A moral dilemma - what would you do?

[TheTripThatWasnt]

Have name changed, as this is identifiable. I tried to change details, but it all got too far from the original scenario to be useful. Be warned - it's long, but don't want to drip feed down the line.

Here's the situation...

A, B and C have been friends for 30 years (since Uni). They don't see each other that much any more (living several hours from each other), but they're regularly in contact, and when they meet up it's like they've never been apart. All have quite different lives/lifestyles, but all are in good jobs, financially secure, and don't need to 'worry' about money.

A and B are 50 soon (C was 50 in lockdown), so they decided to go away for the weekend to celebrate, and a trip on Eurostar was booked.

In the night, the night before they were travelling, A's husband had a bad accident and broke several bones. A spent the night with him in A&E, then he had to be admitted overnight. He was due to be released on the next morning (the day of travel), but was completely immobile and needed care at home (plus they have a young son). This meant A couldn't travel.

B&C faced a dilemma - to go anyway, or to cancel. Travel and first night's hotel were non-refundable. They felt that going was definitely not the right thing to do (seeing as celebrating A's birthday was a big part of the reason for going). But both called their travel insurance providers to see what they said.

Both travel insurance companies agreed that yes, their policy should cover them for this scenario (both B&C were very clear about the exact circumstances, and the reason that A couldn't travel), but that until a claim was submitted it was impossible to say 100%. On the strength of both insurance cos giving off the right vibes, B&C did the 'right thing' and the trip was cancelled.

All 3 then submitted insurance claims.
A's paid out straight away - no quibble from her insurer that she couldn't travel as her husband had the accident.
B's claim was initially rejected, B appealed, citing the call from the day of travel, but the underwriter still rejected it.
C's claim was initially rejected. C appealed, citing the call she'd made that morning. Her insurer agreed that she was given false information on the call, and therefore paid out.

B's insurer are not being as 'nice' as C's. They are saying that on the call they said it couldn't be guaranteed, and because B is not related to the person who had the accident, she isn't covered. They are not disputing the fact that A couldn't travel and therefore there are reasonable grounds for cancelling the trip.

Herein lies the dilemma. A and C are not out of pocket (apart from their excess), but B has lost all the money from the trip. All 3 have the same policy wording on their documents (so they don't have different insurance), but the different insurers have handled it differently.

Should A&C offer to share some of their refund with B? Clearly they don't have to - all 3 are independent of each other, and are financially responsible for their own costs of the trip. But would it be the nice thing to do to split the loss 3 ways and share the recovered funds 3 ways?

Yes, given how long you have all been friends, if I were A or C then I would be offering to either cover a share of B’s loss, or suggesting that if another trip is booked then B pays less to cover what was lost from this trip.

On a side note, B should consider going to the financial ombudsman as if they decide that the insurance should have paid out then she will be able to recover this.

I think you’re either all in it together or acting in your own best interest. B and C cancelled plans and trip acting as a group so yes all should share in the shortfall as a group too.

I don't think A should be out of pocket, she genuinely couldn't go.

B & C made a choice, albeit a very understandable one.

If I were C I'd offer to split the cost with B, but if I were B I wouldn't accept it. It doesn't sound like it's about the money as such, more about doing the right thing, so with friends of 30 years I'd be leaning towards generosity.

Maybe B&C should split it as they took a gamble jointly.

However this isn't for A to pay. Unlike the others she had no choice but to cancel. She did everything right and therefore correctly received a payout.

Did A put pressure on the others to cancel? That would change it for me. But assuming the decision for B&C to cancel wasn't made by A then it would be unfair on her to have to pay for it.

I would go again wi the the insurer and escalate to the financial ombudsman. With the same circumstances and same policy wording and 2 out of three paying out I think she has a strong case

Noone should pay on anyone else's behalf. They chose their own insurance and therefore any loss is on them and the individual policy they took out. B and C took a gamble by not going and not knowing if it was going to pay out. If I was B or C I still would have gone on the trip as its not like A's husband was on his deathbed and now none of them have gone and one is out of pocket so them not going on the trip hasnt really benefited anyone whatsoever- quite the opposite.

If I was A, I would have encouraged my friends to go anyway as why should they miss out? Plus, now B is out of pocket and had no trip. At least if B and C had gone something would have been salvageable.

B & C technically could still have gone, but it's pretty crappy to go on a weekend to celebrate a birthday without the person whose birthday it is

Why? I would hate for my friends to miss out on something they were looking forward to so if I was A I'd have told them to go and enjoy it. I'd feel pretty shit knowing that me dropping out caused someone to lose money like that. You say its pretty crappy but this scenario is also pretty crappy and unfair too!

You’re good friends and this was a trip you all planned together. You all missed the trip due to the same issue. I think you should all end up even, in terms of money. So I think A and C should share refund with B.

On reflection it was a mistake to trust the insurance company on the phone. We had a similar situation last summer. Our flights were cancelled (and refunded) due to an airport issue, but our villa was booked separately. We asked if our insurance would cover our villa if we didn’t go, and were told it probably would but there were no guarantees. We didn’t want to risk it, so we booked new flights to an airport a few hours away instead. I always assume that insurance companies will have a default of not paying!

I agree it’s worthwhile. No point in comparing with A, as her situation is different. But definitely worth comparing the difference between B and C.

The debate about whether B&C should still have gone is interesting. With the benefit of hindsight, and with time to think about things, maybe they should have done, but there was only a window of a couple of hours to make some quick decisions about plans, and emotions were running high.

A did say "you should still go" to B&C, as any decent person would. But the key thing is that B&C made the decision to cancel based on what their insurance companies told them. So they didn't think they'd be (much) out of pocket.

You also said it was B's birthday too- B & C could have gone to celebrate B's birthday and arranged something different when they came back to belatedly celebrate C's birthday. That way, everyone gets a celebration of some kind.

My tuppence for what it's worth.

If I were A I would have encouraged you to go without me.

If I were B, I would rather DIE than ask you to split the money back you got, but I think I'd be hurt if it wasn't offered.

If I were A or C in your exact scenario, I'd be offering to cover B's costs so we were all equally out of pocket. If it was to the tune of less than £200ish, I'd consider covering both as I'm lucky enough to be in a position to do so.

I could understand however if A feels like they shouldn't have to split the refund as they were the one directly affected, but I'd hope that after 30ish years of friendship that it would be a minor niggle rather than an outright last straw.

I assume there's not been any bad feeling around money in the past as you don't mention it, if there had been that might sway me in a different direction.

Haven't read everyone else's responses, just the OPs, so apologies if this has been mentioned already.

If I was in this situation, I'd assume that as we're all close friends, another trip will eventually happen. So being either A or C, or both, I would offer to cover B's loss on a next trip. Just makes it a bit "softer" than forking out money now and adds the promise of a future trip all together.

I'm on the side of thinking A and C should share the money, but only because you're all very close. If B was a near-stranger or if you weren't very close then I would say it's just down to bad luck. I wouldn't want to fall out over this with close long-term friends.

Just as a quick thought - B should contact the complaints department in their insurer, flagging that it is industry practice in these circumstances to cover the claim - referencing clearly the call in the morning and the approach C's insurer took. In the letter B should also flag that B will be taking the complaint forward with the Financial Ombudsman if it can't be resolved at that stage. If the insurer refuses to cover it then B should contact the financial ombudsman. Sounds a palaver but often the threat of reporting to their regulator actually gets you through to the right person in the complaints department!

This sounds like B’s problem. She chose a different insurer and a different policy - tough shit. She didn’t hassle her insurer enough to get her claim approved - tough shit. It’s up to B to take action to get this resolved and get her claim paid. It is not A or C’s problem.

I don’t think a & c are responsible for b’s choice of insurer. So I differ from most because I don’t think they should pay.

B should push further with insurers. If she has exhausted their process refer to the Financial Ombudsman. Whilst they may not pay the claim, they should be considering a payment for loss of expectation , on basis that a different decision would have been made possibly if insurers had been clear on the first phone call.

I think you're A and I think you should all cover the loss.

I am somewhat shocked that two different Insurance Companies gave out such clearly incorrect information and to be 100% honest that B&C ever even thought to ring about it. I do wonder were they a bit unclear on the phone and hence why both got such wrong inform.

B could appeal if they got clearly incorrect information. I assume that they contacted the Insurance Company by phone. If I was B I would contact them today and ask for a copy of the call transcript/retain phonecall recording and then appeal, to regulatory body if needs B.

Personally if I was B though I would probably take the hit. It would be nice if C offered to go halves but I would not expect this and would refuse. I certainly would not expect anything from A and nor would I have told her I was refused

Are you going to rearrange the trip OP? If so A & C could offer to pay for the part that B lost out on, that would also give B more time to take it to the ombudsman.

failing that, I’d split the loss 3 ways if it was me.

B&C cancelled their trip without hesitation. They could have gone ahead without A. I would be hurt if there wasn’t so much as an offer to split the loss since I’d done the ‘right thing’ by A I would expect the same in return

If it was me I would take the hit but would not insure with that company again.

If I was B I wouldn’t expect a share , I’d put it down to experience and use a different insurance company in future . You can’t ever believe what someone tells you on the phone and I would say it was fairly obvious you wouldn’t be covered .

Does B have any travel insurance on the credit card they booked the trip with that might pay out?

The decent thing to do would be to split the loss three ways so everyone is equally out of pocket. I'd be concerned about the implications for the friendship going forward.