Lucy Letby in the news

[Viviennemary]

I've just been watching the BBC news and apparently some experts have been questioning the validity of Lucy Letbys conviction. I must say when I read the details of the trial she did sound 100% guilty. But it would be a tragedy if she is innocent Personally I don't think she is but who knows. Somebody on the news said the only person who knows is Lucy Letby.

I'm sure you and everyone else here believe your absent of biases. That's how biases work.

Says the person who thinks it's a fact people only care because she's a white.

Despite people telling you otherwise.

You're so biased that you've just assigned your own meaning to it and decided that it's because she's white! 😂

Yup

So you'd actually like her to be let out and back on a ward caring for your babies?

I think this conviction is terribly unsafe, but it's pretty clear that if she's found not guilty on appeal, she will never work in the NHS again. I suspect she would need to be given a new identity and possibly a new life in a different country.

Well thank god for that because the idea of her ever being able to practice again is actually chilling. I don't seriously believe it, but then I never thought I'd read so many people desperate to get her out of jail and convinced her convictions will be overturned either.

At this point it just seems like people have made up their minds and are going to parrot "unsafe conviction" forever, there's more than enough evidence it's just because it's a healthcare setting people won't be satisfied with any amount of proof. MN has absolute blinkers on with this woman.

They have to prove beyond reasonable doubt for a prosecution but I think in cases like this involving huge public outrage there is more pressure to prosecute. It I'd awful to imagine someone could have been found guilty of this when they are not. There were articles published about doubts in the conviction that are not accessible from the UK as we've been banned from reading them. That's scary.

Can you imagine what her life would be like if she was freed, she would probably be murdered within a month of leaving prison. I believe from everything I have read that she was guilty, but I honestly think she has some kind of mental illness & would be better off in a secure mental hospital than in prison.

Yes people have made up their mind that they don't think that there was enough evidence or that it was unsafe conviction. No one is going to change their minds just because you keep "parroting" on with the same stuff.

And while it might not last forever, I hate to break it to you but the New Yorker only came out in May and the reporting restrictions were only lifted in the UK in July so all of this is still at an early stage.

BTW, it's not just MN, there's doubt all over reddit and on other forums too.

@Nc209 well they'll just have to wait for Operation Hummingbird to finish and see how they feel about her then won't they. I hate to break it to YOU, but she ain't getting out! People can delude themselves all they like it wont change anything.

Yes they will, and we'll also have to wait to see what happens if she does have an appeal eventually.

None of us (including you) know how this is going to go .

The insulin results are incredibly dubious. The test results say that the particular tests they used shouldn't be used to check for insulin overdose. It's not the correct test. Why her defence didn't pick up on this, and "accepted" that evidence I have no idea.

It's not odd, as that wasn't the only change. At exactly the same time the hospital downgraded the unit from a level 3 to a level 2 unit. So they were taking less sick babies.

That's exactly the sort of thing you say when you are suffering from mental anguish. As anyone would have been at the time she wrote them. I'm not a writer but when I feel mentally unwell I say lots of similar things, blaming myself for things that are nothing to do with me. That I'm not responsible for.

If she had really coldly and callously killed the babies why would she be writing stuff like that? She wouldn't care less, she wouldn't be racked with guilt.

I don't believe anything either way with her but I would hope you never sit on a jury

@Edingril because? I'm the one in agreement with the ones that DID sit on the jury. Funny that. But no all those that know better than them are in this thread apparently.

I think the judicial system is flawed highlighted, to me, in this case, and that a jury of her peers should have been medical professionals

Exactly,

I was reading about this last night. The hospital may even have been downgraded to a 1.

What the families of the babies who died have gone through is truly awful and the suffering of the children doesn't bear thinking about.

None of that means Lucy Letby shouldn't have had a fair trial. And it looks as though she may not have done. Ultimately wrongly convicting a person of a crime helps no one. It devalues the justice system and it means we as a society don't learn lessons from what went wrong and make the changes necessary to stop some bad things from happening.

No one has offered any explanation as to why she did these things, if indeed she did. There's nothing about her background, personality or any explanation for it. In the past whenever anyone has been convicted of multiple murders it has turned out there has been lots of other information withheld from the public which speaks to the person's character. As far as I am aware there is nothing here. The notes she made suggest mental turmoil rather than guilt to me, but much has been made of them.

How would that work? Should the courts have dragged several GPs away from their work for Harold Shipman's trial? Do we get cops in for policemen on trial, and do they have to be the same rank? Conveyancing solicitors for mortgage fraud cases?

Do you think the public would trust the verdicts any more if that were the rule? I don't, there would be constant rumblings about professions closing ranks.

I don't know whether she did it or not, but the notes that you seem to find so persuasive always struck me as particularly shit evidence. It's quite easy to see why someone who hadn't done anything wrong might still blame herself. But people have very emotional responses to it for some reason.

I have never been convinced of her guilt. DH neither. There is real risk of a cover up happening and the trial itself was prejudiced and mostly trial by the public

Actually, adult nurses, midwives and children’s nurses can work in NICU.

personally i dont trust the general public when it comes to being logical and fully understanding of all the science involved in complex cases

On the whole I aim to trust the criminal justice system, because of the huge process that is gone through before a case is even brought to trial.

The impact of the deaths is devastating and utterly tragic for the families.

But some aspects of this case make me uneasy:
i) The lack of forensic evidence actually connecting Lucy Letby to the victims’ deaths;
ii) The lack of any prior history of crime, violence, aggression, animal cruelty or anything else that might point towards her committing this type of crime;
iii) The positive character testimony publicly given by her close friend who had known her for many years;
iv) The fact that miscarriages of justice and unsafe convictions are not unknown.

I don’t know enough to want to give an armchair verdict, but I think the situation is far from resolved, and of course never will be for the families of those poor babies.

I don't know whether she is guilty or not, however I do know evidence was withheld from the courts and defence. The reading of the medical evidence wasn't handled correctly.

I know there are alot of nurses scared and frightened of being implicated in and medical issues.

It does need to be reviewed IMO

https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/nurses-terrified-lucy-letby-conviction/