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*Spoilers spoilers spoilers* the running grave spoilers thread.. (Content warning - mentions suicide)

717 replies

EggTheParrot · 27/09/2023 12:42

Just as the title says really.. spoilers ok in this thread. Let's keep the other one spoiler free??

Oh my god why is Robyn going undercover!

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SirSamVimesCityWatch · 27/09/2023 23:54

Just finished it. Phew. I feel both completely wired and utterly wiped out.

I was on edge the whole time Robin was in the UHC. Really found that hard to keep reading, I was so incredibly relieved when she made it out.

Did not see the ending coming at all - I never work out the who done it but this one definitely surprised me more than most. I am going to need to reread at some point to put all the details together but I'm not sure I can face it yet!

Really enjoyed seeing Strike grow as a character. Robin has developed so much, it was nice to see Strike doing the same. Prudence is a great addition, and it was good to see Strike and Lucy's relationship becoming less strained and there being more understanding of the different ways both of them have dealt with the trauma of their childhood. Really sad about Ted but very realistic, too, unfortunately.

I hated reading about the Carrie / Cherie suicide, and thinking about the little girls she left behind. That bit pulled at the heartstrings a little too much for me, just as a mother of two little girls. But that's just my subjective response. I don't know how JKR writes any of this stuff, I couldn't take my mind in those directions without ending up seriously depressed.

Loved the Mumsnet reference, and Strike calling the navy cunts. I have ex-army friends and that is definitely true to life!

ShedHermit · 28/09/2023 00:04

@SirSamVimesCityWatch Me too - If I’d ranked every character in order of how much I suspected them I think I would literally have put the actual killer right at the bottom of the list! Fell for every red herring, and was too distracted by Robin’s situation.

EggTheParrot · 28/09/2023 00:13

I'm partially sighted (yes really, I am a dr just in case you've read other threads of mine)

I use assistive tech and audible to read things. I have to say that although the ink black heart was good for Robin and Strike, it was absolutely horrific to listen to.

Robert Glenister reading the messages and texts through the game was so monotonous it was impossible to work out or even comprehend sometimes!! So glad he didn't have to read messages this time you can settle into the story more!

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ShedHermit · 28/09/2023 00:21

@EggTheParrot I listen to the audiobooks after reading them on paper - just started running grave on audible and agree that it’s much more suited. I’ve listened to them all on repeat but I skip Career of Evil because it’s too gory to have on as I fall asleep, and IBH because as you say it doesn’t work well in audio. I didn’t like the chats much on my first book read either, but did appreciate them on a reread.

EggTheParrot · 28/09/2023 00:26

ShedHermit · 28/09/2023 00:21

@EggTheParrot I listen to the audiobooks after reading them on paper - just started running grave on audible and agree that it’s much more suited. I’ve listened to them all on repeat but I skip Career of Evil because it’s too gory to have on as I fall asleep, and IBH because as you say it doesn’t work well in audio. I didn’t like the chats much on my first book read either, but did appreciate them on a reread.

It's just awful isn't it? I understand why she put them in but there really is no way I could understand or attach a username to a real life person til the 3rd listen 😳. I feel like she could have made the audio book a bit easier to understand because you can't go back and click through pages to see different things, maybe a different voice for each person 😂.

Is that the book one? With the author? I didn't like that one

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EggTheParrot · 28/09/2023 00:29

Oh no career of evil is the one where Matthew blocks strike from robins phone. Sorry

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ShedHermit · 28/09/2023 00:38

@EggTheParrot Even on paper I found it hard to keep track of the chats - I’ve never enjoyed all the classic Russian literature because I just can’t distinguish that many characters, and found IBH similar. I think in addition to the format it’s that there were no physical descriptions of the participants, and they all used similar language, so it just all blurred together a bit. I am interested to see how it works on TV. But Troubled Blood and Running Grave are just on another level anyway.

Career of evil you get the inside-the-head of the stalking creep, which I find more disturbing than some of the outright gore in the others. Silkworm is the book one and it’s grown on me over time. But after RG and TB I think the very first one is my favourite, and stands up really well on a reread. Relationship-wise I do like Lethal White, although I find the rakish killer a bit too attractive and charming.

Daiyu · 28/09/2023 08:24

I've just finished it - such an amazing book!!
The sense of menace when Robin was at the farm was so creepy.
Although it was v v late (or very early) I had to stay up to read until she gets out yesterday. I was really worried that something irredeemably awful would happen to Robin in there 😨

Daiyu · 28/09/2023 08:25

I'll listen to the audiobook now I've read it. The ending with Strike was brilliant - what a cliffhanger!!!

EmpressaurusOfCats · 28/09/2023 09:08

I was really looking forward to Strike going on Mumsnet!

There seemed to be a bit more of a concession to non-British English - toilets were always bathrooms & Strike & Robin consistently starting phone calls with ‘What’s up?’ but that’s something that always jumps out at me for some reason. It’s not a criticism, it’s just interesting.

I need to re-read it now!

UnaOfStormhold · 28/09/2023 09:32

Just imagining his first post! I trust he'd do better than "Man here..."

SirSamVimesCityWatch · 28/09/2023 09:42

I would pay very good money to read an extra chapter which was entirely Strike getting sucked into Mumsnet and being let loose on Relationships and AIBU 😂

MargotBamborough · 28/09/2023 10:01

Just finished it.

Every time I get close to the end of one of her books I regret not writing things down as I go along, timelines and so on to try and work out whodunnit before the big reveal. But I don't think I would ever have guessed this one.

I spoilered myself searching for a key word and saw that Charlotte had died in the results. Didn't look closely but guessed it was suicide rather than breast cancer.

Came up with various outlandish theories about what the big twist might be. One of them which thankfully turned out not to be it was that I wondered whether Mazu might have been a secret half sibling of Strike and Lucy's, but I suppose Leda's taste was rock stars, not nonces. I really thought Mazu was going to be central to the whole thing, that the big reveal was going to be about her origin story. I guess her overall malevolence was a very effective red herring.

At one point Lin was referred to as Lin Pirbright, which confused the hell out of me until I did a word search and saw it only appeared once so I figured it must be a typo.

My overall feeling is that yet again, JKR has managed to write another absolutely enormous pageturner which on the face of it has nothing to do with the subject for which she is currently famous for having VERY STRONG OPINIONS, but manages nevertheless to say quite a lot about it. In no particular order, massive safeguarding failures being overlooked because no one wants to be called out for bigotry, mass brainwashing of people to believe absolute nonsense or at least pretend to believe it because they're afraid to speak out, the way vulnerable people such as kids from troubled backgrounds or with autism are particularly susceptible, women in the role of handmaidens and collaborating in their own abuse, the tactics of controlling language and alienating vulnerable people from their families, and probably so many other things I have forgotten about or just missed.

I felt incredibly stressed during the build up to Robin going undercover, what with the ever-present threat of rape, particularly given her own history. The whole time she was in there was truly nail biting, and although I felt myself unclench a bit when she came out, there was still quite a lot of plot left to happen. But I think at least at that point I was reasonably confident she would make it to the end of the book without being raped, which is the thing I really did not want to see happen.

Cherie's suicide was just awful, and learning about her role in Daiyu's death didn't really lessen the blow of that for me, because as far as those two little girls were concerned she was just their mummy.

And all those trafficked babies. God, the scale of it is just incredible. All those lives torn apart by it all.

I think I found this a much more disturbing read than her other books.

ChocolateCakeOverspill · 28/09/2023 10:56

I’ve been awake since 2.30 reading it. Loved it. If I’d seen that on TV first or listened to the audiobook I think I’d have shouted at Ryan to fuck off at the end and let them finish their conversation.

I fucking love JKR, I think I might watch Harry Potter now, in appreciation of her.

MargotBamborough · 28/09/2023 11:04

ChocolateCakeOverspill · 28/09/2023 10:56

I’ve been awake since 2.30 reading it. Loved it. If I’d seen that on TV first or listened to the audiobook I think I’d have shouted at Ryan to fuck off at the end and let them finish their conversation.

I fucking love JKR, I think I might watch Harry Potter now, in appreciation of her.

I can't watch Harry Potter anymore because I can't bear to look at Daniel Radcliffe, Emma Watson and Rupert Grint!

But apparently there are plans to make a TV series. Hopefully one starring children who can actually act.

EmpressaurusOfCats · 28/09/2023 11:54

SirSamVimesCityWatch · 28/09/2023 09:42

I would pay very good money to read an extra chapter which was entirely Strike getting sucked into Mumsnet and being let loose on Relationships and AIBU 😂

Pat is DEFINITELY a mumsnetter.

ShedHermit · 28/09/2023 12:03

I happened to go into a waterstones this morning - the book was nowhere in sight in any of the multiple fiction and bestseller displays I walked past. Do they not promote her work at all?

On the other hand I handed it to my not especially into reading partner this morning and when I left ten minutes later he was non-responsive with his nose in the prologue.

EmpressaurusOfCats · 28/09/2023 12:08

I had a look in the big London Piccadilly Waterstones yesterday, since I was passing. There were a couple of copies in the window, among a load of other books, and I had to really hunt to find it inside. It made me very glad I’d bought my copy from the local independent because Waterstones really don’t deserve the cash.

mogtheexcellent · 28/09/2023 12:08

But isnt what Pat was describing about how friends and family help you to learn what to do with child raising part of why mumsnet is so popluar. We lead such fractured lives nowadays. I would imagine her daughters are on it more <waves hello to pats family>

I was shocked by Charlottes death as I figured she would kill herself one day but maybe not until the last book, thus freeing Strike and Robin to finally be together. Teds dementia was a sad side story. A funnier one was how Pattersons agency became the laughing stock of detective agencies.

A pp said how Lethal White is different because the killer is so charming but I love the fact JKR mixes it up a lot, if they were all creeps from the outset it wouldnt keep us guessing. I'm now rereading and stopping after every chapter to think things through. This is definitely equal to Troubled Blood. I find IBH easier to read now I can ignore all the game chat as I have read it before.

EmpressaurusOfCats · 28/09/2023 12:16

When Robin was so crushed after coming out of the box, I’d wondered if Strike or one of the others would end up breaking in to get her and she’d be far enough gone that she’d resist them out of fear at what Mazu & co might do to her.

ShedHermit · 28/09/2023 12:45

Just wanted to add some further less personal comments on the themes.

I love the use of the I Ching - there are a couple of subtle mentions of the ‘reverses’ in life, and the epigraphs contain wisdom. But the use of the I Ching to manipulate shows the danger of being too uncritically open to synchronicity - just as the appearance of ‘48’ shows a vulnerability in Robin. I loved the parallel with Strike not ‘admitting the possibility’ when in a hyped up atmosphere ripe for spiritual abuse, but also having some profound moments of connection with something like faith at various moments throughout the story.

Related to that the possibility of ‘saving people’ appears in so many different ways. Some people can’t be saved, and it’s self destruction to try. But there are times and ways when you do need to be alert and present and connected so that you can help other people, and possibly save them, in a more limited way. There is a moment of apparent synchronicity in Robin knowing that Strike would be waiting, and staking her life on it - if she hadn’t known he was there I think she would have submitted to rape to stay alive. But it isn’t really a coincidence, it’s her deep knowledge of his character and his care for her. She bets on that because she has faith in him and his love for her, and of course she’s right.

ShedHermit · 28/09/2023 12:50

Oh! Just made me think of how Harry has to learn that you can’t save everyone in Order of the Phoenix. The whispering voices are a bit like Charlotte’s endless answering phone messages. Going behind the curtain would be death in life.

SirSamVimesCityWatch · 28/09/2023 13:14

EmpressaurusOfCats · 28/09/2023 12:16

When Robin was so crushed after coming out of the box, I’d wondered if Strike or one of the others would end up breaking in to get her and she’d be far enough gone that she’d resist them out of fear at what Mazu & co might do to her.

Yes, I was terrified of this.

EmpressaurusOfCats · 28/09/2023 13:23

SirSamVimesCityWatch · 28/09/2023 13:14

Yes, I was terrified of this.

To be honest I was a bit disappointed it didn’t happen - I think it would have been incredibly gripping to read, and Robin and Strike are the only two characters who are totally guaranteed to survive.

Although of course it would be a bloody nightmare all round, and I was cheering when Robin escaped.

MargotBamborough · 28/09/2023 13:48

I thought Brexit might get a few mentions given the timeline but Robin not voting in the referendum because she was busy infiltrating a cult is not a plotline I would have predicted.

I laughed out loud when Robin goes collecting in Norwich and they're all running around searching for Emily and Robin suddenly sees a newspaper headline telling her the UK voted to leave the EU and she's like, "Wait, what??"

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