What is your take on the old adage, "A son is a son until he takes a wife. A daughter is daughter all of her life"?

[Bayleaftree63]

Just that really... interested in your thoughts.

Agreed

Agreed

In my experience it's more prevalent in the families with sons and daughters as opposed to one or the other, mum takes daughter to dance classes and they grow up doing things together, dad takes son to football and eventually the pub etc, and the daughter just ends up more entwined in her own family more.

When I look at the families with just sons, I see closer relationships between the sons and mothers which remains into adulthood. If mothers don't want to lose their sons to their wives, they need to invest in the relationship when they're younger, find common ground, cheer them on at their sports, find something you can do together 1:1 so you don't grow apart.

I don’t think it’s simple enough to say yes it’s right or no it’s wrong.

Generally speaking, men can be a bit crap at remaining in touch with their families. But it’s a massive generalisation. men are conditioned to think quite selfishly. Women are expected to pick up the slack. But not all men are like this and more all women.

If everything is left to the woman to organise, it’s natural her family will be her primary focus.

We also judge men who are close to their mother Betsy differently to women who are close to their mothers or fathers.

There’s also the impact of women giving birth. Women give birth and (naturally) would like their mothers around. But the husband parents are kept more at arms length or at least not quite as involved. It’s understandable but contributes to the dynamic.

And there’s other things that impact it.

so I don’t think the adage is true. But I think when you look at the situation on a general level, it appears to be true. But it’s not true as if by magic. Things come into play.

and there’s many men who aren’t like that.

I can only speak from my own experience to say I think this is old fashioned rubbish. My DH speaks to his mum every day, we stay around the corner from her and they are really close. My DB is much closer to our mum than me.

(Lots of massive stereotyping there for generalisation and shorter post, I know it's not like that in every family!!)

Also I might not go shopping with DS but that doesn’t stop us going out for a meal or having a weekend together. In fact DS has just done that with one of his grandmas, as he was going somewhere close to near where they live as part of his uni course. He didn’t have to, so it wasn’t a convenience thing.

I think it comes down to the fact men expect women to do all the emotional Labour.
So men, aka sons, are less likely to make a point to go and see their mum, buy them Christmas and b’day presents (look at how many women do that further partners) etc…. And if the mother pushes a bit to organise meet ups/weekend lunch etc… she is quickly seen as overbearing.

I can see it with my MIL. She is the one who is ringing dh, asking him about the family, our dcs etc… Contact isn’t driven by him at all.

I actually think this all depends on the mothers attitude to partners; if a mother decides that their sons partner is going to be competition then this is clearly going to go wrong somewhere. I’ve known women who said this who were horrible to their daughter in laws so used this to justify what happened.
Whereas the mothers who welcomed a daughter in law into the family and made them a friend or as close to as possible it doesn’t happen to

I agree with this.
My in-laws are a strong believer in this saying. As a result they back all of the women in the family and encourage them and the men are treated like they are inferior and they also smother them. It’s had mixed results. Some of the men have run from them (like my DH), some have failed to launch into the world and are in their 30s and 40s living with with their parents.

I know men from perfectly functional families who have a normal relationship with their parents.

I think it's more this. Women who can't tolerate their mother-in-law having anything to do "their little family", for whatever reason. Seem to think the husband needs to forget his family existed. Weird.

I don't think a lot of people believe in the adage. Just those that do make the most noise.

Even if it was the ‘wives’ who were stopping the sins to have regular contact, it’s the men/sons who accept it.
There are many ways to keep in touch with your parents. Not all of them include involving the whole family including your wife.

I hate the abuse of mothers that it embraces. Mumsnet likes to use 'mother cussing' as a weapon against other posters and against men in particular. At school, 'your mum' was used as the ultimate form of name calling. On MN it is 'Mummy's Boy' for any man who has a strong relationship with his mother. It should be banned. It says as much about the poster and her sexist views on motherhood as it does about societal norms with regard to men.

It’s interesting a lot of people are blaming a woman for it when there is truth in it, whether the MIL or DIL.

Absolute horseshit.

Utter rubbish.

In fact, the term 'Mummy's Boy' has become the 'Your Mum' of playground Mumsnet. How to put down all men and the majority of mothers in one fell swoop. I sometimes think some posters on MN are only happy when they are making other mothers feel rubbish.

Never paid any attention to it.

It doesn't fit my extended family or dh's.

@AnImaginaryCat

Unfortunately many problems cone down to "boundaries".
"dils can't tolerate their mils having anything to do with their little family".

Enhancing, supporting, caring for that "little family" is one thing.
Trampolining over boundaries, treating that little family as their own and making decisions without dil, taking things over, and simply not asking... "what can I buy, provide, do, or do you mind if I xyz... May I... Blah...".

Usually mils who respect that little family and ask questions and are OK with being told no are the ones close to that little family and are part of it.

This in spades

my mum was a fan of quoting this when we were growing up but thankfully my brother js a feminist and we’re both as close to our parents as each other

It's not true in my family.

My father doted on his mother all his life and visited her once/twice weekly to provide company and care for years at the end of her life (dementia). She only had sons and was very close to all her grandchildren.

My husband doesn't need to help his parents out as they are both working and much more well off than we are. But we see them regularly, they are involved grandparents and I like his mother so much I've been on holiday with her without him(!)

My brother lives with my parents so of course he's very close with them.

My uncle (mother's brother) was much closer to my other grandmother than my mum ever was - she and my mum didn't get along. Although, when it came to it my mum provided all of the care / support for the mother she didn't like as my uncle lived in another country.

Maybe if you have crap parents

True, but the old adage is a about when a son taking a wife, so it's about the mother-son relationship chamgung when he gets married comes into the picture - that would have some bearing on the focus of the "blame".

If it was about a son moving out, married or not, and being 'lost' it would be different.

Mind you I do think a man is a bit of a plonker if he cuts contact with a mother (who he'd had a decent relationship with) just because his wife gets jealous he calls or visits her.

We were closer to DHs mum than mine and spent way more time with her. She died recently and I miss he terribly.