What makes you neurotypical? Or neurodivergent ? I'm curious how you can tell ?

[Divinespark]

That's the chat really? I can see how some are on the spectrum but not others? Same with ADHD

There are more neurodivergencies than just ASD and ADHD, and you either meet the diagnostic criteria for them or you don't. If you want to look up the diagnostic criteria for them, Google is widely available. You could also look up other types of neurodiversity.

This.

And why would you be able to tell by looking?

A lot of neurodivergent people mask.

This.

and because wearing a sign saying “I am neurodiverse” isn’t compulsory how would you be able to tell if someone was?

I still don't really accept that I am. And I don't see it in other people. I just see people who are living to the expected standard (that I set) and people who aren't. For many years I didn't see myself as living to this standard, I'm a bit kinder to myself these days.

I think a common feeling is being out of step with the norm, whether that be in how you think or behave or both. Knowing that the way you feel, think or behave is not how most of the people around you do, particularly in settings such as school and work.

i don't think there is a normal. i think honestly people are just adding constant labels and it's in some cases it's not really helpful.

You might if you weren't it.

I totally agree

Completely agree. Particularly with the first sentence.

It’s a group of disabilities so you could “tell” a person was neurodiverse if they had a diagnosis of any of the qualifying disabilities

I agree. Literally everyone I know really struggles with one aspect of life or another. I don’t think it’s us, people, I think it’s the overload of life these days that is convincing us we’re the problem.

This "there's no such thing as normal" stuff is irritating. It's like a combination of the fish not understanding what water is thing, those English people who think there's no such thing as English culture, and the "I don't see colour, aren't we all just the human race" white people thing.

If you think there's no such thing as normal (in a "neurodiversity" context), then maybe you're just not one of those people who's been repeatedly told and shown throughout their lives that there is a normal, has to be, because whatever normal is, whatever "acceptable" is, You're Not It. In other words, maybe you're so normal you can't even see what normal is, like the English person who doesn't see that so much of what they take for granted as universal is actually part of English culture.

If you think there's no such thing as normal (in a "neurodiversity" context), then maybe you're just not one of those people who's been repeatedly told and shown throughout their lives that there is a normal, has to be, because whatever normal is, whatever "acceptable" is, You're Not It

I disagree.

For that to be true there would have to be majority of people who are ‘normal’ and feel normal. There isn’t. What you’re referring to is generalised life pressure which mainly comes in the form of marketing schemes, toxic social media and so on. Not real people living ‘normal’ lives that somehow you cannot attain.

This.

What you’re referring to is generalised life pressure which mainly comes in the form of marketing schemes, toxic social media and so on.

No, what I'm referring to is going through your entire life having it made blatantly clear to you that you're Not Normal. Other children. Schoolteachers. Workplaces. Everywhere.

How? Neurodiversity doesn't have a particular look!

You've clearly never heard of masking

Can you give examples? Because again virtually everyone I know has had these experiences on some level. A general feeling of not fitting in, or having to try really hard to fit in.

Try not to waste too much energy answering questions that aren’t asked in good faith…

Being neurodiverse literally means that your neurons react to stimuli differently therefore unless you have a brain scanner you won't be able to tell which people have typically reacting neurons and those whose neuron activity shows a more diverse reaction.

Neurodiversity is not just Autism, or ADHD but includes dyslexia, dysgraphia, dyscalculia etc

Modern life with the increase of stimuli means that those who perhaps were able to cope in the past no longer can because stimuli, particularly noise and light are continuous and neurons don't get chance to rest.

One thing I notice is it's always been very easy for me to spot someone who's ND, but when they're NT i don't look for signs.

I'm NT, my thoughts, behaviours and feelings don't need explaining to myself or others, they don't seem abnormal or irrational to others, I can self regulate, don't need help to process my actions/thoughts.

The ND people I've met show signs, some show signs they don't realise, and they don't seem aware of their different thought and behaviour patterns- usually because their differences aren't very apparent. Those people usually appear NT. Those who are and appear ND have outward expressions of their divergence, and even to the untrained eye, their signs are obvious.

Personal examples?

I guess maybe the letter from my deputy headteacher to my psychiatric hospital, informing them that it was clear to the school that I was always different from the moment I started there, but that the other children tried to be kind.

Having entirely different capabilities to other children throughout school — outstanding, one-in-a-thousand ability levels at some things, years behind at others, and teachers explicitly telling me it's not normal to be so good at some things and not be able to meet basic expectations for behaviour and self-care.

Being treated as weird, called weird, given cruel nicknames about my weirdness, in multiple unrelated settings as a child.

Being explicitly told as an adult that I'm not the kind of person you forget.

Being unable to manage even basic aspects of adult life and meeting with incomprehension as to why.

I could go on for hours.

Yes, everybody feels special and different, and sees other people's outsides and compares then to their insides, and feels that they're not normal. And then, most people who have the capacity to do so and take the time to think about it probably realise that everyone else feels like that too. Seems reasonable then to concludes that if they're not normal, then actually nobody's normal. And in a broad context, that's a reasonable way of looking at things

But when you bring the term "normal" into a conversation about neurodivergence and neurotypicality, and try to apply the same idea, you're erasing the exclusion and difference that neurodivergent people often experience. In this context, there's a normal, and most people are it, and I'm not.

If you don't have a label of adhd, you tend to collect a lot of others from random people making comments FOR YOUR ENTIRE LIFE. They tend to be not nice or helpful and particularly women end up with a lot of shame, which fucks up your life more than the NDness.

It is really upsetting when people say "it's a label" and it means nothing.

Frankly, even with no meds, not much support and not much understanding in threads like this, finding out my "label" had been very helpful.

I run my life in a much better, more adhd-friendly way and my DH who was always great, finds life easier.

And no, you wouldn't look at me and think adhd but if I'm with others like me, we have an awful lot of things in common.

Thanks jeremy — luckily I've got a bit of spare time and energy this morning, but you're right about being careful where I spend that.

I’m not sure you understood my post. It’s not how you look it’s what diagnosis you fit.

I understood perfectly well.

As there is no "look" you can't tell.