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RedToothBrush · 13/11/2023 16:34

Puffinshop · 13/11/2023 15:11

It seems Þorvaldur may have got a bit overexcited last night. Here's Benedikt from the Met Office disagreeing with his assessment:
https://www.mbl.is/frettir/innlent/2023/11/13/hvad_er_sigdalur/

"A graben was discovered in Grindavík yesterday, running through the town. Þorvaldur Þórðarson, professor of volcanology at the University of Iceland, claimed that the graben was a clear sign of magma at a very shallow depth beneath the town. Benedikt Gunnar Ófeigsson, tectonics expert at the Met Office, says that this is not necessarily the case.

“This means that magma flowed down from the Sundhnúkar craters, under Grindavík and out under the sea. This causes tectonic divergence, in this case of about 1-3 metres. When something like this happens, a rift valley or graben is formed. What we are seeing is the rock breaking apart inside the rift valley and then the land sinks,” explains Benedikt.

“The best example of this is at Þingvellir, except there it is not a sign of magma movements, just of tectonic divergence,” says Benedikt.

Benedikt certainly isn’t ruling out the possibility that the magma is very close to the surface in the graben, but it doesn’t necessarily mean that.

“It doesn’t mean that the magma is very close to the surface, just that there has been significant tectonic divergence. That’s our interpretation and we have seen this many times in comparable events. We can’t rule out the possibility of magma reaching the surface, but the graben in itself doesn’t tell us anything about the magma depth. That would depend on other factors,” explains Benedikt.

Benedikt says that nevertheless, grabens like this can be very dangerous, particularly in this case since it was formed so quickly.

“When you have a graben that forms so incredibly quickly, large cracks can open up on the surface very fast. That can create a very particular kind of danger that has nothing to do with magma,” says Benedikt.

Emergency response workers are aware of this risk and take it into account as they allow Grindavík residents to return to their homes to retrieve valuables.

“Of course the other risk is there as well, the possibility of an eruption. We are monitoring the area and are in direct contact with emergency response workers,” says Benedikt.

Please if anyone sees any coverage of this sigdalur in English or is an earth scientist and knows what the proper English word is, post it here. I have never heard of a graben before and I don't know if I'm using it right :/

The word sigdalur literally means sink valley, but I'm sure that isn't the proper term.

I wondered similar.

When I've seen articles translated via Facebook translate I'm getting a translation that doesn't quite make sense. If I've put the Icelandic through google translate I'm getting something slightly different. Example I was getting a word that was translating to Mercury via Facebook translate but was translating to Magma via Google translate. Comments below the Facebook article by Icelandic speakers confirmed Magma was the correct translation.

I did the same with graben. I 'think' its a scientific term, but sinkhole isn't a bad translation in layman's terms either from what I've seen.

Puffinshop · 13/11/2023 16:48

I do speak Icelandic so I don't use machine translate and I have access to technical and academic dictionaries but sometimes words have very specific contexts and it's easy to mess things up unless you have knowledge of the field yourself. Here's what I get:

Iceland - possible eruption due near the Blue Lagoon
Puffinshop · 13/11/2023 16:53

Ime Google Translate is a lot better than whatever Facebook uses. I remember it kept translating the word for eruption site as soda station (gos means both eruption and fizzy drink in Icelandic) 😄

quivers · 13/11/2023 16:57

RedToothBrush · 13/11/2023 16:34

I wondered similar.

When I've seen articles translated via Facebook translate I'm getting a translation that doesn't quite make sense. If I've put the Icelandic through google translate I'm getting something slightly different. Example I was getting a word that was translating to Mercury via Facebook translate but was translating to Magma via Google translate. Comments below the Facebook article by Icelandic speakers confirmed Magma was the correct translation.

I did the same with graben. I 'think' its a scientific term, but sinkhole isn't a bad translation in layman's terms either from what I've seen.

I saw something the other day which mentioned mercury, so I searched online and apparently volcanoes can emit mercury in a gaseous form at times. It's deadly.

countrygirl99 · 13/11/2023 16:59

Puffinshop · 13/11/2023 16:53

Ime Google Translate is a lot better than whatever Facebook uses. I remember it kept translating the word for eruption site as soda station (gos means both eruption and fizzy drink in Icelandic) 😄

Edited

Facebook translations from Finnish are hilarious. I guess it's probably a thing with minority languages.

RedToothBrush · 13/11/2023 17:09

Puffin I could be wrong on this, but I've been lead to beleive that Icelandic is fairly literal and descriptive as a language - in part because it has a lot less words than English. This makes for some wonderful mistranslations but also ones that kind of make sense too.

I LOVE the sound of Icelandic. It is definitely one of the most beautiful languages to just sit and listen to as an English only speaker!

Puffinshop · 13/11/2023 17:21

Yes, there are none of the opaque words from Latin, Greek etc that English has. So it's usually quite easy to understand academic vocabulary to some extent.

Sigdalur = sink valley - I see what has happened. The tectonic plates have pulled apart and the land has sunk into the gap to form a trough.

I just don't know if that's a graben or a rift valley or a fault trough or if those are synonymous or if it's none of the above in this context. 🤔

notimagain · 13/11/2023 17:26

RTB..

did the same with graben. I 'think' its a scientific term..I

It definitely is a scientific term, as per my pp. It seems to be usually used to described linear formations such resembling trenches and grooves on the surfaces of planets etc rather than a hole.

Puffinshop · 13/11/2023 17:29

It definitely is a trench/trough rather than a hole, so that fits.

CrunchyCarrot · 13/11/2023 17:39

Graben (and horst) are both geologic terms, I remember learning them when I did Geography back in my school days. I was a bit confused they called the sink hole a graben, though. I thought horst and graben referred to larger blocks of the earth's crust rather than a smaller hole. However on reading this definition in Britannica, seems they can be quite small!

https://www.britannica.com/science/horst

Horst and graben | Faulting, Tectonics & Geomorphology

Horst and graben, elongate fault blocks of the Earth’s crust that have been raised and lowered, respectively, relative to their surrounding areas as a direct effect of faulting. Horsts and grabens may range in size from blocks a few centimetres wide to...

https://www.britannica.com/science/horst

Puffinshop · 13/11/2023 17:43

I think it's just me who called it a graben so I really don't know if it's right Blush

Puffinshop · 13/11/2023 17:50

The Met Office seems to be saying 'vertical ground displacement' so let's go with that!

JemimaTab · 13/11/2023 19:30

Some good news from Dýrfinna (a local animal charity which has been involved in rescuing animals from Grindavík today). They have retrieved 49 cats, 4 hamsters, 90 pigeons, plus sheep, frogs (!) and parrots. They say that just 2 of the cats have had to be taken to the vet but are not in danger.
There are still a few (12) animals on their “list” to be saved, but these may already have been taken by residents so they are checking this.

BarbaraofSeville · 13/11/2023 19:36

This reminds me of the time they evacuated somewhere near a dam in the UK and there were loads of people worrying about their cats because cats being cats, some of them had picked a really inopportune moment to disappear and all people could do was leave food and water out for them and hope for the best.

So like then, fingers crossed that the town and any remaining cats survive and if/when people are allowed back to their homes, they find their feline overlords sitting on their doorsteps displaying their 'where the fuck have you been' faces.

Newgirls · 13/11/2023 19:49

I feel cats will be just fine and enjoy the quiet

Puffinshop · 13/11/2023 19:59

It's just whether they will have enough access to food and water I suppose. I'm glad so many animals have been rescued.

A University of Iceland volcanology research group called it a graben! I feel so vindicated Grin

https://www.facebook.com/100057513883659/posts/pfbid0cA6c9uCV1SFaCb97vTypTQh8JtSA3CfKnEFCS2EYk5Usu9BzdGXDiUmxQGNtSjenl/?app=fbl

Facebook

https://www.facebook.com/100057513883659/posts/pfbid0cA6c9uCV1SFaCb97vTypTQh8JtSA3CfKnEFCS2EYk5Usu9BzdGXDiUmxQGNtSjenl?app=fbl

JemimaTab · 13/11/2023 20:04

I think food will be a concern, and also the cold (assuming the cats are outdoors). But it actually sounds like the vast majority of the animals have been retrieved, which is amazing.

CrunchyCarrot · 13/11/2023 20:36

I can't get my head around the logistics of 15,000 chickens being saved! Wow.

Puffinshop · 13/11/2023 21:10

Felt a big quake just now.

EwwSprouts · 13/11/2023 21:35

Yikes! On a scale of 1-10 how safe do you feel where you are? Is Iceland like California where many new builds are built on rollers (layman's term) so they wobble as a whole not break up?

Puffinshop · 13/11/2023 21:48

10 safe for me personally. It's just a little wobble and a droning noise for us. I've heard the glasses tinkle ever so slightly in the cupboard before. But there are good reasons that Reykjavík was built where it was and this is one of them.

Houses are definitely built with earthquake safety in mind - not rollers but they are very strong - but obviously there's a limit to how much they can withstand when the whole town is sinking and cracking like Grindavík.

EwwSprouts · 13/11/2023 22:05

@Puffinshop Pleased to hear that.