Should DD have been served alcohol?

[HangingOnJustAbout]

Two DD, 16 and 18, I allow DD16 alcohol (usually a small wine or half a cider) when we go out for meals. I believe this is legal, she drinks sensibly at parties anyway.

My dd went out with sis's dd 18 and 19 for a meal at a chain pizza place. They ordered a bottle of wine to be shared amongst them, all were ID'd which I'm sure is standard but they refused to allow DD 16 to share the wine and she ended up with a coke.

She wasn't that fussed, it was on Friday and has only just come up in conversation. I think she should have been served, she was having a meal with 3 legal adults. Should she have been? Maybe the adults need to have parental responsibility?

@Wibblywobblylikejelly it's a waitressing job not a living kind of job! It's easy to spot the council try buy team if your staff are trained correctly. I used to work behind the bar of upmarket pub, we were discouraged from IDing the guests, to the point the company agreed to pay the fines no questions asked (they never got fined as it wasn't a rough bar!).

The government wants a cafe culture to alcohol consumption so they need to push things like a small drink at 16 so people don't go all out at 18. Maybe a publicity drive is needed to remind people of the law.

@ZebraPensAreLife no it is better to start then when their liver is older. It's a biological advantage. I absolutely can not understand the lack of understanding that alcohol is a lead cause of cancer and you are complacent in giving it to a child.

Yes I drink occasionally as an adult. But my 16 year old won't be having me buy him alcohol until 18. Research shows our behaviour impacts their likelihood to abuse alcohol.

As to why we allow her alcohol with a, meal, it's as people have said above. We aren't big drinkers as a family and don't usually have alcohol in the house. The general message is that we have it at parties and special occasions and do so in moderation.

It does depend on your dc's character but so many go to uni at 18 having grown up being told they are not allowed alcohol and aren't mature enough and just go crazy. It's such a problem in this country, people drink as entertainment rather than alongside entertainment. I want her to think of it as an accompaniment to events and social situations.

I agree with others who said it's up to the restaurant. I think most likely say no? If something happens it's probably on the restaurant? It's probably hard to keep track of how much a 16 year old is drinking especially if there are a few . 16 year old then becomes drunk and vulnerable

When I was in my teens my parents let me have small amounts of alcohol at home on special occasions. ( This was in the 80s ,so normally Babycham or Cinzano with loads of lemonade) When I got to 18 many of my friends went mad with alcohol, I could take it or leave it as it was not 'the forbidden fruit'!

I think it is quite reasonable for a restaurant to have a policy that under 18s can only drink with over 25s, say. Otherwise you can imagine a scenario where one 18 year old is ordering for 9 16 year olds or whatever.

Also - it’s much more likely that your DD would have split the bill with her cousins - hence actually buying the wine - than with you as her parent.

They made a decision to safeguard your child.

I totally get this. My parents drank when I was growing up. I was allowed to drink as well judt little nits here and there. I drank when I was 16 peaked a bit when I was 18. But because I was always around it . I never went over the top it lond of became boring to be honest. My realives who were a simlar age were not allowed to touch a drop till 18 so soon as they were 18 thry went a not mad over drinking. Chucking up all over the place etc.

I stopped drinking at 19. I don't touch a drop . Not socially not at Xmas nothing at all. So it's naturally not around my kids it's not that I have kept them from it as such it's just it's never been there. But now my son is 16 he can get drink and can be a bit of an idiot with what he drinks. Or maybe he's not it's just I'm out of touch ?

Yes @WestendVBroadway and research now shows that isn't fact . A 16 year old liver is impacted more than an adult. A family member has a life long generic liver condition and I've spent years on wards with liver patients and the age profile has dropped and the cause is primarily alcohol. Our knowledge of link of cancer to alcohol has increased. What seems to be the issue is cultural behaviour.

I reckon in twenty years times there will be very angry 30+ year old with chronic liver conditions asking why their parents facilitated them drinking.

https://www.who.int//news-room/fact-sheets/detail/alcohol/?gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQiAw6yuBhDrARIsACf94RUx3hHFuUN7mTLhzVIBDK27ael88F6HFKQiRBiulY1G-QnTCFYurC0aAjwQEALw_wcB

I think they were right to not serve her alcohol. They don't know you allow it at home and you could have complained. They would risk losing their alcohol license. They were being responsible by not allowing it.

I don't think they've been inconsistent. I can see why they used their discretion and didn't allow it when she was with other young adults rather than older family members.

Especially as it was a bottle of wine rather than one alcoholic drink each. They would have no way of knowing how much of that she was going to drink and you wouldn't want to risk a pissed up 16 year old on your premises.

@Windydaysandwetnights In your opinion! A 16 year old having one glass of wine with a meal out is fine for most people.

For many the waitresses is their real living.what a vile perso you come across as

And secondly regardless of the position of the server the license holder can receive the punishment. And as someone who's mortgage is paid by that role I call BS on pretty much everything you've chatted.

The venue and server were well within their rights to deny them.

I think if you won’t go to a restaurant because they won’t serve a child alcohol you are sending a clear message that it ISN'T just an accompaniment to an event, but a required part to make it “fun”.

There's the law and what the premises chooses to allow.

A premises could make it everyone has to be over 21 to serve them alcohol if they wanted to, and they can refuse to serve anyone they wish at any time. Of course, that may affect some peoples wish to attend that premises.

So there is no "should have been served".

Given the fact the law of being able to drink with a meal under the age of 18 is not very well known and maybe difficult to enforce (what for example constitutes a meal, a bag of crisps?), it's not really surprising some places choose to stick with a blanket policy of over 18 only which is far easier to implement.

Any licensed property can refuse to serve alcohol to an adult so there should never be an expectation to have it.

Given the fact the law of being able to drink with a meal under the age of 18 is not very well known and maybe difficult to enforce (what for example constitutes a meal, a bag of crisps?)

I thought it was already established as being a scotch egg?

This is the case sadly. We took our dd, then 19, out to our local harvester for dinner and she, for the first time decided to have a fruit cider with her meal. Because she didn't have any ID on her they refused to serve her, even though we, her parents, were there with her and said she is 19 and definitely over 16 which we understood was the min age for a person to have an alcoholic drink with their meal. But no. Managers discretion.
We asked to move tables as we were right next to a very noisy one with little kids and had a nice private booth. I ordered a Baileys to go with our pudding, so she got to have a sneaky drink with her meal 😉

The government wants a cafe culture to alcohol consumption so they need to push things like a small drink at 16 so people don't go all out at 18. don’t be ridiculous.

You weren't there though were you?
The can have alcohol with a meal at 16 thing is at the restaurants discretion.
Its nit something I would ever question or challenge.

@HangingOnJustAbout You honestly cant see the different between your 16 year old having a meal out with her parents and going out for a meal with an 18 and 19 year old?
Try and see this from the restaurants point of view for a second. As others have said its entirely at their discretion.

You can bet all the 16 yr olds not being allowed half a cider will be the first ones necking vodka in a field somewhere.

Anyway, as someone said up thread, it was probably an issue of who was paying. If they were splitting the bill, it could be illegal I guess

I think allowing a 16 year old to drink alcohol when accompanied by a parent or adult that is at least on thier 30s is totally different to allow a 16 year old to drink alcohol when accompanied by a barely legal teenager who is more likely to be a peer/friend than a supervising adult.

I just think of Will in the Inbetweeners quoting that he can drink with a meal so has food with a random bloke.

I worked in Higher education for 30 years. We had students who died because of actions while drunk, falling through a roof on life support sticks in my mind , his poor Dad was in an absolute state I remember two student nurses got very drunk and fell in the road and were killed. I do agree to some extent about forbidden fruit and them going wild. The worst was a lad who was home educated, he got up to some absolute shenanigans.

Small amounts with parents is fine, they were not her parents so I can see why they refused service.

It's legal to serve 16 and 17 year olds beer or cider with a meal if they are with adults.

That doesn't mean that it's compulsory for staff to allow this.

I was once out with my then 17 year old dd when she wanted to have dinner at Wetherspoons.
She asked me if she could have half a pint of cider with her meal and I agreed.

The waitress came over, asked dd's age and explained that it was against company policy to serve alcohol to under 18s.

Neither of us had realised but we accepted that it was their right to have that policy and just switched dd's drink order.