Assisted Dying Bill passed by slim majority

[smallglassbottle]

https://news.sky.com/story/politics-latest-starmer-assisted-dying-trump-israel-iran-labour-12593360

Yes !

Everyone who doesn’t believe in it go and spend a week on an eldercare ward especially at night!

Agree
our choice should be on our nhs details along with detailed circumstances and reasons if we agree.

Not updating our details should not be an automatic opt in for assisted dying of course.

Some of us disagree and have watched multiple relatives die.
I think beyond my own experiences to the greater problems that this bill could create given the current state of the nhs and palliative care.

This constant throw away comment from posters on here that those who disagree don’t understand is very short sighted.
I do understand
I don’t think we are in the right place for this bill yet, as a country

Hear! Hear! 👏

I’m very worried about this bill. The lack of safeguards is truly terrifying. As a parent of an autistic child the idea of a bill of this scope with Reform in power is just too much to think about.

Why can't we have adequate safeguards for those who need it?

We can, @Perzival, but even proper safeguards involve spending money, and it seems that to some there's no point since "they were going to die anyway"

You'll no doubt have noticed that many who favour this measure are very quick to brush the safeguarding issues aside, and to me at least that says a great deal

It's being reported that government is now refusing further time for the bill to be further debated in the Lords, meaning it may well fail because there aren't sufficient sessions left for the many proposed amendments to be debated

A pity in some ways, because with sufficient safeguards it perhaps could have been made to work, but with the suggested remit spreading already and the mulish attitude of Leadbeater/Falconer towards any dissent it's probably best that this doesn't go through at the moment

It can’t become law fast enough for me, I haven’t got enough time left for it to be kicked into the long grass for long. It’s a bloody disgrace that the unelected second house can filibuster a bill passed by the Commons so it gets discarded. Hopefully this has taught this government a lesson and the law will be amended to make it impossible for the Lords to do this any more.

The naivety of those spouting to improve palliative care is astonishing, and I can only assume that they haven't had a relative who needed palliative care in the last few years. If I'm ever diagnosed with a terminal illness, I will take my own life as soon as I'm able to spare myself and my family from the horror.

I watched my Dad die from cancer in pain and terror. And he was under a fantastic team/PC Consultant. But they can't make a body metabolise the drugs especially if the liver is failing (Dad had liver cancer). I still have nightmares from watching it. He deserved better. And he would have taken the option of assisted dying.

Thanks for the update

This from Sky News

‘Dr Gordon McDonald, chief executive of Care Not Killing, which is opposed to assisted dying, told Sky News: "This issue is very difficult, and it needs proper scrutiny - that's what the members of the House of Lords have been doing.
"It didn't get proper scrutiny in the House of Commons. It's right that parliaments look at these bills properly and give them due consideration, that's what the House of Lords is doing."

There isn’t enough time to meet the deadline in May and obviously a policy such as this should not be rushed through

It seems to have taken off in Canada

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/canada-likely-to-mark-100000th-maid-death-by-summer

I hope this dreadful bill never sees the light of day. Doctors administering lethal injections. It's like something out of a futuristic horror film.

The bill proposes self-administration of medication, not lethal injection by doctors.

I totally agree with you. My husband had oesophageal cancer which spread to his lungs,liver and spine and despite numerous attempts to get his pain under control nothing worked. He begged to be helped to die . Myself and my kids are still traumatised by what happened at the end of his life. We as a family will never get over it. I understand people who are concerned but for people who have a terminal illness with less than 6 months to live I will continue to campaign for the right to end suffering.

And with family around you

What is a disgrace is that it was pushed through as a private member's bill, by a completely wet behind the ears MP, with legislature written up at breakneck speed and in such a piss poor fashion that it is riddled with safeguarding holes making it completely untenable.

I am no fan of the proposals, and I will argue against it, but this wasn't a fair crack of the whip.

End of life care is highly variable, as seen in the testimonies on Mumsnet, and I have described attempts by the State to bump off my Mum - and my Dad - only to get short shrift from one Mumsnet member who is a social worker, describing me as a conspiracist. On the other hand, I do believe others who are saying that a relative's life and suffering is being needlessly prolonged in a futile way - I don't say they're making it up. One variable is that some of these have mental capacity, so it's almost a case of 'well in that case, you can't have what you want' - almost a Catch-22. If you are articulate enough to plead your case for death, you have mental capacity, so you can't have it. If you don't have mental capacity according to our tick box arrangement, then we can kill you!

The assisted dying bill aimed to close this loophole - the State seems to view it as ludicrous that they can kill of breathing baggages with impunity, even if they and the family don't want them to die, and said breathing baggages have some enjoyment of life anyway, while those in agonising pain and want to die have to have it strung out to the bitter end.

The deaths save money, in either event.

Beautifully put, ThePhantom

I have mixed views about the Lords, but if MPs are determined not to give this very serious matter the care and attention it deserves it's just as well we have an "upper chamber" to step in

It's not that I'm against the concept of assisted dying in principle; what I'm against is the slapdash approach taken and what seems an almost wilful neglect of the importance of safeguards

Really interesting to see it effectively happening.

It looks as if it will survive anyway. According to Falkener in today’s Times:

He said he believed “it's not the end of the road, because the Parliament Act allows it to go through to the next session, and I'm sure that is what will happen”.

The Parliament Act allows for bills backed by the Commons in two successive sessions but rejected by peers to pass into law without Lords approval. Only seven bills have overridden the Lords using the powers under section 2 of the law, including the Hunting Act 2004.

This change in the Law is decades overdue, but I'm not convinced the cowardice of politicians won't scupper it yet again even if it is taken out of the hands of an unelected cadre of geriatrics and religious loons.

What will be interesting is if similar legislation proceeds in Scotland while being struck down in Westminster, because I think we'd again find ourselves in the position of Westminster showing total and utter contempt for devolved democracy, and S35'ing a Bill passed by the Devolved Parliament purely because that would be politically expedient for the in-situ Westminster government.

Regardless, I think it's likely there are a few more years of buck-passing and politicians ignoring the fact they are the only ones with the ability to bring this about before common sense prevails and we afford a dignity to humans we've always given to animals.

The people who object to it on "moral" grounds can go take a hike as far as I'm concerned. For a start, there is nothing morally virtuous in forcing people to endure a long, painful, undignified death, and secondly, if it offends your sensibilities then you can simply choose not to make use of it yourself. There are no cogent reasons for denying someone else that choice simply because you find it personally unpalatable.

The idea this would somehow become a no-holds barred, free-for-all euthanasia spree is typical "slippery slope" nonsense. For a start, it's simple enough to restrict it purely to those with a terminal diagnosis and once there is a threshold reached whereby quality of life is significantly impaired. Nobody is suggesting people should or would be able to have an assisted suicide simply because they've had a few weeks of feeling off-colour. Some of the knicker-wetting and hyperbole is risible and should be called out for the utter garbage it is.

You can be in favour of assisted dying in principle but not support this bill.

@XDownwiththissortofthingX
Not really hyperbole, but this is a Brexit-type discussion now, where you lose points if see the other's pov.
'Terminal diagnosis' - so like Parkinson's, which can't be cured?
Who knows, because euthanasia is already going on and has been for a while, it's just the State wanted to firm it up a bit so it's less 'off the record'. Passive euthanasia is legal in the UK - which was a surprise to me when I read it in the Times in relation to the Assisted Dying Bill; active euthanasia is illegal. But it goes on.

There is zero trust in the British State, it's a shambles right across the board, be it the dirty water of the water companies, the Post Office scandal, the Maternity Wards scandals... why on earth anyone should trust the State with this kind of legislation is beyond me.

The Bill is set to run out of time today in terms of becoming law.