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Original poster

Not married - what would happen if one of us ended up in ICU?

66 replies

SpringMeadows · 20/12/2023 12:30

My DP and I are not married and don't intend to. We are in England. My understanding is that if something were to happen and one of us ended up critically ill in hospital, because we are not related, we may not be allowed to see each other in hospital.

Does anyone know if this is correct? Maybe someone who works in a hospital? Apparently you cannot make someone you are not related to, your 'legal next of kin' in the UK.

We have no wish to get married but the above seems a huge drawback for unmarried couples.

OP posts:
BaleOfHay · 20/12/2023 12:32

It is a drawback. In law you have no formal relationship so you cannot be NOK. Even if you don't want a marriage, would you consider civil partnership?

Floralsofa · 20/12/2023 12:35

If it's any help even married couples can't decide on treatment to be given or not if you lose capacity, any couple married or otherwise can do a lasting power of attorney for health though.

WaitingForMojo · 20/12/2023 12:36

Can you draw up a power of attorney?

Floralsofa · 20/12/2023 12:39

PotteringAlonggotkickedoutandhadtoreregister · 20/12/2023 12:37

Getting married doesn't give the same rights as an LPA Unfortunately.

I'm not sure why you feel you wouldn't be allowed to visit though OP? Unless there's some wider family issues at play.

GrossEncountersoftheTurdKind · 20/12/2023 12:40

Just out of ICU here! Me and my partner aren't married and he wasn't down as my NOK but he was allowed in to see me. As long as any family agree, the hospital won't have a problem with it. That was ,y experience anyway, and I have been in iCU twice in the last 5 years..

Autumnalday · 20/12/2023 12:40

You can name each other as next of kin at hospital so it's on the paperwork. You won't be next of kin to inherit anything though.

WorriedMillie · 20/12/2023 12:41

I’d get a LPOA. They are fairly straightforward to apply for

AnnaMagnani · 20/12/2023 12:42

You would be able to see each other. The hospital would be sensible and count you as the person closest if decisions needed to be made.

However while your partner was unwell, unless you have joint finances you might find yourself unable to pay the bills at home.

And if they died without a will, you would be entitled to nothing.

Validus · 20/12/2023 12:43

You have no legal rights and whoever is your partner’s actual NOK can exclude you from not only all decisions but also the hospital room.

And just because you think your partner’s family like you doesn’t mean they do, or they won’t turn on you.

Get married or sign a civil partnership. Or get a lasting POA (but marrying is frankly easier and less open to potential challenge).

Reugny · 20/12/2023 12:46

WaitingForMojo · 20/12/2023 12:36

Can you draw up a power of attorney?

Please do this especially if you are over 60 or ever suffered from mental illness.

Even if you were married or related without one of these you cannot advocate for the other person.

This is currently causing shit for my DP.

Nannyfannybanny · 20/12/2023 12:46

Worked in hospitals many years. Never any problems with visiting. The one thing I would add,you need to make ward staff aware of name of nok. I say this because my oldest DS got married and separated,he was sent to hospital, signed paperwork to make me his nok, and they rang me, told me this and I accepted. THEN I went to visit him, nurse came in with notes and my D'S to speak about treatment,then said she wasn't talking to me, I wasn't his nok, his wife was!! I had to go and see her, and get her to sign paperwork relinquishing her "rights"

VanCleefArpels · 20/12/2023 12:48

I think being NOK in the scenario you describe is the least of your worries as an unmarried / non civil partnered person. Whatever your reasons for not being married please at least organise things between you so that one or other of you will not be left destitute after a death. In particular make a Will

Reugny · 20/12/2023 12:48

Validus · 20/12/2023 12:43

You have no legal rights and whoever is your partner’s actual NOK can exclude you from not only all decisions but also the hospital room.

And just because you think your partner’s family like you doesn’t mean they do, or they won’t turn on you.

Get married or sign a civil partnership. Or get a lasting POA (but marrying is frankly easier and less open to potential challenge).

Being married or related doesn't give you the right to fight for or against a particular treatment for an adult or see that adult's health records.

However a POA does.

Cost £82 and a few weeks work if you do it yourself.

LoobyDop · 20/12/2023 13:00

This was one of the main reasons it was important to me to get married. Even if you and your partner get on well with each other’s family, you never know how people will behave under difficult circumstances. I hated the idea of one of us being shut out.

SuddenlyOld · 20/12/2023 13:08

Hospital visits is not the worst of it. Not married so not NoK, so you won't have any say in funeral arrangements should the worst happen.

A dear friend of mine found herself in this position. Her OP's parents arranged his funeral and sold his house. So she lost everything. She'd been living with OP for over 15 years but had never met his parents as they were estranged. She had no rights at all but I believe she got a small settlement due to helping pay the mortgage for so long. She couldn't stop them selling it though.

When Barry White died his estranged (but not divorced) wife was still his NoK and not only did she arrange the funeral but she banned his partner from attending despite being separated for over 10 years.

A will would help but can be contested.

Alphabet1spaghetti2 · 20/12/2023 13:08

Get both poas finacial and health and welfare. It trumps getting married in these situations. Can be done easily at home.

NancyPickford · 20/12/2023 13:09

Every time I read a post like this it brings back awful memories of when my best friend's partner was ill. They had lived together for 12 years but not married as "it's just a bit of paper". When he died his parents took over, organised the funeral, the headstone everything, her wishes counted for nothing. My friend said she felt like a flatmate, and really that was what she was in the eyes of the law. When people say it's just a piece of paper, I always say 'well if it's just a piece of paper why not just go ahead and get it, no need for a big wedding day, just you and two witnesses in front of the registrar and then collect your piece of paper. It's an important legal contract giving certain protections.

Alphabet1spaghetti2 · 20/12/2023 13:11

Just to add. A poa is only in effect up to the point of death. A will or marriage would be needed for after death.

blobby10 · 20/12/2023 13:23

My partner of 5 years died last year after a short illness - he had listed me as his NOK but his brother saw him first and changed the NOK details. I wasn't allowed to visit and had no say in his funeral arrangements or treatment of his ashes. It was very hard to accept at the time.

GeorgeBeckett · 20/12/2023 13:23

There is no legal definition of next of kin in England and Wales. Next of Kin is whoever you say it is. Hospital will ask who your nearest and dearest is. It's worth getting this info added to your records if it's not the obvious person in case you ever were unconscious.
Being next of kin (married or not) means you will be updated and consulted in hospital but does not give you legal rights to make any decisions. In a hospital setting decisions would generally be made by the medical teams.
In the case of death and no will intestacy rules would apply.
Get a will. Consider LPA for health and financial if you want. Get married if you like.

wudubelieveit · 20/12/2023 13:56

It can lead to strange circumstances and having worked in a hospice, when death occurs, a partner of many years standing may not be eligible to register that persons death…the head of nursing had to go and do this. The problem is ,in acute, unexpected circumstances , things may default to their parent rather than yourself and as other people have said, if there’s family discord this can bring problems.

BombaySamphire · 20/12/2023 13:58

The hospital would be sensible and count you as the person closest if decisions needed to be made.
Why on earth would you think that?

user14699084785 · 20/12/2023 14:05

If you’re not married your next of kin is your father for things like insurance policy’s, registering legal stuff etc.
I’d imagine your mother is next in line if father pre-deceased.

But in your hospital scenario, I can’t imagine it being a big issue as long as parents/partner have a reasonable relationship.

hatgirl · 20/12/2023 15:23

Next of Kin has absolutely no legal standing.

It's frequently misunderstood to mean the same thing as a Lasting Power of Attorney (LPA) but it isn't.

If you get LPA for Health and Welfare and finances for each other that would cover you for who made the decisions in the 'in ICU' scenario.

Even if you were married you would still need the LPA in that scenario - many people wrongly assume that marriage gives you the same rights automatically as LPA but it doesn't. In practice staff would probably treat a spouse as if they did have LPA, (unless the spouse disagreed with medical staff) so the true legal situation isn't always very well understood.

If one of you died then decision making about the funeral arrangements, registering the death etc are determined by intestacy rules if there isn't a will, or by the executors of the will if there is one.

If the executor ISN'T the spouse / partner then in theory they could make arrangements without consulting with the spouse etc but in reality most people thankfully are reasonable and let the most appropriate people make the decisions.

So basically, married or not, get a LPA and sort your wills out. Next of Kin is meaningless legally