Can I report a church? Who to?

[BlueSquirrelTurnip]

I went to a new church yesterday with my kids and I was very upset by the message.
The whole sermon was based around giving (money) - specifically giving MORE than you can afford.

The church want to fundraise for a brand new building. And the vicar said - “don’t just give what you can afford. That’s not spirituality challenging. You need to give more than that.”

He also said something like: “if you are struggling for money, then you should give money to the church. God will bless you abundantly and you will get more money back.”

Aside from the liturgical arguments with the above (big eyeroll from this lapsed Catholic/sometime Anglican), I’m furious that in a cost of living crisis so much pressure was being put on people to give more money than they can afford . And all just for a church building! (If it had been for food for the hungry, I might have been slightly more understanding)

I want to do something. Can anyone think of what I can do? Is there someone I can complain to about this?

I should clarify - I want to complain to try to stop it happening! Not because it upset me or anything.

No idea but bumping for you

Do they belong to a wider denomination, or are they an independent church?

If the former there should be some sort of oversight body - look on the denomination website. If the latter then I don't know!

What denomination is the church?

The Diocese?

Look at 'A Church Near You' online. Many of them have a contact number or email of who is 'over' that Church. Good luck! They are out of order I agree!

A Church Near You

I very much doubt it’s a church with a hierarchy/ governance like CofE/ Catholic/ Methodist/ Baptist.

The important question is what type of church?

That’s just CofE. I’ll eat my hat if the ops church wasn’t extremely unregulated.

Bishop?
Google the demonisation of the church and how to report a concern?

I used to follow a blog of a woman in the US and even when they were trying to clear thousand of dollars of debt ( college fees and costs) they were still giving 10% of their income to their church before feeding their kids, buying nappies etc… seemed all wrong to me.

The church near you website will only help if it’s an Anglican (C of E) church. If that’s the case there is a clear structure and there will definitely be someone to complain to (I’d suggest about the vicar in the first instance). Same goes for the other organised churches eg Catholic, Methodist etc. It will be harder if it’s an independent church as they don’t have the same accountability.

Hmmm good point. You may be right.

Is it a church that preaches prosperity gospel?

I have no idea who you would complain to but Yanbu I went to one years ago and the exact same language was used. One young women a single mother got up and the pastor was talking about how she gave all her benefits to the church and has seen great luck since. There was even an old lady dancing next to us and when the healing part started she raised her hand for healing and then proceeded to hobble to the stage forgetting she’d just been dancing the fandango a second earlier.
it was great fun and very entertaining but yes it is so wrong For them to prey on people like that.

If it's C of E, then the person further up the hierarchy would be the Archdeacon or Bishop. The Diocesan website will have names and contact details. They'd want to know, as this sort of thing would be seen as questionable, even as spiritual abuse in the C of E.

The style sounds more like a Pentecostal or independent Evangelical church. Most of those are in networks, so there is usually an area supervisor with some oversight. Having said that, this 'give more than you can afford to prove your faith' approach would be fairly typical of a lot of those churches – so they might not see it as problematic!

I agree it's highly inappropriate.

It’s not C of E. It’s part of a group of over 150 churches (according to wiki) so not totally independent either. What concerns me is that I doubt internal church people will care - they probably agree with it?

Do you think a debt charity or something would care? The church also runs a very busy food bank - horrible irony that they are then encouraging their own into poverty

Which denomination?

Yep sounds like Prosperity Gospel. Vile people.

I know no- one likes a journo, but have you tried the local newspaper? ( this is what they are designed for) Name and shame. That will make them tone down the message.

And if it’s part of an organised church go straight to church leaders.

might be worth checking with council?

I'd check their website to see if there's a hierarchy in place and a means to report. Alternatively you could put your concerns in writing and put it to the elders if there is a church council of sorts for them to discuss how this might affect more vulnerable members of the church. In some senses I can see how the minister has interpreted certain parts of the bible to get to that conclusion but I think that's a dangerous way to be preaching it to a congregation. Would be horrifying to think of a vulnerable person or wee pensioner giving away more than they can afford and ending up in poverty over it. I would argue that there's a duty to safeguard vulnerable parishioners and that means being careful and specific with how things are preached.

I am a practising Christian and I don’t like the sound of this at all. I would suggest voting with your feet and trying another church of a more mainstream denomination.

By all means try, but a lot of religious denominations take more than their adherents can afford.

I was friends for a while with a US pastor's wife who'd been sent with her husband on a mission to save us heathenish Scots. It was awful - they were worked to the bone, paid buttons, and had to collect tithes from their not-very-wealthy congregation. She seemed very unhappy and it all felt very unethical.

We lost touch when she inevitably tried to convert me but I think of her and hope she got out. Her and her husband seemed like genuinely nice people but their church was not.

It’s not C of E. It’s part of a group of over 150 churches (according to wiki) so not totally independent either. What concerns me is that I doubt internal church people will care - they probably agree with it

Can't you just tell us which church or which group of churches it's affiliated with?
If it is a church that teaches prosperity gospel then there is no point complaining.

The problem is that the minister and most of the congregation are almost certainly used to this approach to fundraising: 'give more than you can afford and God will bless you more'. They believe it. Most of them probably grew up with it. Complaining to them will probably mark you out in their eyes as 'ye of little faith'.

I think the moral of the story is: don't go to that church.

People need to be aware that there are lots of desperate units ( scheming bastards) trying to get their cash. My advice is to ignore all of them and put any spare money in your own bank accounts unless you really trust your payees. Please take care as there are lots of thriving bastards around.

It could be allied to the Evangelical Alliance and they’d be very interested. However without knowing which church this is just a Christians are awful thread so I’m out.