Labour want teachers to supervise kids brushing their teeth ARGH.

[noblegiraffe]

People can't get dentists for their children.

Children's teeth are one of the top reasons for child hospital admission, with 9 out of 10 extractions in 0-5 year olds being due to preventable decay.

This is clearly an area that needs addressing urgently.

BUT schools are in crisis, if they're not literally falling apart they are running out of teachers or unable to hire teaching assistants. Primary schools are increasingly unable to meet the needs of children with SEN and disabilities, where numbers are going through the roof. Where is the time to supervise teeth-brushing going to come from? Who has the capacity to implement this? It seems that Labour are willing to accept that there is a crisis in dentistry, but pushing extra workload onto schools to solve it is just failing to recognise the crisis in schools in terms of ability to take on extra responsibilities.

There is an increasing trend to see a problem in society and expect schools to do something about it. There's also an increasing trend whereby underfunded support services for children reduce the offer of those services, and schools are just expected to pick up the slack. An example would be NHS Southwest deciding to stop accepting referrals for autism diagnosis except in cases of extreme need, saying that schools could just deal with these children not having a diagnosis. CAMHS collapsing under the weight of mental health issues in children was met with the policy that schools should have a member of staff given a bit of training to try to replace expert services. Special schools are saying that some children are too needy for their specialist setting, so those children with extreme needs are left in mainstream schools who are just expected to get on with it.

Why is Labour's go-to that teachers should supervise teeth brushing and not that parents should supervise teeth brushing and be supported in this?

What do people want the purpose of schools to be? If it is to educate children, then the rest of this stuff needs to be farmed elsewhere.

If it is to be that schools should be a one-stop-shop for all issues relating to children, then we need funding, staffing and infrastructure that acknowledges this new role.

Sorry think it was @MarliJay who said it's in the EYFS doc. I just couldn't see it in there was all.

As a parent I would not be happy if 20 minutes valuable learning was taken from my child's day because shit lazy parents can't be bothered to look after their own children. Teachers are there to teach and have enough to do within that remit without having so many extras dumped on them that are simply not their job or responsibility. The issue here is poor parenting and that's where any initiatives should be directed. At parents, not teachers and schools.

I think Labour need to figure out what has gone so terribly wrong that there is enough need for this - that there enough parents incapable of brushing their kids' teeth, of understanding or caring why it's necessary. They need to restore other support services that help these families to actually function and schools could be places where children go to learn.

Children are not being seen because getting an NHS dentist in some areas is very hard.

Isn't this the crux of the politics of Labou vs Tories. Tory politics are people should work and be self accountable with little nanny state intervention. Labour the one that always pushes the nanny state intervention so naturally people will then not take accountability or responsibility.

Does the government secretly want us to adopt the 30 children in class and become parents/ teachers? Maybe there will be a new name like parateacher! It feels like it’s heading that way…. 😂

The framework links to this.
https://help-for-early-years-providers.education.gov.uk/safeguarding-and-welfare/oral-health

By the way we do teach hygiene as part of health education that includes teeth and it is in there is certain science lessons but as a teaching lesson not as a responsibility that parents are actually responsible for like potty training.

Yes I’ve done that about 12 years ago when a big teeth cleaning push was needed. Took valuable teaching time out when we were supposed to “ closing the gap” . Which was an updated version of “ narrowing the gap”.
Same when free fruit was introduced. Took precious time out of my LSA schedule. Wash, slice, distribute, clear away.
All of these Initiatives are excellent but need time and input behind the scenes.

😂I think I love you! 😂

If I wanted to root around other people’s children’s mouths, I would have become a dentist.

It may well have happened years ago but the curriculum was not as jam packed as it is now, nor expectations and scrutiny so intense. I just don’t think ‘sorry this child didn’t make expected progress. I was too busy supervising 30 children brushing their teeth’ is going to cut it in the progress review meetings.

FFS! Isn't is bad enough that teachers have to teach some poor kids how to use cutlery, to change nappies and wash clothes? I used to be a teacher and would have left if asked to do this stuff. And even if there were NHS dentists galore, such useless and idle twats of parents wouldn't bother taking their kids. People are checked out when they want to re home a dog or cat, but sadly having children requires not the slightest minimum standard of intelligence/capability/decency/common sense/etc. How sad.

I do remember an assembly by Crest and afterwards we were given toothbrushes, disclosing tablets which we thought were great and a little chart to record our brushing which was on a tile by our bathroom sink for years!

I struggle to find time for guided reading every day let alone time to monitor tooth brushing. We do the free bagel breakfast project which already takes time at the beginning of the day.

They are about to make cuts in education so no chance of free brushes and toothpaste being offered unless Crest or Colgate get involved.

In this framework it falls under Personal Social and Emotional Development.

“Through adult modelling and guidance, they will learn to look after their bodies, including healthy eating, and manage personal needs independently”

There is an accompanying piece of non statutory guidance for the delivery of the curriculum, Development Matters. This breaks each area down further

See page 55 with the picture of the toothbrush

“Talk to children about the importance of eating healthily and brushing their teeth. Consider how to support oral health.For example, some settings offer a toothbrushing programme”

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1180056/DfE_Development_Matters_Report_Sep2023.pdf

I couldn't find that in the framework but even so, I don't think it states that teachers should supervise brushing. Rather, it's aimed at "practitioners, parents and carers". And it's much more about cutting down on sugary foods and drinks. It does say you can encourage children through role play, to brush the teeth of dolls and it does say:

"You could contact your local dental surgery and ask them if it is possible to show the children around"

But it's really not saying that it's already government policy to have teachers supervising children brushing their teeth. Even this doesn't say that:

"Supervised tooth brushing may be suitable in your setting"

There's a case study which is an idea of what you could do. But it's not directing teachers.

This isn't a job for schools, it's a job for parents. Schools should focus on education and not have to make up for inadequate parenting.

Didn't the article also mention four year olds being excluded? I wanted to cry at the thought of those littlies not having a hope if the solution is exclusion at four.

It mentioned them being so young they had to sit in rooms by themselves. Awful, so awful, and exacerbating the problem massively since being shut away from others due to covid restrictions was the problem in the first place.

Not in UK but given the population why don't the government encourage some of the companies who need to pay sugar tax to provide schools information packs, some dental health people to entertain and explain and sponsor toothbrushes and toothpaste for the children ?

let the companies use the funding against the sugar tax owed.

More joined up private/state thinking needs to be implemented worldwide to reduce the non core duties being assigned to teachers.

I do have memories of I think Colgate doing something like the above in Ireland in the 80s.

Teacher time is a resource I agree- but a programme that like this can slot into the daily routine and existing curriculum.

Well 20 minutes of anything could be 'slotted into' the school day, but only by removing 20 minutes of something else, unless you've magically discovered a way to create 20 more minutes in the datly.

Are Labour really planning this or is it another 7 bins/meat tax style Tory fabrication? 😂

My eldest (21) had this in his primary in Wales. My youngest (7) brushes his teeth every day in primary, same school. I get your point but on this one I'm firmly in the 'not a big deal, easily achieved' camp

Our dentist resigned, and her entire patient list was told they could no longer be accommodated at the practice and thus, none of has now has a dentist, including children. There are no dental practices within 60 miles who are taking NHS or private patients at the minute; we are now looking further afield and will have to travel 2+ hours to a city to find a dentist. We are on multiple waiting lists.

That's how they're not seeing dentists.

The biggest cause of children being admitted to hospital is for teeth to be extracted. All at a lot of expense, and not nice for the kids.🙁

No, teachers shouldn't have to teach children basic dental hygiene, but as there are a lot of incapable or inadequate parents, then it is cheaper and better for them to do so.

Sad they have to though. A toothbrush costs less than a pound, as does cheap toothpaste.

I posted the linked document above in response to your first post asking for more information. https://help-for-early-years-providers.education.gov.uk/safeguarding-and-welfare/oral-health

Yep, in our small city too. No NHS dentists at all. Appalling.

Failing Conservative public services, with schools ONCE AGAIN expected to pick up the slack.