Mum kept baby hidden in drawer for nearly 3 years !!

[benjaminjamesandgraham]

Even Christmas day she was kept in a drawer - oh how can someone be so cruel
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gz1dv8ly2o

Firstly I don't think ANYONE can say if the social worker has seen worse - we aren't the social worker, we don't know what she's seen and we don't know what she saw here.
Secondly, yes there were obviously mental health issues. But this woman was a functioning member of society with a job and other children who she raised including normal run of the mill things like Christmas and school. Let's not try and pull out the entire 'struggling woman mental health card' to excuse any of this - women do bad things too and this was vile.
And lastly, the reason Christmas has been used to illustrate how appalling this was is because A) it's nearly Christmas, B) Christmas is generally held as a time to behave in a Cristian and caring manner to other human beings and C) the juxtaposition between the rest of her children having a lovely Christmas with presents etc and this poor child is jarring. It's a journalistic tact to encourage people to empathise with the child,

For the one or two posters who seem to be arguing that the child wasn’t abused, “ only” neglected …..

im not sure if you are saying that the child wasn’t so badly affected as she wasn’t beaten, or that the mother wasn’t so bad because she didn’t hit the child? Or perhaps both .

But you are very very wrong. This level of neglect is far far more damaging to a baby and young child - physically, mentally , psychologically, emotionally - that almost all types of abuse .

Children who have suffered like this have far worse outcomes than say a child who is adequately cared for by a mother but who is also physically or sexually abused say by another family member ( unknown to the mother ). I hate to rank levels of abuse , it’s all profoundly damaging and morally repugnant and all these perpetrators should be punished, so please don’t think I’m minimising it in any way.

But what this women did is much MUCH worse for the child. It’s also cold and calculated - that’s why so many women here can’t comprehend it. We can all undertand the parent who loses control in a moment of frustration and shakes a screaming baby ( especially if you are under the influence of drugs or alcohol or have mental health issues , are sleep deprived etc ).

But this woman knows what good care is ( there is no suggestion that the other children were abused ) and yet she tortured this baby / toddler every day for years. Then went off to work / popped out to Tesco / took her other kids to the doctor.

It's appalling .

Thats what mothers here can’t get over.

As Pp have said, there was no mitigating plea that the woman was mentally ill , so I think we can safely assume that her defence team would have thought of that before you. So it’s pretty disrespectful to this poor child ( and the new parents and siblings and former siblings ) who will deal with the effects of this all their lives to try to argue “ what she did wasn’t so bad “.

Even the professionals - police, social workers , doctors , nurses , court officials, lawyers and jury member will have been badly affected - this is such a terrible case . People who work in this field are shocked.

So please go away with your “ it’s not so bad “ nonsense ( that’s a more polite word than the one I’d like to use ).

I suppose people can section off parts of themselves and appear to function.

'No one, no woman, no mother would ever consider this ok without there being something very wrong mentally.'

And yet we sadly see it all the time. Children horrifically abused and murdered while their mothers are either the perpetrators or bystanders allowing it to happen.

It isn't always mental illness. Some people are just incredibly cruel.

The social worker is quoted as never haven seen worse. Literally they said "I've never seen worse"

That sums it up. There's no suggestion the boyfriend who discovered the child is the father so in that 3 years she found a new partner.

There was what looked like a very half hearted attempt at an explanation that the father had been an abusive partner and she wanted to keep the baby from him.

I think it looks more that she was getting back at him by torturing his child. She did just enough to keep the child alive. That involved subterfuge and planning and controlling others. She's no different from Josef Fritzl.

Not that this makes it ok I'm the slightest - but people are reading "being kept in a drawer for 3 years" as always being in the drawer under the bed.

She wasn't. She was sat on the bed when found.

She slept in the drawer and it may have been open during the night.

The mum fed her so she had some adult interaction.

We don't know the curtains were always shut but she never went outside to experience that.

We don't know if any medical diagnosis that may have contributed to her size and/ or development.

There is no doubt this is abuse and neglect of the worse kind.

But this ain't a mum who had a child and shut them in a drawer to die.

I'm guessing - as others have said - this is a mum who gave birth during a pandemic to a child she didn't know she'd conceived or was in denial she'd conceived. Who she thought may die or who she concealed for so long the lie was hard to reverse or confess too.

Nothing is ever black and white. This case certainly wont be and there will be so much we don't know.

The only thing we know for sure is plenty of lives will have been affected by this beyond that poor little girls. And plenty of people will want to make sense of this like many posters are because it's so extreme it's not understandable.

Firstly I don't think ANYONE can say if the social worker has seen worse - we aren't the social worker,

I had previously pisted what the social worker said but here it is again.

"Having been a social worker since 2006, I have never experienced such an extreme case of blatant child neglect and cruelty"

She is quoted in the media reports.

There is no doubt this is abuse and neglect of the worse kind.

Well, make up your mind. Your entire post is downplaying the situation. As the judge, who does have all the facts before him, said: "What you did was wicked beyond belief."

This is ridiculous.
Plenty of people have experienced days and days of not being able to function after a loss.
This went on for 3 YEARS.
3 years, while she was looking after her other children and living what sounds like a normal life. 3 whole years where she kept a baby entombed in a drawer under her bed.
And you're seriously saying you can see how this can happen .

Wtf is wrong with people on this thread.

I think people tell themselves something awful must have happened to her to make sense of the sheer evil she inflicted on this poor baby.

some people just do evil shit.

no one rushes to a man’s defence when it comes to child abuse/neglect.

She’s exactly where she belongs, just a shame she isn’t there permanently.

This feels like downplaying it , trying to mitigate and justify and this makes me feel very disturbed. That anyone could look at this and write this.

Appalling post.(sorry the one you're quoting, not yours)

We don't know if any medical diagnosis that may have contributed to her size and/ or development.

We know that malnutrition and being confined in an enclosed space caused it.

It is not downplaying at all. You've chosen to read it that way.

But there is far more to this than the sensationalised headlines which changes the narrative the media have created.

This is abuse and neglect of the worse kind - of that no one can disagree.

But the other reported facts don't tell the whole story - there is far more nuance than sensationalised click bait headlines.

The mum however has been sentenced as she should be.

And the children, ex partner (I assume he ended it when he found out), social worker, emergency services etc - I hope are getting the best counselling available as the consequences of this will be far reaching.

There was no jury.

She pleaded guilty. At least she spared some prospective jurors.

Yes my point was @Honestandkind that there are people on here saying that's not right and the SW would have seen cases far more disturbing..! I was trying (unsuccessfully) to point out that we don't have the SWs lived experience and aren't in a position to judge that as we aren't the SW!

What a horrific case. As awful as it sounds, I'm suprised the child is even still alive, in those conditions after 3 years. Just so so sad. I am sure we will here more in the court case when it happens, as noone can even contemplate how anyone would do such a thing. It is indeed child abuse but there is likely to be some important details that have to be kept quiet. Who knows what that women may have been thinking, what was going on in her life etc.

'The mum fed her'
The mum fed her weetabix and wotsits. Hardly an adequate diet by any stretch.

'I'm guessing - as others have said - this is a mum who gave birth during a pandemic to a child she didn't know she'd conceived'
She already had kids so she knew exactly what was going on pregnancy wise pandemic or not.

'But this ain't a mum who had a child and shut them in a drawer to die'
This is exactly what it is, sounds like a miracle that the child survived at all.

I find no other way to read it.

From the CPS, as linked previously. (Hint: not sensationalist newsbait):

Mother jailed for hiding her child in a drawer for three years | The Crown Prosecution Service

oh stop it.

Just stop it. Stop making excuses for one of the worst cases of child neglect and abuse that has been reported for years. Stop making excuses for a woman who made a choice every single day for 3 years to abuse her child. It's just vile.

The irony of you accusing people on this thread of being “devoid of humanity” yet defending and minimising what this cruel woman did to this poor innocent child!
Where was her humanity towards the baby??!

This.

Can we stop with the mental health excuses. Many, many people have mental health problems and do not inflict unspeakable cruelty on a child.

As this poster says we never try to excuse men for their shocking abuse so why do some people try to do it with women. Some people are abusers.

People making excuses for her need to be put on some watch list. Sick.

There's no other way to read it. You're downplaying it and it's frankly disgusting.