Is it really that bad in the UK?

[BlastedPimples]

I don't live in U.K. anymore but was over visiting at the weekend for a wedding.

So lovely to catch up with people I'd not seen for yonks.

BUT every single person I chatted to was so gloomy about the state of the U.K. All professionals (civil servant, TV producer, charity head for example) so perhaps protected from some of the poverty.

I have never heard people express such pessimism even with the approaching GE.

Is it really that bad?

To add,
my parent moved here with me with less than £400 in their pocket and was able to build a life so it says alot when people who are born and educated in the UK can't afford the basics.

I can't really speak for anyone else but life is pretty good.

It's not brilliant but not that bad. NHS has lots of problems but every day people do access healthcare and get seen at hospital appts so it works for the majority of people. I know some people have difficulty getting GP appointments but I can often get one on the same day I call or always within a few days. I also have an nhs dentist and there are others available where I live. Housing to buy is very expensive in some places but there are cheaper options in my area. Rents are expensive everywhere, more social housing is needed. Childcare costs are very expensive. I think however, a lot of these issues are the same in some other countries, not just in the UK.

I quite enjoy a good moan.

But I am.intrigued what happens in other countries who apparently don't moan.

So if something gets worse like rent increases, do people just get in with it and not mention it?

Or do they organise some effective lobby group that makes change happen but without complaining about how things are. So instead of "this is shit" It's 'this would be even better if'?

Is a symptom of adversarial politics and first past the post v consensus politics and different electoral symptoms.

I feel like I have to choose between financial security and mental health/staying in an unhappy relationship and I'm sure other people feel the same. Where in the past people would stay in relationships for the kids im sure more people are staying for financial reasons
This. I have often thought this must be the case now. The amount of women who must feel trapped in terrible relationships as housing is so unaffordable and so inaccessible.

Gosh. I know I'm privileged, but I know a heck of a lot of people just like me. Most went to uni, most have professional jobs (nurse, journalist, designer, PR etc) as well as a number who didn't but have vocational skills (couple builders, decorators). Most own their own homes. Sure we have had to get rid of some nonessentials and are watching the bottom line like never before, but not gloomy.
Also know a fair number of people who are doing very well and are still skiing every winter and island hopping in the summer.
Maybe I'm older than most but I remember how awful it was in the 1970s, then followed the booming 80s!
I have no trouble getting an appointment at my GP, though for anything that requires a specialist the wait is long. But I see the way healthcare is in the US and I'm very happy either way it in comparison (my sister is a doctor there, my niece has special medical needs). Three very good primaries within walking distance (don't know about secondaries). Sure this isn't true for everyone but can only speak for what I experience.
I'd rather live here than just about anywhere else.

This.

For me, it's not great but I wouldn't say we're any different from other western countries.
Property prices are unattainable for a lot of people, the job market is very difficult at the moment and the nhs is on it knees.
However, I see similar severity of issues, whether its severe weather, far right politics or rising costs.
For me personally, at the moment we make ends meet, have jobs, and a mortgaged house. I'm aware things can change in an instant though and I'm nervous about the future. But for now we're ok and many across the world have it far far worse.

You know its bad when reactionary populist political limited companies like reform are gaining ground.

No. We are a wealthy democracy, with a social welfare system for those who need it.
Most people live incredibly good lives, even in comparison with only 20 or 30 years ago.
But, for some reason, many people also like to have a moan!

"I live in social housing" being the relevant part here.
So of course you're fine!

There are 2 things at play (in my view), the government (which I won’t go into as it’s been covered on here a lot already) and the quality of the public.

Labour seemed to grow a kind of underclass in this country with overly generous benefits and a welfare system that practically supported unemployment. Then we lurched from that to austerity and beyond, so we have enormous numbers of people used to welfare and not working, who equally aren’t being propped up in the way they used to be. So… the public has gone downhill and we have a huge cross section of people unable to do the most basic things for themself, who feel everything should be done for them by the state and if not ‘blame the tories’.

And because people are united by the hatred of a common enemy, people reaffirm them in their feelings that everything should be provided to them in return for giving nothing ‘but the tories won’t do it’.

I had an interesting conversation with a French friend of my dad’s about 15 years ago where he warned me Britain would drift and eventually sink, because of our lack of society and vision, and devaluing of work/education/standards while simultaneously believing our country to be immutably wealthy and powerful due to its past. I was about 18 so didn’t really understand it at the time but there’s never been a truer word spoken.

I’m middle of the road, I have no time for left or right wing politics, I support a moderate approach and will be reluctantly voting for Starmer.

But the issue isn’t just with the government - it’s with the people as well.

Exactly. We love to moan here. I’ve lived all over the world and was dreading being relocated back here. But in general it’s fine.

Maybe I'm older than most but I remember how awful it was in the 1970s, then followed the booming 80s!

Isn’t that’s what’s changed though, in the past we had boom & bust cycles but we never recovered from the 08 crash. In the past people hoped, believed that things would get better & many people who struggled with a young family etc did find themselves in a better position 20 yrs later. Things aren’t improving for many people.

So if something gets worse like rent increases, do people just get in with it and not mention it?

Renting isn’t like the UK in many other countries.

https://www.euronews.com/health/2023/07/06/uk-has-one-of-the-lowest-life-expectancies-among-rich-countries-why
This blames a lack of clinical staff - so NHS funding and long term strategy.

The economy also noticeable not grown compared to other western countries.

It's not a war zone and there are still many worse countries out there but it's a decline though wonder if UK media and election campaigning is emphasising all this.

Thing I've found so depressing lately is the level of corruption in so many public institutions and people in public life - a lack of standards - that feels corrosive and lead to loss of trust and lack of optimism in future.

It's becoming more like America - ok if you have enough money but scary if you don't.

It really is. Especially with regard to health care, including dentistry and opticians.

But its easy to see how politicians have got away with it, given the apathy on this thread with people saying, well it was worth in history and , its not better anywhere else ( actually, it is!)

Alot of vulnerable people are being put in worse situations and are protected less due to cuts and government decisions.
I've been one of those people, although lesser so now. It's absolutely dire for a huge amount of people. So yes, it's awful.
The next generation and children are not getting the help they need. The disabled are not getting the resources they require for functioning and safety. I'm one of them, although I've luckily got a roof over my head now away from abuse.
It's shocking that disabled children are not getting the tailored in and out of school and it is becoming unsafe.
Read a few threads on here about parents not being able to meet a child's needs due to cut backs and treatments/equipment being out of reach.
I know a woman with a little girl that has cerebral palsy. She hasn't got the equipment need led to bath her safely and the occupational therapist appointed to her that she was for years on a waiting list for is on sick and doesn't know when they will be back.
It's bad.

Absolutely awful.

Just come back from a trip abroad and it's depressing af in comparison now I'm back home. Filthy, litter everywhere, people doing drug deals down the street in broad daylight, people walking around high off their faces, homeless people everywhere. People getting stabbed by strangers for literally no reason. It's declined so slowly people haven't realised how bad it's got.

15 years ago I used to walk home alone at 2am without thinking twice. Yesterday I took a different route to work at 9am because there was a dodgy guy attempting to approach me.

Meanwhile in mainland Europe it's clean streets, clean services (buses looked brand new because they were so clean), nothing smells like pee, everyone has all their teeth at 30 years old, all the fruit and veg is so big and fresh. We are living in a dump. Sewage pumped into rivers, nuclear waste pumped in the Irish Sea making it the most radioactive in the world, yet we're fed all this "world beating" bullshit about everything. What a joke.

Yes I think it is that bad. DH and I are both above average earners (but far from loaded) and it's getting harder and harder to afford "luxuries" like meals out and weekends away. My eldest is 13 now and I was very lucky to be able to work part time when both my DC were little and we bought a house in that time too, I really don't think we'd be able to afford that now.
I don't know how people on lower salaries or single parents are managing.
And then there's the state of the NHS, GP appointments, availability of medicines, dentists, opticians, even vets!

All professionals (civil servant, TV producer, charity head for example) so perhaps protected from some of the poverty.

Wait til AI comes after their jobs; they really will have reason to be pessimistic then.

This made me think - how normal it's become for people to eat out frequently and have weekends away. I think this is quite a recent thing as it was unusual to do so when I was a child.
When I was growing up in the 80s we never ate out. Well, I remember one occasion where we went to a restaurant and it was a very big deal! In contrast, my kids are used to going to restaurants a couple of times a month (or more).
Also, as a child we never had weekends away. We'd have a one week holiday in the UK every year and that was it. Again, my kids have a lot more trips than I ever did!
Maybe it's only recently that it's become normal for people to eat out frequently, have weekends away etc. Now people can't afford it they feel hard done by. Before, these things really were very occasional treats for most people.

I'm selling my flat and splitting the proceeds with the ex. I live in London, I'm 46, with a good job. Yet I won't be able to buy in London again. So I have to rent. In the LB of Lewisham (where my daughter goes to school) I can't rent a two bed poky flat for less than £1600. It's obscene.

Once DD has decided to go it alone I'm buying in the East Midlands, but even then it's not going to be a huge place. Probably a terrace.

I don't know how most people survive on the "average" income. It must be so so hard.

Swings and roundabouts

Either you look towards the positives or you don't

So eating out, whilst we could, it's just not worth the higher prices anymore, well not as often anyway. So we stay in,but we need to really to help the teens through secondary exams.

I think our secondary schools are extremely inclusive, nothing special but they give the pupils everything they need to pass with god grades, up to them if they put the work in.

We are a temperate island, east Atlantic, so will be a little protected from extreme weather events in the future.

Saying this, we are all revising our language so we can get our dual EU passports, well mainly for the teens, and we are strongly suggesting the kids think about looking to EU or USA long term. Brexit has isolated the UK and there are definitely strains on medicine supplies and food.

I think people forget the good things we have, our democracy still sort of works, the NHS whilst struggling is still free at the point of use, women can wear what they want, all children are educated by law, we are free to live with and live whom we want, to worship or not worship, to discuss whatever we like, journalism can report the truth, guns aren't readily available.

I think some people forget sometimes that we are in a better position than some, not so good as others perhaps. Which is probably just about right for our global standing at this moment in time.

When I was growing up in the 80s we never ate out.

Eating out wasn’t as much of thing as a lot of the options were fine dining which is still now not something people do every weekend. Going out was a thing in the 80s eg going to the pub. Younger people have less disposable incomes now after housing costs so it’s just what money is spent on that has changed.