Assisted Dying Bill passed by slim majority

[smallglassbottle]

https://news.sky.com/story/politics-latest-starmer-assisted-dying-trump-israel-iran-labour-12593360

There was a documentary a few years ago that is still online called Simon’s Choice, about a middle-aged man with MND who wants to go to Dignitas. His wife is very against it, right up until he tries to kill himself because he’s so desperate. It’s a very sad watch but also quite uplifting in a way as he did get the death he wanted. But that he felt so desperate he tried to kill himself in a way that obviously was much less effective and much more traumatic for everyone was very difficult to watch.

It is worth a watch if you can find it, because it talks a lot about that balance between not wanting to be a ‘burden’ and doing it before you are ready but also not letting things go to the extent terminally ill people are trying to end their lives at home by hanging, overdoes and other methods that often don’t work and/or cause great distress to families.

I'm glad this has passed hopefully it will come through the house of lords. I and my Sisters have Huntingtons disease and I will definitely want to end my life before I get too bad.

For those that know more than me - is it unusual for such a significant piece of legislation to be passed via a private members bill.

I also saw the yes margin was smaller then the count of those did not vote. I hope they had a very good reason not to vote. I would judge my mp if had not voted. I am foe this but I don't think this was the right bill.

I really really hope this Bill gets passed. Progress to die with dignity when we choose

Has anyone actually experienced good palliative care? Genuine question. I have not seen it in my lifetime. Everyone I have known who has died has experienced a lot of pain and distress. I would like to think this is the exception to the rule. But when you see it time and time again, no thanks.

What a hypocritical stance. You are for legal euthanasia and people having a choice, yet you are against people having the choice to naturally end their days in a caring and loving hospice or 'religious' care home of their choosing. So folk are only allowed to make the choice of your choice - beautifully illustrating just one of the dangers of this bill: coercion and control by others.

These are religious homes and hospices who requested an exemption.
Why would they be imposing their beliefs on others.

Well said

Good. I think it’s right that they are being very cautious about wording and how it will be implemented but ultimately I agree with people having the right to decide how their life ends when that is an option. done right it could make the death process much comfier for the patient and their loved ones.

Not if you're not terminally ill but still want to kill yourself.

Or go through the panel in the UK and get turned down.

So then we get to the different gradations of suffering.

BBC reporter Hugh Pym on radio just now said Hospice UK are now Officially Concerned about the implications of the Bill. There's already hundreds of ppl in the UK that have unalived themselves courtesy of certain websites by the way.

My mum and aunt both stayed in a Hospice for end of life care and it was wonderful.
They even made their favourite treats themselves……goody for my mum
Had rooms for family to stay in as we lived far away
They were comfortable and pain free
Turned the bed to face the French doors near the moment of death

They were wonderful

This is a mandate to murder.

If it passes, vulnerable people are going to find themselves under pressure to sign up to be killed.

Mumsnet will start having threads in a few years where women bitch that older people in council houses are daring to keep on breathing, entry level employees will be whining about older employees blocking their promotion by being alive, complaints that they are going to lose their inheritance because their parents just won't die already or whinging about them daring to live long enough to claim their pensions when that money could be used on younger people and this will be the start of it.

Those who support this now will suddenly find hair dye and Botox won't hide their age well enough and they are being looked at as the dead weight in society.

Stuff like this always suffers from mission creep.

Every MP who voted for this bill is a murderer.

I hope you never watch your father vomiting shit for weeks before dying in agony.

Anyway, no one is going to be making patients feel it would be better for their families if they end their life, just as no one is currently making patients feel their should have an abortion because it would be better for their boyfriend. except plenty of women are pressured into abortions by medical professionals. Especially in the case of disability.

I know several women who have been advised to terminate pregnancies even if the scan has shown a high instance of downs - before they’ve even had an amnio.

A friend of mine had a 1/10 chance on the scan and the me essentially said that they could book her in for termination the following week, because with such high results amino was unlikely to be a positive.

She had the amnio, and the baby was absolutely fine.

But anyone who hasn’t seen the amount of pressure that is applied to terminate disability before birth has lived a sheltered life.

This about sums up where I am, and I say that as the close relative of someone with a terminal condition and another person who is on the autistic spectrum and has a serious chronic health problem which is currently not curable.

What a load of shite.

Instead of advocating for high-quality palliative care, some prefer the 'cheap and convenient' option of euthanasia—as if life itself were a problem to be eliminated. What does that say about the value we place on human life?

For those in positions of power, and others who are pushing this agenda, it often comes down to money and the desire for an easier life. After all, waiting with someone at the end of life isn't easy—or comfortable. But compassion shouldn't be replaced by convenience.

The love of money truly is the root of all evil—whether it’s about boosting government coffers, saving cash on staffing and excellent palliative care, or family hastening a premature inheritance.

My Grandfather had amazing palliative care both in hospice and then at home (his choice) but that didn’t stop him suffering and I know his personal preference when he was at the point he knew death was imminent would have been to be able to peacefully end his life rather than spending the last couple of weeks in and out of consciousness and either dosed up on pain drugs or in agony.

Well, yes. It's a crying shame that we don't have any hospices funded by the NHS or other public funding. I am an atheist but I am very grateful that people with religious belief have set up hospices.

This from 2020 in Belgium with the women having to be held down by her family to be euthanased
is, I suspect, one of the many incidents you are thinking of @AnyoneWhoHasAHeart

People should be allowed to change their mind, but how can they if they have dementia or Alzheimer’s. Others can make the decision for them.
It’s a slippery slope!

This bill is the ultimate example of the extreme individualism that is prevalent in UK society - I want what I want and I don't care if that makes life more dangerous for you.

If you have advanced dementia or Alzheimer’s how on earth is life worth living? You would put a dog down. Why do we put animals down? We
love them and don’t want them to suffer. It’s just not fair to expect people to live with these conditions.

It's not an official government bill though. It's a private members bill by Kim Ledbeater.

The Health Secretary said last time he'd vote against it BC of the conflict of interest.

She seems to sincerely be motivated by what she sees as being more humane and Wanting To Avoid Traumatic Experiences, but the problem is the risk of coercion, inequalities especially for disabilities being seen as "enabling" a fast track (Liz Carr the disability activist points out the number of ppl, including on here that say if they end up disabled they'd rather kill themselves is a direct inference that those who have life limiting conditions should do the same), and tick box processes putting ppl on a pathway they won't be able to change their mind on once underway

The vast majority don't come under either of those headings. They don't have to worry about being re-elected so can be genuinely objective when they evaluate the wording of this proposed law. I am in favour of this in principle, but we need a well-drafted law.

I don't understand why some people are talking about the government using this as a way to cut benefits payments. This isn't a Labour party proposed law. It's been introduced by an individual MP. It's not government policy, it's down to a free vote in the House of Commons and the House of Lords whether it passes into law.

This bill does not change this situation at all.