Pip claim help

[Whatnownownow]

My adult son has just heard back to see if he will be awarded pip and they've awarded him 0 points for everything which seems crazy. I was there for the assessment on the phone and the report even says that he has difficulties with certain things.... No mention of him saying that I have to support him with lots of the criteria... Then still awards 0 anyway?! Is this common?

They generally say it shows that someone has cognitive and physical abilities, therefore should be able to manage other activities.

It took me three years, two claims (both scoring 0 on all counts after assessment) a mandatory reconsideration followed by a long wait to tribunal. Finally I am now on the enhanced rate for both. Make sure you challenge them all the way. PIP is a complete joke, it's so humiliating but if you take to tribunal most people win. It's worth the fight/ long wait in the end. Don't give up x

I read it as you said your dad so I replied then I realised I didn’t read it properly and you said your DD! Silly me

Well no, it can show they can focus on an exam topic for 90 minutes 17 years ago.... Not whether they need me to tell them to eat or wash

This is bonkers though! My DD didn't need 1-2-1 in school (until she burnt out 18 months ago, still trying to get EHCP) but she needs prompting to eat, supervision to cook (just today she has cut herself accidentally with a knife whilst chopping onions and burnt her finger on the edge of the saucepan), supervision to remember to take her medication, frequently gets lost if she goes out for a walk by herself, will not get public transport so I have to take her everywhere.

She's 16 and qualified for DLA last year, so I'm waiting for the letter that says we need an assessment for PIP and I am ready! DD has autism, she takes everything at face value. If the assessor says "can you cook a meal?" she'll say yes. She won't point out that she needs help, can only use a hob or air fryer, not an oven, won't eat on days she's exhausted. Can't follow a written recipe, needs a video with subtitles. If the recipe goes wrong, she'll get frustrated, give up and walk away and not eat. She won't wash up because it's sensory hell. But unless she's asked a direct question, she won't offer that information.

Make sure you become her appointee, so that you can deal with the claim. If you don’t, she will have to do the assessment herself and they will direct all questions to her.

What the assessors say, and what the law says about eligibility, are usually very different.

@WaitingForMojo thank you, I am already confirmed as her appointee. A local charity does training on DLA and PIP applications and the lady running the courses is amazing, tells you all the pitfalls to be aware of, and this was the first thing she said to do!

I have found a site called Benefits and work very impressive over the years. It was ten pounds per year, but some parts are free. Run by very experienced benefits advisers, who have seen everything. They know the tricks the assessors use and tell you how to get the award you deserve. After one very bad experience, I involved my MP a who made people jump. You need to immerse yourself in the system to have a chance, the information is out there to help you. Did you supply a detailed witness system of what you see everyday?
Also when soon answers don’t let them twist his words and assume you will be watched from the minute you exit the car till you get back in. Good luck

@WaitingForMojo

Do you work for the pips company?

The PIP assessor admitted I have difficulties but said I didn’t meet the threshold to be assigned any points. The fact I drive an adapted car was used as a reason why I can do everything from undertaking complex cognitive tasks to making journeys unaided.

Get back in the car where?

I did, yes I wrote a witness statement saying everything I do for him on a daily basis

So he does? Or he doesn’t work OP?

There are 3 different things considered in PIP: physical limitations, mental health requiring prompting, or cognitive limitations requiring support.

Physical: mainly activities 1, 4, 5, 6, 12
Mental: activities 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 9, 10, 11
Cognitive: mainly activities 1, 3, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11

To back up physical limitations: GP appointments, pain team, prescriptions, specialist appointments/referrals, scans, x-rays, official diagnosis, doses of pain relief, when pain medications were last reviewed

To back up mental health problems: GP appointments, medications, therapy, community mental health nurses, psychiatrists, dietitians, tests to diagnose, official diagnosis with ongoing support.

To back cognitive limitations: specialist school, official diagnosis of either a learning disability, brain damage or impairment, dementia etc, professional support, memory tests/clinic, neurologist report/letter.

Not all, but just some of these depending on the type of condition you are claiming for. Bare in mind, the assessment alone is not enough to prove disability- anyone can claim they have one- if the degree of disability is significant there will be some of this evidence available and you should submit letters from those professionals. There are, of course, people who don’t seek help but unfortunately that will not help in the world of PIP.

The bar is high. If the person is that impaired/disabled, this input as above will be there. Submit that evidence. In short: your word is not enough, typically,

It's hard ( but not impossible) to go from zero points to enough for an award. You need 8 in each component for standard award. So you need to look at which descriptors you think he should have scored points on and provide relevant medical evidence to support what you are asking for.

It happens all the time it’s creates so much unnecessary stress

from now on do everything in writing, make sure you have copied

and do not hold back, but in as many details as you can and from a stance of when your ds needs the most support (I am not sure if he has good days and not so good days, but if he does detail the mandatory reconsideration from his not so good days)

and look up advice on how to complete the paperwork, terminology you should use etc

Exactly this

Ring for a copy of the report, then when you actually have the report ring & say you will be sending a mandatory reconsideration in writing, you then have 28 days to do it. Go through the report line by line & work out what your arguments are for the points he needs, write everything in bullet points. Once the election is over, get in touch with your MP & ask for help. If he has any extra things like letters from the hospital or reports send them in. Do you have a copy of his original application & anything you sent with it? If you do, don't be afraid to refer to what you have already sent in, the DWP worker who rang me to tell me they were going to increase my award back to what I originally got told me they only use the form, not any reports sent with it until the case gets to the appeal stage. If your MR gets refused, then appeal, from when you appeal, the DWP has 28 days to review everything before it goes to the tribunal service, lots of cases are overturned in this time because it costs the DWP money for every case that goes to tribunal. If you have to go to tribunal, it can take up to a year for the case to be heard. You can also report the assessor to their governing body, mine was to the Nursing & Midwifery Council, you can also make a complaint about the DWP.

I've just seen you have a recording, go back & listen to it all, if there are any discrepancies from the assessment & the report. Quote word for word in your mandatory reconsideration & let them know you have a recording, when ds was assessed. We told the assessor that he was under a psychologist but in the report it said he had no help for mental health, we were able to quote when in the assessment we told them that. It was overturned within a week.

Don't forget he can only do an activity if he can do it reliably, repeatedly & safely, if he can't do any of the three, he can't do it. If you are on Facebook, there is a group called UK ME & Chronic Illness Benefits Advice Group, they are brilliant helping with mandatory reconsiderations & appeals.

The assessors are there to trip you up, I am currently trying to get an award for a relative who takes a cocktail of meds for a range of conditions that affect them drastically. We recently submitted a request for mandatory reconsideration and we are thoroughly expecting to have to go to tribunal. They'd be destitute without my support, which puts an incredible financial strain on me.

The assessors play all nicey nicey on the phone but don't give a monkey's backside about being truthful. And don't even get me started on how utterly rubbish the company formerly called Atos is, first assessment they didn't bother turning up at all, second time they cancelled on the day, third time they finally showed their hypocritical faces on zoom but only because we'd made a fuss and broken down on the phone. Apparently the two bits of the company don't link up. They're a disgrace, frankly. I'm not surprised they lost the contract going forward.

I despise the PIP assessors we've encountered, more than one of them has let slip their registration as a healthcare professional isn't even still in date. And quite what a not even still practising speech and language therapist, say, would know about orthopaedic or cardiac problems or pain levels is a mystery to me.

The whole system is designed to make you give up. It drags on and on and they have a habit of sending you letters that are dated days or weeks earlier but arrive on the day you need to appeal, strangely. Funny how long Royal Mail takes to deliver letters to and from Belfast and the West Midlands these days.

Strangely you'll find very few actual nurses in those PIP assessor jobs, probably because they'd have far too much understanding of medical conditions for the DWP's liking.

Good luck, anyway, I hope you get a positive outcome.

I know someone who does this job.
The process is largely set up and controlled by the DWP. There is no way a health professional would be allowed to do the job without registration; it’s a sackable offence but this is checked. You can report anyone who has a lapsed registration to the appropriate registering body; they will then be in a lot of trouble.
I don’t doubt there are some unpleasant people doing these assessments. It is true that they have to ask, probe, etc. The reason for this is, unfortunately, some people lie and without the process anyone could claim PIP. If you have the medical evidence to back up what you can’t do,it is very difficult to argue against that.

That being said, the system does suck, and I know because I’ve applied myself in the past. The degree of disability is high to be eligible, never mind if you can’t work etc. This is the government’s doing. The assessors have to go by the guidelines they have otherwise the DWP send the report back.

It must be difficult for them to know what is the truth. I recently helped a client with PIP form and supporting through assessment. Client's relative who had not seen her for over 2 years but said she spoke to her on the phone daily wrote loads ( pages and pages) of supporting evidence portraying her as mentally ill with memory problems, unable to do this that and the other, not able to go out alone etc. in reality this client had just retired from an active, highly responsible job caring for others where she travelled across the city daily by public transport and was questioned by the assessor on her recent working life, and there was no medical evidence on her GP summary or from anywhere else that she had MH issues, no medication for this. People do lie and exaggerate and I do sometimes feel for these assessors because they have to just go by what solid evidence is in front of them. I have seen clients that I know well blatantly exaggerate in front of a tribunal with no evidence and then a few months later go and ask for a PIP review based on the same exaggerations and again no evidence. It's just time wasting and makes it harder for the genuine ones.
Someone ( A Nurse) that I used to work with had worked in an assessors role. Se said they have extensive training in all conditions. I have known two people work as assessors and they both said what an awful job it was and nearly broke them. they struggle to recruit and I honestly think the way people are assessed has to change.

It’s a shit job….don’t imagine anyone does it for long….just as a stopgap as it’s a wfh job now mostly…..and the money is shit too….. 35k ….. as a registered professional you not going to stay long and earn that

So what happened when you reported the professional to their registering body? Which I assume you did because you wouldn’t kick off this much and not report surely?