot all put in place, they took it very serious as they should.
Put on highest dose blood thinners clopidogrel, highest dose rampiril, ezetimbe, high dose atorvastatin,
Still struggling from effects of the stroke with a very weak right side.
I was safety netted and am constantly having medication reviews and blood pressure checks.
All this is done to prevent a second stroke which could be catastrophic.
All this for me is done by an nhs trust which is failing but my care has been second to none.

please advocate for your Mil, she should be safety netted in every which way.

obviously every stroke is different