Thread 19 Starmer - A Coalition of the Willing

[DuncinToffee]

.https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5276594-thread-18-starmer-all-sides-of-the-house-agree-apart-from-the-trump-bootlickers?page=40&reply=142583752

previous thread

I adore Frances Ryan who is an outspoken and tireless campaigner.

She has written this article in The Guardian

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/mar/10/disabled-people-labour-benefits-system

Dow Jones is now 1000 points down today. Still a couple of hours of trading so things may change, but certainly looking as if Trump's genius bigly economic decisions are just super...

Tesla shares down over 15% and X cyber attacked. Poor Elon.

My heart bleeds.

Apparently the view now is that Trump may cause the US to go into recession... and increase inflation at the same time... hence the recent falls...

& that wont be good for any of us, not least with our higher than any comparable country, borrowing costs.

I am glad I left what was then called Twitter four years ago, lack of use.

It didn't achieve fuck all to be fair! The amount spent in welfare (after 14 years of austerity/cuts) actually went up a lot! Part of that is stuff like Covid. But part of it is the same way that if you "save money" by not repairing a broken roof tile it mysteriously ends up costing more money years later to fix all the water damage in the attic. Obviously the conclusion some would draw is that there has been ridiculous overspending on household maintenance so time to stop cleaning those gutters etc.

I do agree that a large proportion of the population not working isn't sustainable. But you don't deal with it by just cutting without properly investigating why different groups aren't working. If cuts absolutely do need to be made they should be done with a scalpel not an axe. But cuts alone won't fix the problem.

Maybe. Maybe not.

But it looks like Labour has come to the conclusion that welfare is out of control and needs cutting back. As I said, I recognise the problem faced by this government. I’m pleased they’re at least talking about it. And rather like the NHS, it’s easier for Labour than the Tories to make changes and see off the outcry.

Anyway, I strongly doubt that any meaningful dent in public expenditure will result. So those who strongly oppose reductions in welfare can rest easy. We’ll find out at least some of the details tomorrow, apparently.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/mar/10/a-big-thank-you-to-reform-for-the-comic-relief-in-dark-times

Nice one John Crace.

Thank you. I really enjoyed that. Crace never disappoints.

No meaningful dent in public expenditure will result. The bill will keep going up in exactly the same way it has gone up every time we have cut it. With a much more important fact that it will kill people.

Welfare does not need cutting back. It doesn't work so we should stop spending money and resources on it.

Support works. Labour should focus on that. Community prescribing. Gym passes. Organisations that provide support, nurturing, skills and training opportunities. The stuff that used to happen in community centres /FE colleges in the past.

This one small shift in focus would result in the immediate benefit of alleviating stress and distress in people who are disabled or unwell, and their carers. It will prevent panicked calls to GPs, Consultants and other HCPs. And it will put money where it works.

We can't scare people into the workplace but we can scare them into a worse place.

See also pot holes.

I read the Alexander Armstrong stuff upthread. Thanks for the laughs. Twat in a Cravat nails it.

I read the article. What he pays in school fees for one of his children is the same as my annual household income for an adult and 2 children, 1 with SEN.

He proves that money and connections can't buy intelligence, awareness or class. He's lucky he was born rich and posh. They're the only attributes he has.

I missed twat in a cravate. Genius.

I see he jumped on the ‘write a children’s book’ bandwagon last year too.

We have exercise programme prescribing where I live. Last week I suggested to a client in another part of the country that she could ask her GP what's available.

Nothing. Zilch. 😡

Surely easier for the Tories, i'd have thought, its expected from them isn't it & they've a media supportive of them.

Its shameful that the previous Govt allowed Welfare to get out of control like this, much like their failure to boost Defence spend after 2022.

But the point here is that making claims harder and reducing payments, achieves nothing, just pushes people into worse outcomes/different benefits, costing more, as the last 14 years has shown.

People who haven't worked for a v long time, need help and assistance into work, people with health issues need these addressing first, how many of the millions on waiting lists could work if they were treated?

Starmer is sounding more and more like a Tory. I'm sure the welfare budget needs attention, but to what genuine extent? We won't know, because this is about taking off the poor in order to fund wars elsewhere, I think. Appalling really, and probably arrogant, given our relative strength compared to the Trump/Putlin bloc, nasty as they are.

"Surely easier for the Tories, i'd have thought, its expected from them isn't it & they've a media supportive of them."

This is key isn't it @Alexandra2001 ? For a long time whatever the Tories did they would have support from a good chunk of the media. It shows how much they blew it that the media turned against them at the end.

The government (Reeves) has already said that they need to find several million in spending cuts. Thats accepted. So why take the money off those least able to fight back, and in a cost of living crisis. Put the fucking tax up, and get a backbone!

No, I don’t think that’s right. What happens is that the Tories say “we will reform and reduce welfare payments because the balance of support v work isn’t right” or “we will re-structure the NHS” and the left shouts endlessly about cruelty, fat cats and privatisation.

Stories appear all over the internet, the Guardian and the Mirror about people dying, left homeless and so on.

If Labour says the same things there will be much, much less of this clamour.

Basically, the ‘wicked Tories’ trope takes hold in a way that it doesn’t with Labour because the right would tend to support reduction in public spending.

Yes. But nobody that matters.

True. Although the Tories have already killed loads of people so at some point we might end up starting to kill people that matter.

Nope, those papers will still publish these stories, only now the Express 'Mail etc will run them too, as they have done already over WPA.

The issues with the NHS are no small part due to Tory privatisations.

You tell me how community OT, Physio and MH is better delivered by a private company like Livewell in the S/W, using NHS trained staff, on exactly the same T&C's, duplicate back office functions, more management, more directors... shareholders... than if the NHS had just continued to run these services as they used too?

I see suggestions that Musk could fund a new party and dump Reform.

Seems to have put the willies up GBNews.