What’s a fair amount to pay mum for “chikdcare”

[Morph22010]

My mum used to have my son a few days a week when he was little before he started school and in holidays. I used to give her £30 a day. She didn’t ask for this I just paid it her as I thought it was only fair as she doesn’t have much money, I’m by no means rich but we are comfortable. It kind of fizzled out over the pandemic when I was working from home for a couple of years. Ds is now a teenager but has asd. He is ok to stay on his own for short periods but he won’t stay on own all day and he really needs an adult that can get to him at short notice, mum lives round the corner and I work an hour away. This holidays it’s transitioned naturally into him staying in bed till about 11 then calling her to collect him. He’s stays till around 630 but could come home at 3
as that’s time his dad home. It’s been 2 to 3 days a week in hols. Obviously she’s feeding him so there’s a cost and I don’t want her to be out of pocket but I’m thinking £30 a day is a bit much now he doesn’t need so much looking after, although other side of coin he does eat more then when he was little.

she won’t expect anything if I ask her she won’t say a figure so I’ll just need to pay something across, maybe £15 a day? What do people think is fair amount

have the money to be able to pay her £30 a day but im currently putting my spare money in my pension so it will just reduce that amount.

You're more worried about your pension than your son and mother?

Give her £30 minimum! She's keeping him safe and feeding him. Does she ever go out on her own, meet friends etc? Or does she decline invitations so that she's around for him?

Not if she's getting a state pension.

No unfortunately she can’t claim it as she in receipt of state pension. You can only claim carers allowance if state pension less than £81 a week and even then they just pay the off between what you get and £81 but she gets more than £81 anyway

Oh that's a shame , I'm not really au fait with state pension terms, but know you can claim a private pension and carry on working albeit with tax implications.

I've never paid DM or MIL to look after DS I used to leave money in a pot in the kitchen for activities and expenses when they had him one day a week each before he was school age and neither ever touched it, but neither is struggling financially. It's also a bit different in your situation because they knew it was finite for a couple of years until he went to school and ate now very eager to have him in the holidays because they see him less. It really depends on your son's needs and whether your mum sees it as company or care that restricts her life (in the nicest possible way). Could you give her £500 and say that's to cover the additional expenses/food over the summer holidays? I would have to tread very carefully with mine as not to cause offence. If she thought I thought she wanted paying to spend time with DS she'd be cross

To be honest the reason I am worried about my pension, and maybe I am unreasonable in this, is that I think I may have to end up retiring early due to ds, if anything was to happen to his dad for example id have to give up work as I couldn’t afford arrange work round drop offs and pick up for school, dh currently does pick ups and he starts and finishes early. Also I’m not sure if ds will have have anything to go into when he finishes school so we’d have every day to cover not just holidays and I can’t expect my mum to do that plus she is well in her 70s so may not be able in a few years anyway. I had abit of a panic about all this a couple of years ago when dh was ill, nothing serious but made things very hard for couple of weeks, and went back full time on the basis that I needed to earn as much as I could while I could and started putting lump sums in pension

Re the cut off time - you mention he may still want to go at 30.

Not sure what your expectations are around your son’s life as an adult, as he has ASd?
I personally think the ‘cut-off point’ is when your son is able to visit his gran as a visitor, rather than someone who needs support throughout the day. Hopefully that day is not too far away for you all.

@pinkyredrose sorry missed off second bit, she doesn’t go out and meet friends when she has him but if she had plans she say she couldn’t have him that day and I’d work from
home instead

See that’s exactly it, im not sure if we are at that point yet which was reason for my question, probably not but perhaps getting close, but the things why he doesn’t like staying at home are because he doesn’t like it if someone knocks the door or something unexpected happens like he breaks a glass, rather than needing direct support everyday, it’s more a case of someone there for the what ifs. He can sort his own food if he made the effort but obviously he’s happy to let his gran do that for him and will be letting her do the same if he visits at 30. If she wasn’t around we would probably just have to leave him some days but being as we have the choice it does put my mind at rest

Thanks for answering me. Maybe then just look at 18 being the natural cutoff - once he has left school etc. and continue to work with him to be able to lock doors, cope on his own, as you are clearly doing. Wishing you well.

That doesn't sound like your son is anywhere near being left by himself all day. I think you are minimising what your mum is doing which is understandable as it is something you live with. If you really think you'd have to give up work if your husband died you really know that he needs care.

Honestly I think she is worth £30 a day so if she needs it and you can afford it I think it would be good to pay it. I do childcare for free for my GC but I don't need the money, if I was more challenged financially and providing food for a hungry 16 year old boy I would very much appreciate (and need) the money.

He can be left on his own at home on a short term basis, so we’ve previously left him around 4 or 5 hours before, but he can’t really go out far by himself as things outside are too unpredictable. So on a short term basis I would be ok leaving him home for a couple of days a week in the summer hols but if he was to leave school with nothing to go to I couldn’t really leave him at home on his own all day forever as he’d get bored and frustrated

Thanks! He can actually lock doors but last year he locked the door and then dropped the key and the key ring smashed so that’s set him back and he won’t now try again, hopefully we can get him back to this, it’s a big step this year me being able to leave him in bed and he calls my mum later rather than me having to get him up when I leave and take him round so I don’t want to rush too much on everything and set us back again

i don't think you are taking advantage as such. I just think your post comes across as resentful of paying but that might just be the way you have phrased it. Tbh if your mum is short of money I am sure she would rather 'earn it ' in terms of childcare and it sounds like she enjoys the time with her grandson so it sounds a mutually beneficial arrangement.

I assume as your DS has such high needs that he is in receipt of DLA / PIP? If so, surely some of that money should be given you your DM for the days she is caring for him?

TBH, I would weigh his needs that your mum meets against what you would pay for a carer/befriender. You'd be looking at £15 or so an hour for the hours you have mentioned.

In situations where people are using relatives for childcare I'd always say, pay 50% of what you'd be required to pay, so it helps both you and them, but even then you would be paying much, much more than £30 a day.

May I ask, have you put in for disability benefits for your DS? Because if you haven't, I really think that it would be worth doing so, then some of the cost of his care can come from that, and if there's anything left after his needs are met, you could potentially start a savings account to hopefully help meet his needs as he ages because Nan will not always be well enough to give this support and paid care is going to cost a much different sum to what you're paying currently.

Use some of DS DLA/PIP money to pay your DM £30 she is enabling you to work while providing your son safe, reliable care and company. Wish I had a DM like that!
I personally think you should pay her more like £50 plus paying towards DS food.

It's a bit rich you are squirrelling money away for your pension by using her free labour. You are really minimising how much she helps you, DH and your DS. But if you pay her reasonably it's a win win.

If you have concerns your DHs health isn't good and you will be left a widow then you should both get life insurance which will pay a lump sum if the worse happens.

When your DS finishes school he can go to college surely? Have you looked into SEN colleges which will help teach him independence skills & grow his confidence? Does he have a EDHCP? Or a social worker?

will I still needs to give her £30 a day when he’s 30 if he decides he wants to go round to visit his gran for the day as he doesn’t like staying at home on his own

I don’t think she should be put in this position. Fine if she invites him round for a day, but this sounds like she might be used as a default carer in future whenever it’s convenient for him. Ok if it’s once every six months, what what if it’s 4 times a week? That’s just not fair on her.

Oh no it’s not that at all, if anything it’s the opposite! We had arrangement when ds was little then covid happened and I worked from home for a few years so I didn’t need the help but ds used to ask to go round and visit sometimes during the day she was happy for him to visit. Then last summer I worked mainly from home as I could leave ds in bed and get on with work early whereas if I took him to mums it means dragging him out of bed which is a chore in itself! This year because I’ve been able to leave him for the first time he’s been round there more, at least 2 days a week except first week when we were away and I’ve not actually paid her anything so it was more me thinking I really must give her something and not knowing what rather than complaining

Has an ehcp and at specialist school but to date I’ve not identified a suitable college that is suitable as be doesn’t have learning difficulties. We don’t qualify for social care so don’t have a social worker

That’s the thing though if he didn’t go there I wouldn’t pay anyone. It’s only in holidays and he tends to get up around 11 ( that’s when he goes round my mums) and dh gets home from work at 3 so if ds didn’t go round so he’d be home awake alone for 4 hours and we’ve left him longer than that before so he should be ok. However he likes going round my mums and it does give me some piece of mind when I’m at work. If we didn’t have the option we’d just manage without but we do have the option and dm doesn’t mind but I really feel I should be giving her something but I can’t compare to what I’d be paying if she wasn’t there as that would be nothing and I want to give her something

Minimum wage is £11.40 something per hour, so if you are paying her then that's what you give her. You are setting up an employer-employee relationship.

Ok I’ve just looked back and worked it out she will have had him 11 days in total during the holidays so at 7 hours a day at 11.40 an hour this works out to £877. I lent her £1000 a couple of months ago when she needed to get her car fixed and she keeps asking me to set her up a standing order on online banking so she can pay me back. I’ve not set up the standing order as I wasn’t going to ask for it back so shall I just say keep that to cover having ds or is that a bit mean being as I wasn’t going to ask for it back anyway (although she doesn’t know this)

If my maths are correct she’s 76? If you can work from home I think you probably should. Maybe your mum can have him once a week, and your dh can pick him up at 3. Buy your mum some lunch bits that he likes.

She’s 72 next week. It’s difficult as they are so close because she looked after him when he was little and she lives alone, over covid and after when he started his new school due to circumstances he didn’t go round much at all during term time and she really missed him so he started going round one night a week for a couple of hours more recently in term time. She always tells me she loves having him round and they play board games and watch tv programmes but obviously it’s a fine line between her saying she loves having him round and me taking advantage

I lost my DM at 70.
It sounds like you have a lovely supportive family & I have no idea why you wouldn’t want to support your DM financially whether that is paying for her care/companionship directly so she knows you appreciate all she does or indirectly (as you say the odd £1k ‘loan’ which doesn’t need to be paid back here and there).
it sounds a lovely arrangement and you never know one day your DS may be able to reciprocate the care & companionship for your DM when she might need it.