Birth trauma - poor maternity tolerated as normal report says

[Justkeepswiimming]

Is this the experience of the majority?

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4n1jv7xxpwo?trk=public_post_comment-text

I think we all have pretty grim tales to tell of Birth experiences. From both our own experiences and those of our friends. Are the resources just not there to care? I had a wonderful Midwife who delivered my baby, but prior to that had to beg for someone to check me once I'd been induced because I was in agony. Was written off as being a wimp. They wouldn't check me. I was in tears in a shared ward, on my own trying to make no noise. When they finally checked me they realised I was far along and sent me to the labour ward.

The next day I was desperate to leave, after finding myself with a male midwife who didn't even introduce themselves before starting to express me. A horrid experience. All round.

I've read lots of awful stories, and wonder how we've got here.

I had two amazing birth experiences because I had elective cesareans but I have heard nothing but horrible experiences from family/colleagues etc. most recently my SIL who had an awful time.

I recently miscarried and had a horrible time during the MVA procedure where staff treated me like some kind of insane person because I was upset and again you don’t have to look far to find another raft of these stories

My Mum was left disabled from birth injuries in the 80’s so this isn’t a new phenomena. I just think that if men gave birth then the whole process would be smoother and better.

@HubbaNubba a c section won’t necessarily be easier, the recovery is difficult especially as you might not be able to have your DH helping you on the postnatal ward. I had a c section at 11pm, DH was allowed to stay with us in the recovery room until about 4am. I was then taken to the postnatal ward, we hadn’t been given a heads up that DH would have to leave at the door and so I had no idea where nappies etc had been put in all my bags, in fact all my bags were left behind my bed with no way for me to access them. You won’t be able to get out of bed or go to the bags after your operation. Midwives took ages to answer the buzzer when I needed them to pass my baby. It was very stressful especially as a FTM I had no idea what I was doing anyway!

Because the stories in the paper dont make scientific sense. The way they describe what happened, what went wrong, and what it caused are often messed up.

Like one woman said her baby only got jaundice due to poor breastfeeding support. Jaundice is a physiological occurrence that happens as a result of high fetal haemoglobin. Any baby can become jaundiced. What can happen in a baby who isnt feeding well is a level of jaundice which is harmful. But poor care didnt cause her baby to become jaundiced. The fact she may have left believing that is a travesty.

Whilst it doesn't compare to the horrible things that happened to some of the women in the BBC article, some of what they said resonated with me, particularly that as soon as the babies are born, any amazing care care you might have received during birth just disappears.

After my first EMCS, I was manhandled by some sort of HCA with no bedside manner. She wheeled me in to the shower (those of you who've had C-Sections will know how fast they like you to shower) turned the shower on which soaked my gown and my towels through and just left me there. I remember feeling humiliated and anxious, being unable to fully stand up due to the pain and wondering how the fuck I was actually supposed to wash myself. The same HCA had told me to go to the toilet where I'd had a bowel movement but couldn't reach to wipe myself and again had just left me there to figure it out.

About four weeks after my second C-Section four years later (during which I'd lost huge amounts of blood and needed a transfusion), I had a secondary haemorrhage. I was sent by 111 to an out of hours clinic where I was left to sit in a pool of my own blood in the waiting room. Again, humiliating. I asked if they had anything they could give me because regular sanitary towels was like trying to soak up a bath with a ball of cotton wool - I'd put it on and it'd be sodden immediately - and they just shrugged their shoulders at me. I was sent to another hospital where the same thing happened. I just remember feeling embarrassed and humiliated.

There's no dignity in any of it and whilst my experiences are fairly trivial and in no way traumatising, it does make you feel dehumanised.

But that's because those doctors didn't work in state hospitals, not because such levels of care are not provided in state hospitals in other systems. The UK is a developed country with sufficient resources, funded by taxpayers, to support far better maternity care and other medical services. This mantra of free care is often used to justify poor levels of care.

Its because there are far fewer hospitals for poor people. The NHS provides the same level of (increasingly shit) care to everyone. In some countries, the poorest people have no feasible access to any healthcare.

I know id prefer a system where i can access some healthcare that wont be determined by my class or current wealth.

Nothing that I didn't already learn when pregnant with my 3yo, it's the reason I paid thousands to go private so I could have my daughter at home

I actually made a thread on here about how I was disturbed at the amount of women having inductions and it seemed odd. Basically got burned at the stake by mumsnet.

Anyway, I told you so.

Can’t believe this is still ongoing! Dd1 nearly 18 her birth was an absolute shit show and my expectations were low. She nearly died and only didn’t because of Dh. We both woke up screaming in the night for about a month after it. Was emergency c section but it was the aftercare that was the problem

Dd 2 was vbac in hospital outside London was absolutely fine - a different world.

I’ve given birth 4 times and while I had some excellent care for parts of two of the births the rest was VERY far from ok.

I don't think anyone could read that and think it is trivial.

I am so sorry, that is horrendous for you.

Which countries are you referring to? Of similar level of development to the UK? I have lived in many countries with similar levels of developments to the UK and it's only in the UK where such poor levels of care in state hospitals and not only in maternity, are considered acceptable.

The quote about poor care being considered normal really got me. Anyone who’s listened to a woman’s experience, either IRL or online, knows that it true. Not that good care doesn’t happen, but that no professional particularly cares when the care is bad. There’s always an excuse.

I’ve never forgotten the hell of the postnatal ward, how frightened I felt, being in so much pain I couldn’t speak (I’d had surgery for a third degree tear). There was no care or supervision. The baby wasn’t feeding and no one noticed or cared. A midwife from that ward was struck off a couple of years later for being dangerously incompetent. All normal for NHS maternity care. Frankly I’m lucky we didn’t come off worse.

Those on the thread trying to downplay the report - you are wrong. I already knew all this just from talking to other women and listening to them. I haven't met a woman in real life who hasn't had some kind of interference in her birth, how can that be? Because they are micromanaging our births and undermining our confidence in our bodies and our instincts

Many European countries. Even Spain. And in Spain, the poorer you are, the less automony you have over your care. Your family have ti wash and feed you in the hospital. Nurses provide medical but not personal care.

Some of our Spanish staff are shocked that new mothers dont have a female.relative coming to help them shower and stuff after birth and that HCAs often do that. Even if their mum and husband are present!

I would definitely have a ELCS if I was in
in your situation again.
I chose to stick at one dc due to my labour experience

I still feel upset if I talk about my birth experience 10 yrs ago.i totally get it.

Do nurses provide personal care in UK maternity wards? That's a first for me. The nurses left me after 24 hours of pain and an emergency caesarian where I and my son almost died to look after myself and my son completely on my own. And I did ask them if they could help once with the change of the nappies and they explained that it's not their responsibility. I did not take a shower for all the 4 days I was there as I was unable to after the surgery and no-one helped with this either. If this is what you mean by autonomy, I guess I was provided with plenty. But I would not call this autonomy. The example from Spain btw points to something more cultural rather than medical, i.e. that the burden of birth is shared with other family members. Of course, sometimes this means it can substitute aspects of care that medical professionals could provide but this is not its primary function. In the UK, mothers and babies are left completely on their own.

The experiences of some women are horrific, absolutely horrific and I was nervous about giving birth to my baby, now only 3 months old.

In the end, although my labour, birth and postnatal experience were not without complication, I was believed when I said I was in pain, I was listened to, I was given the opportunity to ask questions, and I received attentive care. This should be a bare minimum standard and it's sad that it stands out on here.

I paid a lot of attention to specific, extremely sad cases that were reported in the media prior to my pregnancy. I had to keep reminding myself that those were not my experiences. Hundreds of thousands of babies are born in the UK each year and although it doesn't always go to "plan" (use that term loosely!) the vast majority are born safely and go home healthy. They just aren't the stories you hear.

as soon as the babies are born, any amazing care care you might have received during birth just disappears

I’ve been saying this for over 12 years @Tosstyhat. Never a truer word has been spoken.

Many, many women, of course, don’t even get that.

Midwives usually look after women post section. HCAs should help if they can.

A lot of maternity professionals are overly attached to delivering healthy babies to grateful parents. They live for that moment of misdirected gratitude at the moment of birth.

My midwife friend is seriously annoyed by the press coverage. Nobody is denying that these cases occurred but there is no balance that the vast majority of births have no complications at all. There's also no balance that some of the complications are due to underlying health conditions.

To her it's bashing midwives and hospitals that are doing just fine, implying they are not. The report is not about everyone birth just those that didn't go to plan, the news implies this is the norm , it isn't

Haha of course she is. If ever there was a profession allergic to reflection and accountability.

I think you're being snide, aren't you?

I am aware there is a distinction between what midwives call 'active labour' and the period of time some women spend in hospital before the birth of their child. But when someone says, in a non-medical context, 'how long were you in for with DS?' and someone else replies 'oh, it was awful, I was in labour for three days,' it's easy to understand what they mean.

I agree with the PP that if there are things that don't make medical sense, that indicates a failure of care. It is frightening when people don't know what's happened to them medically. Dismissing it with a smug 'glaring discrepancies' is missing the point.

Personally, there are a ton of things I still do not understand about my DD's birth. I'm a reasonably intelligent, reasonably educated person, and I have tried to understand, but the information just isn't there. FWIW I gave evidence to the inquiry, and I am still horrified by what I heard from other people, including a woman breaking down in tears because she could not get her mind around what had been done to her body. The whole fucking point is that she'd not been given any understanding of it by the medics, so she couldn't process it or deal with it.

My birth experience was awful, but it was in the ‘90s.

Put on a drip which gave ano break between contractions. Literally hours of being left in a room and told to ring the buzzer if heart monitor dropped below a number, then ringing the buzzer but no-one came. No doctor available to give a epidural. Baby whisked off to special care while I was left in stirrups attached to a drip for what seemed like an eternity.
We went down the route of medical negligence as were told child had birth trauma. Medical expert opinion was that the care provided was sub standard but couldn’t be narrowed down as the cause of child’s difficulties.
I had PTSD but didn’t know that’s what it was until many years later. Had elective CS with the next pregnancy.
Had EMDR several years back.