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9/11 - what happened to the planes?

775 replies

myyve · 12/09/2023 11:48

Thinking on from that awful day after the anniversary yesterday, one thought has come to mind.

What happened to the planes and those onboard, once they were flown into the twin towers? I know this probably does sound silly and I'm so sorry if it comes across as ignorant, but I truly do not know, and the internet doesn't mention anything, either..

Did they come to a crash landing afterwards? Or did they continue flying? What actually happened to the plane and those poor souls on board?

OP posts:
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Breakawaytour · 12/09/2023 21:05

Oh fgs, people change details slightly to protect their identity

Breakawaytour · 12/09/2023 21:05

In reference to all those quizzing the Op About her age

BoaBunsAreLovely · 12/09/2023 21:16

Lysianthus · 12/09/2023 16:04

If you were my 21 year old, I'd be telling you to get this thread deleted.
But you wouldn't have started it in the first place.
I lost a pal that day. I have to steel myself to watch documentaries about it, they are real and graphic and absolutely both show and talk about what actually happened. I'm astonished that you, at 21, think Mumsnet is the right forum.

What is wrong with asking questions about very significant things that have happened? Grow up. You’re acting like the poster has done something horrendous for asking a question. Ffs.

keffie12 · 12/09/2023 21:27

myyve · 12/09/2023 15:18

@Spirallingdownwards I really don't know what more I can say to make it up to you. I've apologised deeply so many time. I truly am sorry for your loss, and hope you are keeping well. I am contemplating quitting the course as I must say, my confidence has been greatly knocked here. I am not stupid, I just didn't know the answer to this particular question. I have never had any studies or lessons surrounding this topic before. I'm 6 days into a new course.

I'm learning. I'm sorry.

Don't you dare quit your course. We are a group of people of maybe a 50 or so who have responded. Some have been pleasant, some of and some downright awful.

There are nearly 8 billion people in the world. A few who are not understanding should not upskittle your career choice.

Learn from this, carry on forward, and go get your degree, please 🙏

myyve · 12/09/2023 21:29

Just catching up on the recent replies. Thanks to those who have been kind.

OP posts:
keffie12 · 12/09/2023 21:29

Above should say "some ok" not of

strawberriesarenot · 12/09/2023 21:32

Don't leave your course because of a bad afternoon on flipping mumsnet.
You weren't offensive, and my friend in Greenwich Village, New York, asked the same question, and neither was she.

amicissimma · 12/09/2023 21:36

It's quite clear from the thread title what it's about.

If you might find the subject matter distressing you can just not click on the thread.

JesusMaryAndJosephAndTheWeeDon · 12/09/2023 21:37

rainbowunicorn · 12/09/2023 21:03

2001 was 22 years ago. 2 plus 22 is 24.

Correct! it has been a long day, for someone who thinks the 90s were only five years ago, it is surprising that I am not further out! 🤦

Nanaof1 · 12/09/2023 21:48

Breakawaytour · 12/09/2023 20:23

Tbf this awful footage shows the plane going in, you can't see what happened behind the tower or immediately afterwards though. There's part of me that thinks it was going so fast maybe it would shoot through the building and emerge (on fire and totally wrecked) out of the other side.

Tbf, I think the huge, horrendous ball of flame answered the question, as did the big outward explosion with debris flying in every direction. It wasn't a little fire, it was a ball of enormous size, bigger than the plane. Add to that the fact that a building of that size isn't made of wood, vinyl siding or even brick. Then factor in that a plane can and has broken apart on a difficult landing. Logic and reason, after considering the above leads only to an obvious conclusion. A burning plane coming out of a building and falling on fleeing citizens would have garnered a might bit of attention.

It's not that I minded the question. I minded the fact that a 24-year-old who obviously got through school could not have thought the question out to its logical conclusion or at least asked the question in a more mature and thoughtful way.

Breakawaytour · 12/09/2023 21:49

myyve · 12/09/2023 21:29

Just catching up on the recent replies. Thanks to those who have been kind.

Tomorrow is a new day OP, don't let the horrors on here ever stop you from asking any question you like, jeez if you can't on here where can you? Hugs xx

Breakawaytour · 12/09/2023 21:50

Nanaof1 · 12/09/2023 21:48

Tbf, I think the huge, horrendous ball of flame answered the question, as did the big outward explosion with debris flying in every direction. It wasn't a little fire, it was a ball of enormous size, bigger than the plane. Add to that the fact that a building of that size isn't made of wood, vinyl siding or even brick. Then factor in that a plane can and has broken apart on a difficult landing. Logic and reason, after considering the above leads only to an obvious conclusion. A burning plane coming out of a building and falling on fleeing citizens would have garnered a might bit of attention.

It's not that I minded the question. I minded the fact that a 24-year-old who obviously got through school could not have thought the question out to its logical conclusion or at least asked the question in a more mature and thoughtful way.

I think your answer has been done to death after 20 off flipping pages of people saying the same thing 😏

Nanaof1 · 12/09/2023 22:11

housethatbuiltme · 12/09/2023 15:36

I have always abhorred the damn busters too... inexcusable terrorism.

And the Wilhelm Gustav torpedoing (how the fuck they got blowing up 10,000+ child refugees as an 'act of war' god only knows).

If the military choose to fight, shoot and kill each other after signing on to do that over land and titles whatever but it should not ever kill innocent civilians, once it does its not a 'war' its 'terrorism'.

All war has "terrorism" by your definition. Why are the dam buster raids and the torpedoing of the Gustav worse than the bombings in London?
No war can ever be fought with just the soldiers going after each other, though it would be nice. What would they do, pick a field, every soldier shows up and the armies have a "last man standing battle"?

Was the Gustoff clearly marked as an evacuation ship? Did it fly white flags? It was used by Hitler to reward his best (most evil) officers and later as military transport, so if it wasn't clearly marked, it wasn't an intentional act against civilians. If it was clearly marked than the sub commander should have faced a war crimes tribunal.

JoBrodie · 12/09/2023 22:15

@myyve I think your question is perfectly valid. It's not unreasonable to wonder if more bits of a plane might be recoverable after a crash, based on your (and mine) general background experience of planes crashing. Don't give up your course because of forum-snark :)

Jo

Elleherd · 12/09/2023 22:25

Please don't read the rest of this post if you find cold details offensive.

I did a great deal of research at the time and later something bigger.

I lost a friend in the towers, and a couple of folk known through him. It was and still is a horrific traumatic world changing event.
I don't have an issue with Op's confusion or asking, or how it was put.
From an engineering or emergency response angle etc, it was a very complicated event.
From a viewer perspective it was a horribly simple drawn out traumatic event.

What's below is the 'official what happened physically to the planes,' based on eye witness testimony, forensics, and salvage, confirming each other. It may help to understand each floor of the towers was roughly an acre.

The first plane sliced through damaging floors 93 to 99 of the North Tower, and lodged in the building. A landing gear wheel from the plane went clean through and landed a few blocks away.
Inside a fireball of jet fuel exploded on impact, shooting down one, possibly more, of the lift shafts. That fireball exploded onto several lower floors. (Proven are 77, 22; the West Street lobby; and B4, four stories underground.) A large part of the plane was witnessed to be whole, post impact, inside the building, burning fiercely, by people evacuating from 105 in the South tower.
Flight 11's defibrillator was found blocks away in 2014.

The second plane banked as it hit the South Tower cutting through and damaging the 77th to 85th floors. Because it banked, it left parts of those floors (notably staircase A) mainly intact. This is why we have a handful of impact zone and above survivors and eye witnesses to the condition of the first plane in the North tower, post impact, viewed from the South tower.

In the South tower only eighteen people from the impact zone or above survived after the plane hit. One person survived from the center of the impact zone on the 81st floor. The planes wing sliced through his office. His description was of total “demolition” and everything “broken up.” He struggled to breathe from the strength of the jet fuel. Parts of the 2nd plane went straight through the building and landed a few blocks away on three separate sites.

Because staircase A survived, there are witnesses from the 105th floor who reported seeing part of the fuselage of the plane lodged in the north towers while they were evacuating, before the 2nd plane had hit the south tower. They had made it to a few floors below where the second plane impacted and experienced a fireball shoot down the stairwell.
A wing attachment found years later could have come from either plane.

It is likely the first plane was mainly intact post impact but subsequently burnt up and the second plane broke up considerably more on impact before what remained inside the building burnt up. Some un-burnt parts went through the building entirely. Some burnt plane parts were effectively ejected from the buildings during collapse.

What happened to bodies and why, is also what causes some of the confusion.

There's enough info there for you to find more with proper sources and detail.
The only stupid question is the one you don't ask. How, where, and when you ask it, is a skill you will develop. Good luck with your course.

MonicaPluto · 12/09/2023 22:27

@Nanaof1

It's not that I minded the question. I minded the fact that a 24-year-old who obviously got through school could not have thought the question out to its logical conclusion or at least asked the question in a more mature and thoughtful way.

There's nothing wrong with how she asked, and I don't think you're one to talk about asking in a mature and thoughtful way, because there's nothing mature or thoughtful about you joining a pile on of a 24 year old.

JoBrodie · 12/09/2023 22:30

Excellent and fascinating reply @Elleherd - thank you for writing that.
Jo

fashionqueen1183 · 12/09/2023 22:38

Nanaof1 · 12/09/2023 19:38

Thank you. I have wondered what people are talking about when they say "one landed". I don't consider nose first into a field as a landing.

All I can assume is they weren’t alive when it happened. I thought everyone would have known about the flight where the passengers fought back but knew they’d die if they had seen the news at the time.
If they don’t the film United 93 is very good. But very upsetting. I couldn’t get some of the scenes out of my head for ages.

GoingToBeLessRubbishAtLife · 12/09/2023 22:40

“Inside a fireball of jet fuel exploded on impact, shooting down one, possibly more, of the lift shafts. That fireball exploded onto several lower floors. (Proven are 77, 22; the West Street lobby; and B4, four stories underground.)”

————————————————————————————————————————

@Elleherd thank you for this, it is a really helpful reply.

Can you (or anyone else) explain the quote above a bit more? Do you mean flames went into the empty lift shaft and down and out of the doors onto the four floors mentioned? Then presumably started four separate fires as well as on the higher floors?

MissConductUS · 12/09/2023 22:45

Can you (or anyone else) explain the quote above a bit more? Do you mean flames went into the empty lift shaft and down and out of the doors onto the four floors mentioned? Then presumably started four separate fires as well as on the higher floors?

The planes carried thousands of gallons of jet fuel. It didn't all vaporize in an instant, so burning jet fuel would have poured down the lift shaft.

GoingToBeLessRubbishAtLife · 12/09/2023 22:56

MissConductUS · 12/09/2023 22:45

Can you (or anyone else) explain the quote above a bit more? Do you mean flames went into the empty lift shaft and down and out of the doors onto the four floors mentioned? Then presumably started four separate fires as well as on the higher floors?

The planes carried thousands of gallons of jet fuel. It didn't all vaporize in an instant, so burning jet fuel would have poured down the lift shaft.

Ah so liquid fuel that was on fire poured into the lift shaft and some of it exited on the four floors mentioned, is that right?

Kirova · 12/09/2023 23:02

I think you're getting a hard time OP, but I also don't think you asked as 'research'. You could find out what happened to the planes on a basic wiki article without having to dig any deeper. I think you asked because you wanted to talk about it - and okay. There are plenty of other 9/12 threads all over the internet, so I don't see why people are so shocked and appalled by this one!

MissConductUS · 12/09/2023 23:16

Ah so liquid fuel that was on fire poured into the lift shaft and some of it exited on the four floors mentioned, is that right?

Yes, that's my understanding, as explained to me by someone I know in the FDNY who was there that day.

Nanaof1 · 12/09/2023 23:27

MonicaPluto · 12/09/2023 22:27

@Nanaof1

It's not that I minded the question. I minded the fact that a 24-year-old who obviously got through school could not have thought the question out to its logical conclusion or at least asked the question in a more mature and thoughtful way.

There's nothing wrong with how she asked, and I don't think you're one to talk about asking in a mature and thoughtful way, because there's nothing mature or thoughtful about you joining a pile on of a 24 year old.

Got it. Didn't know that 24 is the new 13. 🙄

Nanaof1 · 12/09/2023 23:40

fashionqueen1183 · 12/09/2023 22:38

All I can assume is they weren’t alive when it happened. I thought everyone would have known about the flight where the passengers fought back but knew they’d die if they had seen the news at the time.
If they don’t the film United 93 is very good. But very upsetting. I couldn’t get some of the scenes out of my head for ages.

I saw the film too. The bravery they showed was heroic. They realized they would not make it, but they seemed bound not to let that plane take out even more people.

Like you, it has stuck in my head all of these years. That and the children killed on the planes. Three of them were young students who got picked for some type of educational trip, iirc. Broke my heart for all their families.