Page 4 | Lucy Letby in the news

Viviennemary · 2024-08-29T21:33:24+00:00

I've just been watching the BBC news and apparently some experts have been questioning the validity of Lucy Letbys conviction. I must say when I read the details of the trial she did sound 100% guilty. But it would be a tragedy if she is innocent Personally I don't think she is but who knows. Somebody on the news said the only person who knows is Lucy Letby.

Blackcats7 · 29/08/2024 23:51

Outliers · 29/08/2024 23:32

It's so weird that babies stopped dying so frequently once she left the hospital.

What an odd coincidence 🙄

The hospital stopped taking the very sickest babies at this time so the decline in deaths could be entirely down to this not LL’s absence.
I think having done jury service myself and also having watched in horror the jury’s deliberations on the fairly recent documentary experiment The Jury Murder Trial on channel 4 there is enormous room for error given the wildly varying intelligence, prejudice and personalities of jury members. In a highly emotive trial like LL I suspect at least some of the jury would have decided more from personal reaction/ bias than on the actual evidence some of which was very technical.
I am also reminded of the famous quotation
”There are lies, damned lies and statistics”

CranfordScones · 29/08/2024 23:51

Jifmicroliquid · 29/08/2024 23:28

I was expecting to listen to the podcast and be utterly convinced that she’d done it. The reality was quite the opposite.

A lot of those babies were found to have died of natural causes. It had been signed off. It wasn’t a case of “hang on, there’s something suspicious here”. It was only after the doctors raised concerns that the deaths were revisited and suddenly it was decided they were murdered. I found that bit really quite shocking.

I can’t explain why, but I have a gut feeling that she’s innocent. I think it will come out eventually, somehow, but a long time in to her sentence.

Doctors are trained to look for the most obvious cause first ("horses not zebras" etc).

A baby murdered surreptitiously by a medical professional is always going to be conflated with natural causes, especially if the baby is very sick. As they say, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. The deaths need to accumulate before more suspicious possibilities can be seriously considered.

HeySummerWhereAreYou · 29/08/2024 23:52

Why are some people so determined to insist she is innocent? Very odd.

Is there something about her that makes her more appealing to support and believe - that other women accused of heinous crimes don't have?

FourEightFifteenSixteenTwentyThreeFortyTwo · 29/08/2024 23:54

HeySummerWhereAreYou · 29/08/2024 23:52

Why are some people so determined to insist she is innocent? Very odd.

Is there something about her that makes her more appealing to support and believe - that other women accused of heinous crimes don't have?

I don’t know if she’s innocent or not, it’s almost immaterial. The issue is that her conviction doesn’t look safe.

ToBeOrNotToBee · 29/08/2024 23:55

HeySummerWhereAreYou · 29/08/2024 23:52

Why are some people so determined to insist she is innocent? Very odd.

Is there something about her that makes her more appealing to support and believe - that other women accused of heinous crimes don't have?

Lack of evidence
Dodgy stats
Professional witnesses that seem to not know what they were talking about
Shit defence team who didn't seem to grasp the facts

thingymijigi · 29/08/2024 23:55

I am convinced that this case is a terrible miscarriage of justice. I strongly believe it will be overturned but her life is ruined.

ncforcatquestion · 29/08/2024 23:57

HeySummerWhereAreYou · 29/08/2024 23:52

Why are some people so determined to insist she is innocent? Very odd.

Is there something about her that makes her more appealing to support and believe - that other women accused of heinous crimes don't have?

I didn't believe the case was strong against her, but when she faced the court audience and said I am innocent, I just believed her

Colinfromaccounts · 30/08/2024 00:00

Unfortunately I think she did do it. She seemed quite childlike and repressed, with extremely over-controlling parents, and I can only think that killing babies satisfied some kind of psychological need for her. She’ll never admit it though.

HeySummerWhereAreYou · 30/08/2024 00:03

Well, if she didn't do it, this would be the biggest Miscarriage of Justice of the century. I think...

Telephonewiresabove · 30/08/2024 00:07

HeySummerWhereAreYou · 29/08/2024 23:52

Why are some people so determined to insist she is innocent? Very odd.

Is there something about her that makes her more appealing to support and believe - that other women accused of heinous crimes don't have?

Have you actually read anything on why some consider her conviction unsafe - and have from almost the moment the verdict was passed down? This New Yorker article is a good place to start if you haven't.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2024/05/20/lucy-letby-was-found-guilty-of-killing-seven-babies-did-she-do-it

Nc209 · 30/08/2024 00:08

mnahmnah · 29/08/2024 22:47

I’m so tired of seeing her and hearing about her. I cannot imagine what it’s doing to the families of her victims. In this day and age she would not have been charged and found guilty unless there was overwhelming evidence.

She actually carried out a miscarriage scan on me. Out of all the healthcare professionals I saw throughout three pregnancies, she was the only one that DH and I really remember because she was so lacking in empathy for our situation. She was cold, irritated with me being upset and just unpleasant. She really upset me in what was already a traumatic situation. So I have zero interest in her being given any sympathy.

The evidence that she was locked up on is so underwhelming and not in any way robust, which is why so many are shocked or concerned that she was actually convicted in this day and age.

Redwood48 · 30/08/2024 00:09

Didn't they say the babies had been injected with insulin by Letby? Did that turn out to a true fact of the case?

Twototwo15 · 30/08/2024 00:10

Fordian · 29/08/2024 22:41

This is modern times, where we all think we know the full evidence. We don't.

For me, the evidence against her was overwhelming. Her own writings were a huge part of that, as I understand it.

The ganging up of Nurses against nasty Doctors; her presence at so many events.

If her own writings were a huge part of the evidence against her, that’s concerning. She said, among other things “I didn’t do anything wrong”, “police intimidation”. The “I am evil”, “no hope”, “despair”, “I did this because I am evil” etc. could be due to extreme stress and trauma of the accusations hanging over her for ages.

Blinky21 · 30/08/2024 00:12

I don't understand why those who are convinced thst she did it because of her notes, ignore that she also wrote that she didn't do it. If she's innocent it's awful that the families have been put through the trauma of thinking their child was deliberately harmed

Twototwo15 · 30/08/2024 00:12

HeySummerWhereAreYou · 29/08/2024 23:52

Why are some people so determined to insist she is innocent? Very odd.

Is there something about her that makes her more appealing to support and believe - that other women accused of heinous crimes don't have?

Maybe they are just not convinced either way? There was a bit more solid evidence with other women accused of heinous crimes.

Nc209 · 30/08/2024 00:13

Blackcats7 · 29/08/2024 23:51

The hospital stopped taking the very sickest babies at this time so the decline in deaths could be entirely down to this not LL’s absence.
I think having done jury service myself and also having watched in horror the jury’s deliberations on the fairly recent documentary experiment The Jury Murder Trial on channel 4 there is enormous room for error given the wildly varying intelligence, prejudice and personalities of jury members. In a highly emotive trial like LL I suspect at least some of the jury would have decided more from personal reaction/ bias than on the actual evidence some of which was very technical.
I am also reminded of the famous quotation
”There are lies, damned lies and statistics”

Show quote history

Yes they stopped taking the sickest babies AND they added two more consultants to the roster because of the staffing pressures.

HeySummerWhereAreYou · 30/08/2024 00:14

Telephonewiresabove · 30/08/2024 00:07

Have you actually read anything on why some consider her conviction unsafe - and have from almost the moment the verdict was passed down? This New Yorker article is a good place to start if you haven't.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2024/05/20/lucy-letby-was-found-guilty-of-killing-seven-babies-did-she-do-it

Show quote history

Fair enough. As I said earlier, I only think she did it, but I will go and read up on the reasons why people are saying it was not a safe conviction...

RogueFemale · 30/08/2024 00:15

ToBeOrNotToBee · 29/08/2024 22:58

When I was working in midwifery, for a 4-5 months, every single woman I cared for needed something like an emergency cesarean, forceps, I even had a shoulder dystocia and a very poorly baby as a result.
I was the common demoninator and it really impacted me. In fact this was the trigger for a period of time where I was suicidal and ultimately quit my career. I used to write in my journals similar things to what Letby did.
Reading people saying she must be guilty based on her own writing chills me to the bone because they would have found me guilty (of what I don't know) the same way.
I do believe there is way more to this than meets the eye. This is a very shaky conviction.

Show quote history

Also, Letby's writing was after her arrest.

Neodymium · 30/08/2024 00:15

Outliers · 29/08/2024 23:32

It's so weird that babies stopped dying so frequently once she left the hospital.

What an odd coincidence 🙄

Because at exactly the same time they downgraded the hospital and stopped taking very sick premmie babies 🙄.

it was literally the same week. So not much of a coincidence

MyrtlethePurpleTurtle · 30/08/2024 00:17

AlcoholicDad82 · 29/08/2024 23:20

I come from a family of Doctors and Nurses and every single one said she is Guilty.

Did they attend the trial? Read the transcripts? Or even read the New Yorker article? No, I thought not

Nc209 · 30/08/2024 00:17

Redwood48 · 30/08/2024 00:09

Didn't they say the babies had been injected with insulin by Letby? Did that turn out to a true fact of the case?

It was considered a 'fact' by the court they they were deliberately poisoned with insulin and accepted by the defence, but it wasn't proven to be an actual true fact.

ncforcatquestion · 30/08/2024 00:18

Redwood48 · 30/08/2024 00:09

Didn't they say the babies had been injected with insulin by Letby? Did that turn out to a true fact of the case?

It was that contaminated feed bags caused a baby to ingest insulin. But now there is confusion over whether insulin was added at all

RogueFemale · 30/08/2024 00:18

From everything I've read, I don't think she's guilty beyond reasonable doubt. I think there are a lot of problems with the prosecution's evidence.

Twototwo15 · 30/08/2024 00:19

Redwood48 · 30/08/2024 00:09

Didn't they say the babies had been injected with insulin by Letby? Did that turn out to a true fact of the case?

They said the evidence pointed to the fact that they must have been injected with insulin, but no one saw anyone doing it.
I also wonder if one day something will be discovered that increases insulin in people to these levels as a few other nurses have been accused of killing people by injecting them with insulin. I can’t think why anyone would do it, never mind a few.

HeySummerWhereAreYou · 30/08/2024 00:19

@Telephonewiresabove I am getting a 403 error message on your link (on your post at 00.07,) so can't look at the moment. Will try again later - or tomorrow. Or find a new source.