Riders by Jilly Cooper - prequel to Rivals

[RedRobyn2021]

Decided to start listening to Riders by Jilly Cooper after watching Rivals

Quite shocked it's been written by a woman, the women are objectified, the men are rapey

Is it just me? Have you read it?

I looked it up and apparently Jilly Cooper wrote it in 1970, does this go some way to explaining why it's written like this?

I'm preserving with it, I'm on Chapter 13 but I think Rupert is a repulsive creep and can't understand why everyone is so obsessed with him

Yy about the hatred for fat women, Tory was referred to as "fat Tory" all the time "dragging her 11 stone bulk around the cottage" but again, of its time, you didn't see that many fat people really.

And yes, there were only 3 TV channels, no internet, no streaming. The Sun still published a topless photo on page 3 EVERY DAY. And did a countdown to (Sam Fox's?) 16th birthday as it would then be legal for her to have sex.

OP, your pearl clutching really is unnecessary. We all knew that JC’s books were filled with misogyny, sex and inappropriate behaviour. That’s why we read them. They were over the top and just soft porn romances. They were not real and didn’t really reflect the rapidly changing social environment.
Yes, there were many dinosaurs still around in the workplace but they were definitely a dying breed. Try not to judge us too harshly, your generation will be laughed out of the park in 40yrs from now over gender identity.

The Daysee rape scene is interesting.

It was made much of in the TV series and was a central plot.

It was a jokey sideline in the book and no one gave a damn.

True @THisbackwithavengeance - it wasn't rape in the book, it was a grope, they changed that IIRC.

I remember reading Riders as an 80s teen who already weighed more than 11 stones, and feeling a bit queasy - but again, JC was from that wartime generation who were, generally, smaller on account of rationing, as well as conditioned by 1960s Twiggy-led fashion. My DM was a similar age, and spent most of the 80s on the F-Plan Diet, bemoaning her 'middle aged spread' but her size 16 M&S velvet jackets are now fitted on me, as a modern 12.

There's a tongue in cheek quality to nearly all of what JC writes, though. The only thing she's completely serious about is the animals, and decent treatment thereof.

I read her romances - Emily, Octavia, Harriet, etc, - in the seventies, and there were some scenarios that wouldn’t be countenanced now. I remember a marital rape in one of those. And yes, very much a reflection of the times, and boys/men expecting that all girls were on the Pill and no thought of std and condoms. You were either frigid or a slag, and judges comments in rape cases were absolutely horrendous.

JC’s animal books are lovely, particularly the one about animals in war, and the Common Years too. Hilariously observations in Class.

I have watched the series and loved it. I'm 40 so maybe have lived a little 'in both camps' and seen the transition of what was accepted and what isn't now. I think the private sector workplace might still be an eye-opener for some.
I work in London in a private, male dominated industry and office affair's are still aplenty.

S*xual harassment, thankfully, less so; but still went on in my formative years (2000/2010's) and does go on.

I think the series is light-tv; and does highlight unacceptable behaviour, and is to be watched for what it was at the time. Age gap 'older man' has always been a theme in romance too, don't see an issue as long as clearly adult and not coerced.

And yes, showjumpers were famous, me as a 80s/90s child had posters on walls of John Whittaker etc; everyone knew their horses (the famous Milton) :-)

It was of its time and things in it would make me wince now. OTOH in the eighties when I was a teenager and young woman, men and boys weren’t all watching violent porn, choking was not normalised, differing views could be discussed without cancellations and witch hunts. It’s not all progress you know…

I've never watched the TV series. But the rape was definitely in the book. By both men. Plus sexual assault from Janey.

Oh sorry, just realised you are talking about a different character.

Marital rape was still legal in the UK at the time the book was written (unbelievably) - https://theweek.com/98330/when-did-marital-rape-become-a-crime
now illegal but enforcement and conviction rates are a sorry story.

Has anyone mentioned the drink driving yet? Casually commonplace and again reflecting different times.

The level of alcohol consumption generally in the book is quite something.

Far more shocking to me was the popularity of Fifty Shades of Grey and that was only 13 years ago. Christian was horribly abusive in so many ways. But held up as some kind of sex king. How anyone could wank over that I will never understand.

I think we're talking about different books!

In Rivals, in the book the Rev Fergus Penney gropes Daysee, they changed this in the tv adaptation to more than that

In Riders, in the book I agree, it was rape, Rupert and Billy and Janey. I've never seen the TV series.

I agree, I hated that at the time, vile. I haven't read it but I got the gist.

That's so cool

I listened to the bit today where he tries to beat his horse to death

Made me hate him tbh, as if I needed more reason

I managed to talk to my mum today and asked her about it, I don't think she remembers the books that well as it's been so many years since she read them, but she did tell me that she was grabbed many times in the work place, she worked as a waitress on an evening for extra money and worked in banking during the day.

She said the other big difference was when she was pregnant with me and intended on coming back to work, a lot of women were very disapproving which really upset her as financially she literally didn't have a choice, she couldn't pay her mortgage without working. Compared to today where it's more the norm to work than be a SAHM I would say

@myladyjane

But there's no rape in Twilight? There's a lot of really awful behaviour in Riders where men sexually assault women, objectify them and apparently a scene where someone is undeniably raped by Billy as well (although I haven't got to this bit yet)

Do you think maybe your own nostalgia has coloured your opinion?

I really wouldn't say Twilight could be as bad, even with all its problematic parts

Agree with previous posters. It very muiof it's time and I don't suppose I though much of Taggy and Rupert as I was having relationships with older men too

I agree with you, it is very interesting

I am still disgusted though

I'd be surprised if she hasn't

It would be like ignoring the elephant in the room

When did I say I have a problem with women not calling men out?

I didn't and I wouldn't, you just made that up

I 1000% blame the disgusting pigs that call themselves men

However as I have said, I am shocked a woman wrote this

Yes one man slapped my arse when I was in my early 20s, we are conditioned in our culture to be "good girls" and not make a fuss, it's books like the one we're discussing that perpetuate that this behaviour from men is normal and acceptable.