I cost the taxpayer less but that’s not good enough ?!

[ImNotdrainingsociety]

Had a family event descend into an argument today because nobody liked my facts.

SIL has a dc the same age as mine (3)

She works and gets 85% of her nursery fees paid (it’s really expensive)

I am a sahm and get some UC as I’m a carer but my UC is less than her 85% nursery cost help …..MIL had been moaning about me not working how ‘it won’t help dc problems you know ‘ (SEN) and how ‘you’re not contributing’ but as soon as I pointed out the amounts after asking SIL what her nursery cost is and working out 85% I was apparently’acting like a bitch ’!!!

As far as I’m concerned neither of us is doing anything wrong but when attacked I simply started the facts as to what each of us ‘costs the taxpayer’ as they kept going on at me !

I don’t think you understand what a society is.

Lots of contributions to society are unpaid - there's an army of people out there running brownies and cubs, working in charity shops, fundraising, helping out in schools etc. And that's before you get to people who are doing unpaid caring work for relatives (which does save the state the cost of paid help).
SEN provision can be woeful in this country - I honestly don't get how a grandmother can resent her dil for feeling it's best to look after her small child herself. Very few people can do what this mother is doing, whereas most jobs could be done by any number of people. Unless the OP had a career which was the equivalent of being one of 3 surgeons in the world who specialises in rare diseases, then her skills are best used in caring for her own child.

@Ravaged maybe you dont understand what contribution is!

Riiiight so only income tax makes a contribution? The fact that the op is still paying other types of tax is irrelevant? The fact that she is saving the state a load of money by being an Unpaid carer doesn’t count?

Even using your (completely incorrect and ignorant) assertion that money is the only way to contribute to society- the op is still contributing. In order to work out whether the op or the sil is the biggest contributor to the economy (not society, that’s a different question) you would have to work out a lifetime of interaction from whether one of them was in nicu as a baby, how much tax they paid pre kids, how often they have visited a doctor in their lifetime, whether they or their kids went/go to private school, whether they have had interaction with the criminal justice system (as a victim or a perpetrator), how much they have bought over the years at what prices, how many children they have and how medicalised their births were and on and on.

Your in laws are arseholes and I wouldn't place any value on the crap that comes out of their bitchy mouths.

@Gunpowder

The difference is not economic vs not economic - it's 'to society' vs not.
As I said in my earlier posts on how this is regarded under communism:

A SAHM is not regarded as contributing to society under communism, because what she's doing is tending to her young, which is self contained to the offspring/herself. And indeed is what say mammals do, who have no society.

Society and working outside our self-contained 'me and my offspring' unit is what differentiates us from animals.

Society and working outside our self-contained 'me and my offspring' unit is what differentiates us from animals.

This isn't correct. Many animals and insects exist within a society.

So for example a solicitor that only did pro bono work would be contributing to society, even though that contribution would not be counted in the economic stats as no money is changing hands.
(Although it can be quantified and it's arguable that it should be counted.)

But that's because that solicitor would be working outside the self contained 'tending to one's young' that mammals do.

Or anything else on the same vein - e.g. volunteers for meals on wheels.

You all sound awful tbh. So petty and unnecessarily competitive.

What is the point of society if it doesn't provide the support that enables a mother of a 3 year old child with SEN to stay at home and care for her child?

Who cares. Most people aren't net contributers anyway. I work full time but I don't earn enough to be a net contributer. I don't stress about it and I don't care who does what. Just ignore and do what you think is best.

Contrary to what some people believe (those who have no experience of the benefits system and just make guesses based on prejudice) you can't just sit on your arse and claim UC for no good reason. Shocking. If someone is getting UC and they aren't being asked to look for work then they have a good enough reason not to work (in OP's case, being a carer).

@SeulementUneFois seems to know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.

'You're acting like a bitch' this means you've won the argument, she has nothing further to add to support her point of view.

@MerryBeard

I understand that (you know I was simplifying:).
But in any case, in those animals' cases, it's not each individual animal's tending to their own young that contributes to their own - let's say proto society. It's what they do outside that, their interactions and contributing to everyone else, to the wider system.

But you are totally ignoring the fact your SiL pays tax and NI which would offset some of her help with nursery fees. You'd help your DC more if they went to nursery and got an EHCP started. They will often take 2 year to get from start to finish so your DC may be 7 before getting one. If DC was at nursery they can get the ball rolling so it would be quicker for your DC.

@MerryBeard

Again my point is not about economic quantification.
It's about contributing outside the pure mammalian 'me and my offspring' unit.

Writing amazing poetry that only inspires and elates people a century later is contributing to society, even if the poet at the time died in penury.

And indeed is not quantifiable - unlike my earlier pro bono solicitor example.
As who could quantify the joy people get from poetry, or the arts in general...

Well the OP might well write amazing poetry, or maybe her child will.

Humans are mammals. It's the being mammals and raising children that means humans are still here. It's enough.

OP - What you're doing is admirable and absolutely more than enough.

Ignore the people on here and in your real life who question that. Have a nice cuppa tea and a large slice of 'ignore the twats'.

OP your family sound horrible. You enjoy your time at home with your child. They'll be at school before you know it. Ignore the nasty comments.

Well it's very easy to quantify and appreciated the joy and usefulness of raising a happy, healthy child who is loved and well equipped to fulfill their full potential in life and society.

@MerryBeard

"Well the OP might well write amazing poetry, or maybe her child will."

And then that would be a contribution to society.
But not the mammalian tending to one's young.

(Or otherwise to Godwin the same argument could be made for Putin's mother.)

I don't really think you can tell someone what would be better for their DC without knowing the full details of the situation.

Aside from everything else, people don't seem to realise that childcare for a child with SEN can be non existent in many areas! Then as your child gets to secondary age and their peers no longer need childcare, but your SEN child still can't be left alone all day while you're at work, again there's no childcare provision for them.