Wealthy friend who constantly pleads poverty

[snowynight]

I have a friend who I've known for nearly 20 years. Her husband is on a 6-figure salary and she lives in a house worth £1m +. Financially she doesn't need to work, but she has a full time job she often complains about, but then says she has to earn and build her pension. I'm a single parent who brought up my ds on my own, often genuinely struggling for money and having to stay in stressful jobs that have negatively impacted my health. If I was in her situation I would give up work.

I never reproach her for her good fortune and wouldn't dream of telling her how easy her life is compared to mine, but I find her constant complaints about being hard up tough to take. She seems to go out of her way to deny the difference between us, belittling my genuine difficulties, which she is well aware of.

Otherwise she has been a good friend, and I enjoy her company, but her self pity is making it hard for me to be around her. I don't know why she can't appreciate her good fortune and be grateful for it.

Any perspectives on this very welcome - her constant complaints really get to me!

My DH earns 6 figures and I say that I have to work because living off of him isn’t an option in my eyes. She may feel the same and need some financial independence.

@southlondonmum that's a perfectly valid reason to work, but surely it's a choice rather than a necessity? My friend doesn't say she works to be independent or for her self respect, she says it's because she has to earn to support her DCs.

I don't think she hates her job by the way, she just likes a moan, as we all do.

It's a first world problem issue. I think she maybe does this to appear more relatable but it is tone deaf and would piss me off if I were you.

My friend doesn't say she works to be independent or for her self respect, she says it's because she has to earn to support her DCs.

You said she was working to build up her pension. That’s perfectly reasonable.

You also said she works full time but moans about her lack of pension-what does that mean?

I suppose it depends how she feels about not having any of her own income. Having some financial independence isn’t something I feel is a choice, it feels like a necessity to me and I also like to contribute financially towards my DCs too.

If she was a man, would you think that her working is something she can just opt out of?

Other people’s financial arrangements are often astonishing and unexpected and apparently frequently unrelated to outward appearances or the job they have. I agree that ‘poverty’ for one person can look like total luxury for another. If she’s a good friend then just treat it as an eccentricity.

@shinyandnew1 I guess she just hasn't worked long enough to build up a pension she considers adequate.

@southlondonmum22 if a man was married to someone who earned enough to support them both then I would absolutely think it ok for him to give up work if he wanted to. It's not a gendered issue.

I define necessity differently to you: in my case no-one is going to pay my bills if I don't work, whereas for others working primarily meets other needs - perfectly valid but not what my friend is saying.

@betchyababy yes I think that may be what's going on here.

Having someone else be solely financially responsible for you puts you in a very vulnerable place if things go south. Working to have your own pension, your own financial independence etc is essential to me.

She didn't make you into a single parent.

You say you envy her but that's not her fault either.

I get that life is tougher for you than it is for her, but that's life isn't it?

Indeed. But but having a level of awareness to be mindful of others situations isn't too difficult. It's like the size 10 friend moaning about how fat she is in front of the size 16 friends.

How dare a woman try to be financially independent and secure!

Joking aside, is your issue the money or the moaning? If the latter, just tell her straight that the degree of self-pity is colouring your conversations and ask is there a specific worry she wants to share or can the two of you focus on something else?

Not close to this money wise but I remember when we were in severe difficulty (choosing bills not to pay, being threatened left right and centre) and in laws rolling eyes at us and telling us not to talk about it we were obviously shite with money and just needed to figure it out. Went to a charity that helps with advice and they told us with three in childcare, paying a mortgage and rent (we had to move out of apartment but nobody was renting it) and our student loans we were doing well and it would work out. You don’t know someone’s finances until you’re living their life

I think everyone is afraid—if they have any awareness—of a future which is different from, and worse than, the present. Just because she has husband, children, assets and job now doesn’t mean she doesn’t have concerns about keeping up this life if one or the other leg of the stool vanishes. Everyone in her life also expects everything to stay the same. But maybe her situation feels more fragile to her.

My friend doesn't say she works to be independent or for her self respect, she says it's because she has to earn to support her DCs.

Sorry just saw this, I’d say the reason they have money is he’s tight-the person who doesn’t look after the kids can sometimes think all extra expenses are unnecessary, dh gives out when I give money to the school for school tours, fairs, cake sales, swimming etc. all unnecessary in his mind

Sigh. If you've read the thread you'll see I have no issue with anyone working because they want financial independence. That's not what my friend is saying though.

Everyone is entitled to moan about their job - I've done it often enough myself - but it's not ok to tell someone in a much worse situation than you need the money. It's insensitive at best.

Its insensitive at worst not at best. Does everyone owe you perfect sensitivity all the time? Should she preface remarks about ger own life with ritual obeisance to your much harder experience?

You said your friend is working partly because has no pension so that is what she is saying and you told another poster that working for financial independence when you've a wealthy spouse isn't a necessity. For many, it a fundamental part of their self-worth that they are capable of providing for themselves and do so. Never mind accounting for the future and life's bumps as best as possible.

Are you in a much worse situation? Until you compare income and expenditure in detail you cannot be certain. You probably are though. Doesn't make her own problems or feelings any less valid. I'm curious if this is really about money or is about being partnered but I think I'm straying into the too personal there so I'll back away. Just food for thought.

Ultimately, I suppose she is doing what you are doing here with us. Venting and moaning about reasonable things but in the wrong direction.

@snowynight judging from the comments you are getting it's not difficult to see why so many women on MN have no real life friends.

This sounds really frustrating and tone deaf of her.

I'd try grey rocking any money chat and change the subject, combined with the odd light comment - "oh, let's not complain about money, it's too depressing, haha!" or similar.

I have a friend like this. 2 DC in the most expensive private school in England, three homes, life of utter privilege. Every phone conversation it is complaints about money and that the latest home they are developing has this and that red tape which will cost them hundreds of thousands. She also constantly moans that her even weather in laws have it so easy with money compared to her. Meanwhile I am sole breadwinner for family of four in London, not doing terribly but we don’t own a home and the place we rent is pretty grim. I am constantly amazed that she doesn’t grasp how insulting it is for her to complain to me about money! We are living in a rat infested hovel in one London’s
most deprived wards, with our children in a struggling state school and drug dealing neighbours! Now I don’t want sympathy but I do want some perspective.

Anyway - long since accepted I won’t get it. Now I just listen to her and say ‘oh gosh that sounds difficult’ when she starts on about her home-owning hardships.

Either grey rock or I would consider how to take it on. It is tone deaf of her. Something like 'I'm going to be really honest here Pam, from my viewpoint you have (give details) and I have (your situation) so it feels a bit off for you to be complaining about money to me. Is there something you're not telling me that you want to talk about?'

If there really isn't any hidden financial abuse etc, I would then say you'd rather not talk about money in future as it is frustrating and upsetting for you. You have feelings too. Not sure many of the commenters here have grasped that.

Whilst this is true, it can be difficult to talk to an envious person even if you do have a level of awareness.

Sometimes no matter what you say, they're going to choose to not understand because they're too busy comparing with their own problems.

There has to be give and take in a friendship.

She’s not a friend if she’s belittling you! Whether she works or doesn’t work, or just wants a moan that’s fine, but belittling you is not friend behaviour!