Cows killed another poor dog walker

[Pippetypoppity]

I’ve just seen on the BBC news that a lady has been killed in a field by cows. She was walking her chihuahua. This is absolutely tragic. She possibly ran with dog and was chased. That would be my guess as the same happened to me on our farm when I was very young. Your instinct is to save your dog and run. I remember I had a sheep dog puppy in my arms and I’d gone into the field to play. I was about 6 I think. The cows noticed the puppy from quite a distance away and the whole herd started moving in. Luckily I was close enough to the gate to get out, but it was terrifying. I remember my father on the yard yelling ‘Drop the puppy’ at the top of his lungs. I didn’t but I’d have been a gonner if I was another 50 yards in. I just want to tell everyone what my father said to me that day. It’s stuck in my mind ever since and it’s important anyone who dog walks in the country knows it too

1. If you see cows with calves leave the field by the nearest exit immediately. Cows often charge to protect their young
2. If you see cows without calves and they start moving quickly towards you they are being inquisitive. If you have a dog with you the cows will want to know if it is a threat. They see dogs instinctively as predators. If you cannot get to a gate and they are approaching- startle them by shouting jumping, waving your arms and making yourself appear as loud, big and threatening as possible. This will frighten them and make them stop or bypass you.
3. If they persevere it will be because they want to force your dog out of the field. Let the dog go! This is critical. Your dog can run faster than cows and much much faster than you. The cows will then focus on the dog and you can get away.
4. Never ever pick up the dog if cows are refusing to back off. This is the hardest thing in the world to do as all your instincts will compel you to try and protect it. It stands a better chance running and dodging them however than it does in your arms. You will then avoid becoming a target yourself and being trampled.
5. When cows move quickly in a large group the ones at the front get pushed by the ones at the back even if they themselves try to slow down. They will not be trying to mow you down but the sheer force from behind might mean they do. For this reason if cows approach in a group and your initial efforts to threaten and scare them failed, make that momentum go in a different direction ie after your dog.

I am so so dreadfully sorry to hear that this has happened again. The lady in question was inevitably a devoted extremely responsible and loving pet owner. She must have been to have been giving her chihuahua a country walk. I expect for this very reason she picked her dog up when she saw the cows getting near. Poor poor lady.

I have actually had to turn around and go all the way back in that exact scenario due to a herd of cows blocking the path and causing me to feel quite unsafe as they started to crowd round me. I was very pissed off at having to go back but better safe than sorry.

Thanks OP. I didn't know this. I don't have a dog, but there are cows (small groups mostly) on public land where I live. I didn't know they were a threat, but what you say makes perfect sense.

There are signs around where I walk my own dogs saying exactly what the OP says.
Get your dog off the lead immediately. They will chase the dog and probably not catch it.
They will probably catch you.

With respect - you clearly are just parroting rubbish you read.

The cows and calves you encounter in fields are most likely beef breeding

I'm not quite sure I get your point. I was saying that farmers seem to be failing to do adequate risk assessments over which cattle they should or shouldn't be putting into fields traversed by public footpaths. This could include bulls, cows with calves, or any cattle that have previously caused problems.

Someone posted upthread about the farmer in Yorkshire whose cows had killed a man and left his wife paralysed for life. He had been told of previous incidents where those cows had chased walkers, and one where they had attacked a man and put him in hospital. He said "Oh well, the man from the HSE told me the guy ended up in A&E but I didn't realise it was serious 😡".

I just hope he's been banned from keeping livestock and sent to prison.

Most of the farmers round here electric fence off their cows if they have a public footpath running along the edge of their field. Others put up warning signs which think should be a legal requirement.
Some farmers of course do neither of these things and would prefer the public not to be able to use the paths to which they are legally permitted.

There needs to be a change of law around this.
I'm very sorry to hear about the poor woman .

We live in the countryside and my advice is actually NEVER EVER!!! walk through a field full of cows with or without a dog. Whether there’s two cows or twenty, STAY OUT!! Very, very sad indeed.

Totally agree @crackofdoom

That's lab grown meat.

Not lentils, soya, potatoes, quorn, mushrooms, chickpeas, tofu, seitan, nuts, or even Beyond Meat ™️

The number of vegetarian mumsnetters sitting down to a lab grown meat burger on a Saturday night is, to a rough approximation, zero.

With beef cows (the ones you see in fields with calves) their calves are fully grown before they are separated. They don't associate humans negatively with a fully grown beef calf being stopped from suckling them trust me. It's like stopping a 5 year old human child from breast feeding.

I'm not from UK and genuinely cannot comprehend right to roam.

Allowing the public through farms throws up so many problems. They are a potentially dangerous workplace. If you visited a factory (after being invited, not just wandering in after a few drinks), you would be given safety clothing and there would be no-go areas but farmers are expected to put up with members of the public walking through their land doing whatever they like.

Farmers are responsible for the upkeep and safety of the paths but I am presuming they have no powers to fine or ban people for littering, going off the path, endangering animals.

If it's a public path, why aren't the Council responsible for the upkeep, in the same way as roads? Why don't they fence off the paths?

I grew up on a farm. When we were kids, my brother and I were chased by a bullock while walking through our field.
We handled cattle all the time, walked through them, knew never to taunt them but one day, one of them turned on us. I have never ran so fast in my life and I haven't trusted a cow since.

Exactly this I'm fed up of seeing dog attacks on sheep which I'm sure many a cow has witnessed. Cow's are just protecting themselves the only way they know how.

@user1471505494
"It’s their bloody land and livelihood"

Yes, and it is our right to access the countryside. Many of these footpaths were there before their farms, and all of them were there before any farmer still living.
@crackofdoom

Yes and much of the land used to belong to the public before it was enclosed under various Acts of Parliament.

The right to roam is the bane of every farmers life. Public rights of way are often historical access for farm labourers who would have been familiar with the animals and crops. Not ignorant townies who often fail to observe the correct behaviour when walking through fields.
I’m quite certain that most people would not welcome the general public onto their land( gardens) damaging fences or leaving gates open, with the result of their precious/valuable dogs and children being able to wander onto busy roads.
When you walk along public footpaths remember that you are on somebody’s private land. The landowner has to maintain gates and fences at their own cost.
Public footpaths were not invented for recreational purposes but for farm and land workers to access work. Just as most riverside paths were used by horses pulling barges up navigable rivers.
The countryside code is a good start. Read it before attempting a walk.

It's a stupid old law I would never go onto land where there's livestock unless. I would rather go back the way I came. It's crap the farmer end's up in court.

Yes I think this would be a good balance. If farmers have to remove livestock or fence through the middle of their fields then they should also have the right to prosecute anyone littering, leaving gates open, leaving dog poo, trespassing from humans or dogs, livestock worrying, picnicking, photo taking, tree climbing, loitering, daisy chain making, twig stealing etc.

Farmers actually allow a huge amount of activity to take place on their land FOR FREE when anywhere else it would be charged for. All we ask in return is that you respect the land you walk over and understand that its a working environment. Sometimes the essential business of farming might spoil that walk and nearly every time that walk isn't essential, it's an option/pastime.

So bring it on - £100 for every gate left open a tenner for every picnic and fifty quid a dog shit and I'd be a millionaire in no time.

The cattle are just protecting their calves. Not everyone is kind to animals those cattle must have been traumatized at some time by humans and dogs to do what they did. Look at the firefighter who ended up in court because he drove a fire engine through a herd of cattle with the siren blaring. Which caused the cattle to panic and trample the farmer to death. Was that the farmers fault as well for not controlling them?

It belonged to the Lord of the manor but the public had certain rights. Access would have depended on these rights which were predominantly to graze livestock and grow crops for which you needed access. Large area of the country were woodland. Footpaths were a means to an end not for leasure pursuits.
The farmers in feudal Britain were not much better off than slaves. A lot of their crop would go to the manor, in a poor year they would be left with little to eat. Farming was a communal affair but undertaken as individuals. Commercial farming was only made possible by the Enclosures act and was necessitated by the Industrial Revolution and mass migration by farm labourers to the industrial centres. If they hadn’t enclosed the country would have starved.

Some breeds are actually known for being more docile than others. And within a herd some individual animals will be known for being more nasty. I do agree that farmers need to be able to use their fields but there is a responsibility towards walkers .

I used to live and work on a mixed farm which included cattle. We had a footpath which entered the farm yard, then went down a narrow track with a fence on one side and a steep bank on the other before opening up into a field. One day some hikers had crossed the yard and entered the track. My boss hated walkers and decided that that was the precise moment he wanted to let some young bullocks out the barn and move them to that field. Which he decided to do by letting them stampede completely unsupervised down the track knowing they’d encounter the walkers still. There were only 4 bullocks and they were small so it’s not like he sent a herd of 50 down. But he revved them up on purpose and they ran like the wind down the track. Boss was laughing his head off at the thought of them terrifying the hikers.

Maybe moving cattle with calves away from public footpaths, or putting up signs that there are cattle in fields etc are both sendsible precautions though. What it indicates is that the farmer has responsibility to those using footpaths and that the law can find him culpable if a person using those paths is injured or killed.

Constantly impregnating cows and taking their calves away early will not be helping either. I’d be interested to see how more gentle farming methods affects a cows mental state and whether they are less aggressive

I’ve gone a couple of miles out of my way to the nearest road in the past if there was a point further on to rejoin the path. Or completely retraced my steps and not completed the walk. Irritating, but my risk assessment for cows is very high and it’s just not worth it. Yes, day out walking spoiled but at least we and the dog are safe (dog always on lead around livestock and trained to ignore).
Been caught out a few times due to poor visibility in fields and retreated/evaded cattle quickly. Waving my stick with arms wide and shouting like my Dad taught me has worked very well, but I’d rather not put me or the livestock in a confrontational position.

Our cows in the New Forest are generally much more socialised than herds living in quiet fields.
I have always ridden and walked on the forest and never had an issue although I would always keep my distance from calves.
There was an incident near me last year where a woman walking her dog accidentally came close very to a calf who was tucked out of sight behind a bush and the mother cow attacked her. Luckily a passing motorist saw what was happening and managed to drag the poor woman into her car. She was badly hurt and needed hospital treatment but did recover.
The same cow had apparently also chased a couple of walkers with a dog a few days before so she was removed from the forest after the attack.

I can see a certain type of farmer deliberately putting cows into fields in order to stop the public accessing the public right of way.

Probably the farmers who steal their calves. No wonder the cows are so protective of them - they have them removed way before they’re ready.

Dogs can be a real menace these days. I don't think people should be walking them near livestock. But there should be signs saying no dogs if these dreadful incidents are to be avoided..