Anyone watching the Budget 2024?

[LadyofRutshire]

I couldn't find a thread on today's budget. Anyone watching live?

@AquaPeer it seems pretty negative there’s no positive vibe coming out it’s very anti business and growth unless your public sector it’s managed decline. Fuck whether she’s a woman she’s a total imbecile who has just put stress onto a precarious situation at least under the tories inflation was coming down growth was starting now it’s being reversed for what ? Bloated public sector and stagnant economy

That’s not really very… specific?! I mean if those things were true they were true the last time employers NI was increased?

Have you not noticed the public sector crisis? FFS

The chancellor confirmed the amount received in benefits will rise by 1.7% in April, in line with inflation.

What?!!! She has just announced huge investment into infrastructure projects and public services that is all desperately needed. I think it is a very positive budget and would much rather have this than the tories destroying our society and services.

New thread link. Just having dinner. Will catch up and join in again.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5199162-budget-2024-2?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

It’s a fair point around a comparatively low return on investments leading to different investment strategies.

But it does basically highlight that rather than going “poor business owners” we are talking about people going “I am not making as much return running a business as I could elsewhere, and that makes me want to change where I invest my money.”

This is both a) true and as you point out, could have a negative impact on the country. But b) we should all cut the BS about ‘poor business owners’ when we are essentially saying these are millionaires who feel they could make more money doing something else. That’s also
fine. But IMO they don’t deserve any sympathy for having additional problems and decisions to make.

And anyone with £15m assets is not ‘perceived’ as rich - they are genuinely rich.

(I mean I know this is all a fictional example)

Who’s been threatening to leave?

Growth projections are dire, as we have been told this morning: next year the economy is expected to expand by 2%. The growth rate will slow in subsequent years to 1.8% and 1.5% in 2027. Inflation rate above 2% throughout.

lets wait and see I would put money on the fact there will be no sorting out of anything everything will decline more and we will all be poorer. Re the rich leaving I already know of 5 who have gone you may say good but they are the people who spend and employ when they are gone it’s gets a bit worse

They still get their state pension abroad.

And many on benefits can still get them when living abroad. Which is bonkers. At least pensioners paid into the system so are entitled to it.

Singapore you say.

They've certainly got housing right. Something like 90% public aka social housing. So everyone, including those on lower incomes, have decent affordable homes.

Which of course achieves what you said you wanted in another post you made - lower benefit bill. Because
a) expensive private housing makes up a significant proportion of the benefits bill, and
b) bad or insecure housing harms health - which causes more people to be unable to work, and also costs the NHS loads.

As for long school summer holidays. I'm aware not everyone will agree with me but I think it's good for children to have that break. I still have fond memories of my own childhood summer holidays from school, and I value that time with my own DC now.

Who gets benefits abroad?

The USA allows people on long-term disability to receive them if they move abroad but the UK doesn't. Nor can job seekers.

I think the US is right to allow disabled people to receive benefits abroad. They're not costing anymore by living abroad - if fact, often costing less because won't be using the NHS or other services in the UK.

Btw everyone pays in. Income tax isn't the only tax. And also loads of disabled and ill people worked and "paid in", sometimes for decades, before becoming unable to work. And do you really think disabled children don't deserve support? Don't you want a civilised society?

Oh absolutely fictional, but representative in a smaller or larger scale of many many SMEs and therefore private businesses and people that the left see (because at one level they are) rich. But to give it some context, their £15m of assets generate £5m a year for the government in tax receipts, but less than a million for the people with capital at risk. And still people want to tax the rich more. They should teach more of this stuff at school…

All of these businesses can have surplus’ if they spend less than their income. They just can’t have profit

universities are my specialist subject at the moment. Believe me, they’re not going bankrupt due the 1.2% in employers NI.

they’re going bankrupt for 50% reductions in income, inflation, massive % increases in public sector pensions, and borrowing costs.

I know that’s why I would stop it

Why? They've paid in and are entitled to their pension. And are actually saving the UK money because, as they live abroad, they're not using the NHS or other public services.

@AquaPeer And be the only major economy to withdraw the reward that follows a life's work? Even the Americans don't do that!

Because they want to live somewhere else to escape tax so byeeeeeee

It might be about the weather being nicer for retirement? Portobello or Porto? I'd pick Porto every time.

Not the poster I was responding too, it was because she wants to avoid paying tax

But they are not losing any of the 15m in this example by paying any tax. Whereas someone who is paid 50k is potentially paying more tax out of what they personally earn than if the company profits are not withdrawn from the org.

And also, the activity of the people working for them is what is generating the income as well. You might as well say that the fictional employee who has sold 500 hot dogs in a day for £10 a piece incl. 20% VAT has generated £1k tax for the government.

Basically- if you have £15m you have to do something with it. It is good for society that you do not store it under your bed, and actually invest it in something that helps the economy.

And this should be encouraged. And you can argue the government is not doing enough to encourage it.

But let’s not pretend that it truly costs people with £15m to invest anything to actually do something with their money- if the only downside is opportunity cost, they don’t get to claim any moral value to their actions - it’s purely self interest (which is fine, but stop claiming anything else)

Don't know about ' not using the NHS' I've known a few who live abroad , yet come back to the UK for treatment on the NHS when it suits them !
Maybe harder these days, but definitely went on in the past. Especially when they discover many countries don't have the care that the UK have ( even if it is hit and miss / shit these days)

Lots of pensioners move abroad for the sun and better standard of living, and not to escape tax. 🙄