Assisted Dying Bill passed by slim majority

[smallglassbottle]

https://news.sky.com/story/politics-latest-starmer-assisted-dying-trump-israel-iran-labour-12593360

Good to read they are meticulously scrutinising the bill

Very worrying to read

“We also heard that palliative care developments have slowed in legislatures that have introduced AD”

so as we thought. Reduce level of palliative care, families forced into care role, ill people shamed and guilt tripped into killing themselves.

Indeed, @DrPrunesqualer

Some of us said much earlier that a reduction in palliative care would result from this and were roundly blasted for it, and here's an indication of others' experiences in black and white

Doubtless we'll be told that our safeguards would make it all different - or might have done, had they not also been found wanting

Agree
and we know palliative care is very wanting in many areas and has been for a long time
Often just charities carrying it out

Palliative care should have been dealt with before assisted dying was even considered
the fact it wasn’t and still hasn’t speaks volumes

Yes I disagree too. Why should thousands of people die slowly in agony in case someone who was going to die anyway is pushed a few months earlier.

I also don't understand why people are so against this Bill, it is so restrictive. You have to have a prognosis of 6 months.

So people who may live in agony for another 10 years have to put up with it.

someone who was going to die anyway is pushed a few months earlier.

That is called murder. Are you seriously saying murder is fine if it benefits others, @dynamiccactus?

Exactly!!!!

There was a woman on sky news this morning who had brain cancer and was advocating for AD. All i could think about was how easy this woukd make it to do for my son when i'm not here and he's too much trouble to care for.

During covid they put CPDNAR on many people's records who were disabled like my son.

I believe in Canada Autism can be a reason for AD. This is a very scary dark road.

It's not even just about those who were dying anyway, Ddakji - at least, not going on the progession elsewhere, in which the merely "inconvenient" have been included

Of course we'll be told it couldn't possibly happen, and some may even believe that, but I'm afraid I'm not one of them - not when such pitiful safeguards as already existed are being watered down

I also don't understand why people are so against this Bill, it is so restrictive. You have to have a prognosis of 6 months

Edited to add yes, and the promised judicial process which might have overseen that has already been scrapped, @dynamiccactus
I believe such ideas as "a panel of social workers" have been proposed instead, which would be hilarious if it wasn't so frightening

The main issue with this bill is that it is far, far too restrictive.

I believe in Canada Autism can be a reason for AD. This is a very scary dark road.

And depression. And being homeless .

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/oct/17/canada-nonterminal-maid-assisted-death

Yes because we believe in dignity for the dying. Because there are plenty of safeguards despite the nonsense people like to spout. And because we believe that people have a right to the same end of life choices as their own pets...

The people saying there are no safeguards are so unbelievably ill-informed.

If it gets through the Lords - and there are 900 amendments pending - it is THE MOST STRICT version of this type of law in any country globally, in terms of who would be required to sign it off. It's massively restrictive, please read: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cj41j8qlz95o

I hope more than anything the bill will be passed.

I dont expect anyone to help me if my life becomes intolerable but do want access to drugs to end my life in as predictable and civilized manner as possible.

Suicide per se is an ugly unpredictable course of action and I’ve cared for many people for whom it failed and ended up much worse off.

Bodily autonomy should extend To our our whole body, up to and including the right to die. How someone can be pro choice for abortion but not for assisted dying mystifies me.

I'd suggest that depends on whether they're "informing themselves" from a couple of reported sentences or from more in depth reading, Arlanymor

For example, on the "approval by two doctors and a panel including a social worker, a senior legal figure and a psychiatrist", there are already calls for such a panel to be used only in more contentious cases, and that's on top of the proper judicial process we were assured would happen already being scrapped

FWIW I'm one of those who could get behind the principle of this whole thing if there was the least chance of it being properly administered and regulated, but the constant urges to water down any safeguards at all mean I'm just not seeing it

The bill should pass and give us all the chance to die well.

Anyone here against it go and volunteer on the geriatric wards in hospitals and sit by the during lying there for weeks in agony and pain with no food or liquid ( because they can't swallow ) as they slowly die

It's barbaric but people don't know it the horror because they haven't seen it.

I have and it's barbaric.

So improve palliative care, don't just kill people.
One of my many concerns with this bill is that it turns palliative care into a luxury, why not just kill yourself and save the government the money it costs to keep you alive?

@Burntout01 that's what I shall do if it doesn't pass over the years read up about the best way to kill myself and hord.thoae drug

I don't want what I've seen for myself ,it terrifies me. I don't want it for anyone I love and especially not my husband and children .

Then prepare for yourself. That doesn’t mean at a societal level (which is the level at which laws are passed) it should be happening.

Palliative care gets worse in countries that legalise assisted suicide. Much cheaper to kill people than care for them properly.

@CorneliaCupp

No .

It's still horrendous.
And you would need trillions of pounds to ensure each and every dying person had exemplary nurses and care to administer it and care for people.

Slowly dying pumped full of drugs is still dying slowly for weeks and weeks on end waiting for the body to shut down or drown itself in fluid with heart failure.

Barbaric

Go and volunteer on geriatric wards .

@Ddakji

The problem is ...until your there dying you won't understand how horrendous it is ?
Then it's to late and your stuck and so our your relatives .

If people can choose they don't want that what is wrong with that.

Many people won't know or realise the torturous pain they are in for with no end in sight and if they want that fine!

Many people will unwittingly choose the long drawn out unimaginable horror of an NHS death at the mercy of over run nurses !

Let the people who know better ,choose.

I have been on many geriatric wards. Is the care always exemplary? No. Does that therefore mean we should kill the patients? In my opinion, no.

The risks of going down assisted suicide are huge and at a societal level unacceptable. I hope the Lords kill this bill as they can as it’s not a manifesto bill and is a private members bill.

Have you listened to people like Tanni Grey-Thompson or Liz Carr speak? This bill is horrific for disabled people. That it was rushed through the Commons is a disgrace. The Lords have taken their time, thank god, and have tabled 900 amendments. 900!!!! And people want to abolish the Lords.

Upthread someone in favour of this bill said the murder of a few people was acceptable for this bill to pass. How amoral is that.

To those saying suicide is always an option clearly don't have the first clue about the subject.. it's very difficult to carry out, most people are unsuccessful and end up with horrible life changing injuries.
I believe everyone should have the right to die peacefully at any stage of life and for whatever reason! But no of course keep us alive for as long as humanely possible as the government needs taxpayers

think ‘they’ve’ had countless years to improve palliative care, haven’t they!?!
Why shouldn’t people have the option to decide for themselves?

Because it's not just about one person. Passing a law giving me the right to be killed by a doctor makes it less safe for my more vulnerable friends. In my opinion, that price is too high.