I know, why don't we send them all to Rwanda?

[Weighnow]

Does anyone else think this sounds like a suggestion someone made as a joke, to liven up a dull or fraught meeting and somehow, someone decided to run with it?

I think they want the money 🤔

Except the ones they have sent have been part of a voluntary resettlement and even then there’s been issues.

So we should do something immoral at best because other countries are or might be doing it?

Trafficking is big business, the profit per boat is about £100k so you can see why it’s attractive. No recourse obviously if it goes wrong which is does often

Low barriers to entry and endless supply of people ready to sell their service

It won’t just be the U.K. finding it hard to deal with, they already are but it will get harder

He might want the money that comes with them, but they absolutely don't need more people. Haven't got a clue.

If all asylum seekers vanished tomorrow, our problems would not be solved; you would notice no difference. If all immigrants vanished tomorrow you would notice a difference. We would be in deep, deep shit.

Has the bat signal gone out to Reform UK or something?

Somebody asked a question, I answered it in part.

But here is my question for you - why are these people passing through multiple safe countries on their way here, without claiming assylum?

If all asylum seekers vanished tomorrow, our problems would not be solved; you would notice no difference. If all immigrants vanished tomorrow you would notice a difference. We would be in deep, deep shit

Why conflate asylum seekers with immigrants?

If asylum seekers specifically vanished, it would probably not be noticeable except to the poorest sector of society

Why do you need that explained to you? Don't you think you would have a preference for where you live? Stupid question with obvious answers.

No we don't. We have a massive amount of people who have made state benefits a life style choice. And no I'm talking about disabled people and carers, vulnerable women escaping abuse etc. I'm talking about those who have never had a job and have no intention of actually getting one.

Because people who dislike asylum seekers generally dislike other immigrants too.

Some folks want to welcome the whole world to this small island. But it's the same folks bemoaning not being able to get a doctor's appointment, overcrowding on public transport and roads, not enough housing etc.

See also: being intensely relaxed about the arrival of thousands of unknown young men, from very unwoke cultures, who can hide any past convictions, yet also being (rightly) very concerned about homophobia and misogyny.

Indeed. This has been explained over and over again, but people still think it is a "gotcha".

I wonder why they are so keen to get to the UK, having passed through many safe countries where they could settle safely? Why would that be their preference, to the extent of taking unsafe trips across the channel?

we should ban the rnli and the border patrol from bringing them ashore too!!

RNLI is a charity set up to save lives on water. They tend not to go rifling through the pockets of people in peril on the sea to check their residency status.

The Royal Navy and MoD flatly refused to 'push back' boats in the Channel, that was the end of that idea.

I don't know why it puzzles you as it is very well documented and there have been countless news articles published on this. It boils down to:

1. Family and friends already in the UK. If they have family and friends already in say, France, or Netherlands, or Germany, they obviously go there instead.
2. English language. English is the most widely spoken language in the world and many people, especially if they come from an ex-British colony, are going to have at least a smattering of English. Obviously if they come from an ex-French or Belgian colony they tend to go to France or Belgium instead.
3. Keep on moving. People tend to travel west until they find somewhere safe and welcoming - the theory is that they really have the dream of getting to the USA but there is a rather large ocean in the way - it's a nice theory but I'm not sure how much evidence there is for it. Britain and Ireland are the end of the line.
4. Ease of work. The UK does not have ID cards and it is trivially easy to work illegally, far easier than in countries with a rigorous ID system such as France or Germany. We don't have any sort of coherent system of citizen and resident register, no household register, no rent register, no national employment register - it's easier to 'disappear' in the UK than just about any other Western European country. Fixing this would be hugely unpopular as very large numbers of Brits (particularly employers and landlords) themselves take advantage of the laxity of the system. This is the vision that is sold by a lot of the people smugglers.

Language, culture, opportunity, family ties. Sometimes there is a lack of understanding that other countries might be a viable option. Aspiration is a big factor I think. It's also really bloody expensive, and there's often a huge amount of pressure to make it to the best possible place to provide or send for family.
I really don't think it's that hard to grasp. Faux naivety as if you wouldn't do the exact same thing in their shoes.

Here you go. This is a good summary.

x.com/ZoeJardiniere/status/1628304145118625792

Various reasons but also include the ability of traffickers to sell

They over pack boats and over claim the safety and likely what it’s like on the other side in terms of housing etc

And it’s not only traffickers but invested agencies working on people movement

It’s a massive business

No 4 has it.

As for language - seriously - you must be a British colonialist if you think that English is spoken in most countries of Africa or the Middle East! I would say that mostly it's French.

Yup. So we make it more hostile to come here and - they can't sell the boat trips any more?

@Weighnow what would you do if you were the one in power? How would you house/feed/clothe/support the many non-English-speaking unskilled young men who arrive in the UK with nothing?

Lots of French speakers in Africa, that's true. Most of those refugees do stay in France. You are aware that we are not the only countries with refugees right?

Rwanda:

• 63 percent of the population still live in extreme poverty, living on less than $1.25 a day
• 25 percent of the population lack access to safe drinking water, and 26 percent of the population lack access to proper sanitation facilities
• 90 percent of Rwandans are at risk for malaria, a potentially fatal disease caused by infected mosquitoes. Malaria is the primary cause of death in Rwanda. In 2006, malaria caused 41 percent of hospital deaths, of which 42 percent of were children under the age of five.
• Commentators, journalists, opposition activists, and others speaking out on current affairs and criticizing public policies in Rwanda continued to face abusive prosecutions, enforced disappearances, and have at times died under unexplained circumstances.
• The Rwanda-backed M23 rebels have committed unlawful killings, rapes, and other apparent war crimes since late 2022. Attacks with explosive weapons in populated areas of North Kivu province killed and injured civilians, damaged infrastructure, and exacerbated a catastrophic humanitarian crisis.
• Security forces in Rwanda continued to “clear up” the streets of Kigali and detain people deemed “undesirable”—such as street children, street vendors, sex workers, homeless people, and beggars and taken them to an unofficial detention centre.
• Several journalists and commentators are behind bars in Rwanda. In some cases, they were arrested for speaking out about security force abuses, including unlawful and arbitrary detention, torture, and extrajudicial killings, or for criticizing the ruling RPF and its human rights record.
• Same-sex sexual activity is not illegal in Rwanda, but is frowned on by locals. LGBT+ travellers can experience discrimination and abuse, including from local authorities.
• The security situation near Rwanda’s borders with DRC remains unstable. There have been armed attacks in and around Rwanda’s Nyungwe Forest Park and Volcanoes National Park.
• Only limited medical facilities are available in Rwanda. If you have a serious accident or illness, you may need to be evacuated by air ambulance to Kenya or South Africa.

@Geebray

Migration and migrant population stats:
Germany reported the largest total number of immigrants (2.1 million) in 2022, followed by Spain (1.3 million), France (0.4 million) and Italy (0.4 million). Germany also reported the highest number of emigrants in 2022 (533 500), followed by Spain (531 900), France (249 400), Poland (228 000) and Romania (202 300).