Thread 14 Starmer - The Starmeristas Strike Back

[DuncinToffee]

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https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5224857-thread-13-starmer-facts-are-for-lefties?page=40&reply=141063174

I love House of Games. I’m a bit the same wit( the languages. I’m a whizz at Answer Smash though.

The Pope does not resign very often. I am sure there are better reasons to have people able to choose Latin as a subject.

I could have been a judge if it wasn't for the Latin... an unnecessary barrier to many going to university back in the day, and eliminated from law some time ago, the Civil Service and all other elite institutions precisely because of the advantages it conferred on the privately educated.

It's not useless, but it is used in England to make class distinction without merit. And as the preferred communication mode of Boris Johnson I do not think this is worthy of state funding.

I wasn't aware I was suggesting there weren't. I guess I'm still struggling with this "interesting chat" part of being normal.

Oh well, onward onward.

I do not think this is worthy of state funding.

It’s not a priority but it feels a bit spiteful to end it a year before it was due to finish anyway and halfway through some kids’ exam courses.

Well today a new language model emerged, the idea of UK Public AI.

I'm keen on this because while it is not intelligent, it could improve a lot of decision making and data management. Glad to see Labour making some forward steps (though how are they powering it???)

I do not think this is worthy of state funding.

Which leads to a fierce debate over what is ... especially in a country where education is just another commodity like breakfast cereals, handbags and morals.

I've commented before that to my eye, all the professions are obviously designed to benefit those that work in them well before they might be of any incidental benefit to the poor sods who rely on them.

"Education" as such should really be about giving people (from children onwards) the tools necessary for them to learn whatever they want. However if we did that, it would be much much harder (and more expensive) to shape the masses.

I was hoping for some change in policy and budgets, however small, not a continuation of austerity, £4m wont settle the bond markets...

Yes of course Latin may not seem a great use of public funds but it was funded when these young people made their choices and it should be honoured.

A pp poster mentioned the left's hypocrisy..... you can bet that Phillips would be up in arms had this been done by the Conservatives half way through their courses.

Look I did Classics and Latin. I have never used them. I don't think the state should bother with this stuff. Once upon a time it did because there was a decision that basically said in order to break class barriers in education you had to copy the system that made it. I think that's horseshit. My mother used her Latin to get to university and complete the Guardian crossword.

It is a dying remnant of an education system based on the idea that classical civilisations founded the decision making of the British Empire. Its immediate relevancy passed some time ago.

I am not denying this, i know nothing of Latin...

My point is that if it should end, it should end when the current students studying it have finished their courses.

There are plenty of subjects at GCSE level that could be argued are useless for the vast majority.

The curse of this country is nostalgia I swear. Cutting the Latin budget versus AI! We need to think about the future and educate for that.

My point is that if it should end, it should end when the current students studying it have finished their courses.

I agree with you. This just feels nasty for very little return. It’s another disappointment.

Its not either or, £4m wouldn't pay for the AirCon units for one data centre

Its mean spirited and will doubtless have a huge impact of these kids lives who are going to feel very let down....

It's an attitude. This country still has its head up the Empire. Why the hell were we paying for Latin at state schools?

For 40 schools only

Thats not the point, we are funding it or were, kids from many schools signed up to do a Latin exam, that should be honoured.

Latin is taught widely across Europe, its nothing to do with empire.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5251589-thread-15-starmer-nolite-te-bastardes-carborundorum

If they have a teacher and the resources, could they not just continue.

Ther must have been something in place for 2026 and onwards

Hopefully you’re right and the kids who have started the course will be able to finish it.

Until it produces the "wrong" decisions.

Same as evidence based policy. Everyone is in favour until the evidence runs counter to someones sacred cow. Drugs legislation, for example.

No analysis I have ever seen of Brexit recommended it. It was an ideological decision, not an economic or commercial one.

DS had to sit his computer GCSE's without a proper subject teacher as he had left for a better paid job half way through year 10.

@Alexandra2001 - it was taught in English public schools so that small boys could be incalculated with the wisdom of the ancients and draw inspiration for being the rulers of Empire. Later the teaching of Latin was extended to grammar schools and then comprehensives in the name of inclusivity after it ceased to an actual requirement for university entrance. You could not go to university without Latin O level. It was exclusionary and the mark of the pompous who used it to indicate their quality education. I was extremely pleased when the law eliminated it 30 years and the use of Latin was seen as exclusionary.

It is ridiculous that there are even 40 state schools teaching it. By all means as an extra, but any child is better off doing computer science imo

Ds1 (state school) sat gcse Latin. It's the only GCSE he scraped through and he has little affection for the subject.

But your average Latin teacher is probably the better teacher , tbh. The recruitment and retention crisis in Comp Sci is HUGE.

Enoch Powell - no slouch as a polyglot - took his University exams orally in Latin and Greek if I recall correctly.