Middle class but no money

[roopiea]

Does anyone else feel like this?

We would say we are middle class. Both university educated and privately schooled. In our 50s now. Parents had similar professions to us.

We work for the public sector, a teacher and management in local government. We live in a pretty reasonable part of the country. But we still feel we have no money for being in the middle class? We probably earn a combined 80k a year but live in a pretty bog standard 3 bed semi. Have holidays in places like Spain or Greece.

Whereas our neighbours are blue collar workers but seem to have so much more money than us. My best friend and her husband work similar jobs and they have a nicer house and better holidays than us.

I think most people on the thread would probably agree with you though. Recognising that social class still exists as a concept does not mean that we are all counting how many mc boxes we tick or consciously rejecting people's friendship because they come from a different class background. People do tend to gravitate towards others who have things in common with them though.

My point is that people/media etc conflate the 'employer contribution' with Defined Contribution schemes and think that 28% goes to a pot you can turn into cash.

The TPS like many public sector pensions is a defined benefit scheme which are usually considered to be better than DC schemes. I did not conflate anything if you reread my post…

Me. Degrees. Steady jobs. Not big business but important for society. Decent house. Good area. But struggle to pay for more than basic holidays. But tbh we have zero debt

I don't know, I'm very solidly MC (based on upbringing and current life /job/wealth) but have friends from a whole range of different backgrounds. But I do a lot of volunteering in addition to my job so I guess I have mixed quite widely as a result

Trades were mostly looked at as a bit thick and a lot of lads fell into the industry as a way of using their physical skills and dexterity rather than go to university
some of them realise quite quickly that there is money to be made and a decent career
Tony Blair promoted everyone to go to uni on any old course and offered them the world whilst encouraging Eastern European labour as a way of filling the skills shortage and keeping a lid on trades wages
this approach has not worked out well
money has nothing to do with class but it would seem that some that consider themselves to be middle class are irked watching trades out earn them

I have many friends in these professions and they didn't have inherited wealth.

Not really sure why being university educated makes you middle class? I'm university educated and definetely not "middle class". I also run my own business and DH works full time, meaning our combined income isn't bad - but we are still working class😅

Also you both work fairly average paying jobs. An £80k household salary in 2025 isn't a crazy amount of money. The national average salary is currently around £37k, so you're making just above average? How is that middle class? 😅

My ex's dad has a individual take home pay of just above £100,000 (works offshore) and we live in one of the "poorest" regions of the UK, he would still consider himself working class as he works for his money.

I get it OP. DH and I are mid 40s although we do have a reasonable take home pay and fund a child in private school (other at state). Modest suburban house though. We're comfortable on two salaries but our parents had far bigger houses, multiple cars etc on one salary.
However we direct a lot into pensions and I honestly don't think the younger generation consider this. We could also be flashing the cash if I wasn't putting 40% of my salary away for retirement. I see people earning half what we do going on flashy holidays, driving fjashy cars etc and I'm boring enough to think 'I wonder what their pension looks like'. I work in this field though!

Is the issue you feel you have a healfhy income and are not living the lifestyle you want? Surely an income of £80K a year is not enough to privately educate your kids for example? Not if you have more than one child anyway.
Wifh your background, how come you didn't aspire to have higher paid careers?

This is why I always think middle class is a mindset and not a salary. Your “blue collar” neighbours could probably out earn you and you partners combined salary but you still think of them as “working class”, they probably think of themselves as working class.

@Bungrung you said: It’s like the state pension, of course there is no pot! But that's irrelevant when discussing contributions…

The point I'm making, and this was very clear when journalists on times radio were discussing a similar point about a Civil Service job, is that people think the percentage is going to a pot with that persons name on it. And, furthermore, they can draw that cash and buy stuff; spoiler - they cannot.

In fact the contributions of Miss Jones of Class 5 are paying my 66yo partner's teacher's pension.

Are you trolling us? 80k is a fat sum. Even split between two people 40k is still above average and almost twice what a lot of people get.

I’m not a journalist or a radio presenter and never said anything similar to “that people think the percentage is going to a pot with that persons name on it” I said it was a good pension with high contributions!! Or are these things not true?

Inherited wealth also means the ability to attend private school or not have to work during university.

I think you can grasp the point I'm making.

No it’s not, it’s barely above average and whilst it sounds like a lot, it’s not the full picture because that’s the pre tax amount and the buying power of that money has been eroded. It’s also quite low for people of their age. The fact that people earn less, doesn’t make it a fat sum.

I simply wouldn’t be able to survive on 40k a year or a household income of 80k (about 4k a month)

I think you can grasp the point I'm making

That you have difficulty letting things go?

i don’t see 80k combined as a big salary. For one person it would be ok. I’m a mere legal Secretary but earn the equivalent of 64k per year and my husband is a tradie on way more than me. I think you need a fair bit more money for the lifestyle you are hoping for.

80k joint for two mid career graduates isn’t great tbh, when minimum wage is nearly £24k a year.

Sorry I meant that we can only own it due to a large deposit from inheritance. Not because of our salaries.

£40k for 50s seems very low to me, I'm 30s in civil service management on over £70k now, and most teachers I know are on over £40k because they've progressed. Of course your salaries won't be high if you haven't tried to progress in your careers, you have to take on more responsibility to get to the higher salaries, you don't get bonuses just for being middle class I'm afraid.

You need about 150k gross to be in the top 10% and if you include housing costs then you will need more as so many are mortgage free.

My simplified view on class

Working class
People from long term benefit claiming families and/or families who rely on council housing.

Middle Class - people from families who aren't long term benefit claimers or live in council housing.

Upper Class - people with titles, super rich. Large land owners.

Touche; it takes two though.

Just as guilty are those paying cash.