How do private schools do it?

[Anotherday24]

Had a quick catch up with DD’s teacher a couple of days ago. DD’s always had good grades and been towards the top of her class since she started in reception, but recently has seemed quite down about school work.

Teacher told me that there had been an influx of “very clever” kids this year (the local private school closed and 7 DC joined the year). And it’s been a real shock to DD not having it all her own way and she has struggled to keep up with them, especially in English. It was almost as if he was crowing that DD is being out performed.

I’m trying to make sense of this. The school that closed down wasn’t selective. I find it strange that all 7 are SO much cleverer than the 20 odd state school kids. Is it just that they’ve already covered the syllabus, or they’ve been taught better? Perhaps their lockdown offering was better? Will it level off?

Also the teacher has taught this class for 2 years so shouldn’t he be concerned that all these new kids are doing so much better than the ones who have been taught at his school all the way through?

Just not sure what to make of it. Will DD (year 5) ever catch up? How do private schools do it?

www.telegraph.co.uk/education/12174166/Private-school-pupils-two-years-ahead-of-state-educated-peers-by-the-age-of-16.html

Link here although it says age 16, also old research, although my money would be that the gap has widened.

Money, smaller classes, fewer children with additional needs or from chaotic homes.

It's not necessarily anything to do with them being cleverer and I'd be unimpressed by the teacher saying that. I wonder if your DD is a bit boastful or something if you feel he is pleased that she's got some competition?

Smaller classes, better behaved children and more discipline/higher standards I'd imagine.

Our private school is non-selective and the school has 27% of children with SEN. My eldest is one of them.

Just to say as it can be a bit of a myth that private schools weed out the ones with additional needs. Some do of course- but certainly not all. In fact this is why we chose the school- the SEN provision was excellent and at the state primary DS1 originally went to the head teacher described him to us with 'Let;s face it. He's a little wierd'. (literally. We pulled him out the next day and sent him to his current school where the comment from his form teacher was ; 'i just love the way he thinks' after the first term).

just to add i know the % of SEN because it was in the Independent schools inspectorate report.

I agree with this and it's sort of a distilled version of the mindset at private schools....standards a high, as are expectations. From teaching in both private and state schools there is far less behaviour management in private schools. Smaller classes and longer days mean each child gets more individual attention.

@TiredOfCleaning I don’t know if you could tell me the area the school is in - am looking for private schools with a high % of SEN! And am finding it difficult but they do seem to combine great pastoral care, small class sizes and but also talking to the students is totally different - the enthusiasm for learning.

The specialist SEN schools have the first two, but not the last - high expectations, top quality teaching, loads of learning opportunities.

Sure! I will PM. you. :)

It may not be selective but at my primary school, my class was divided into two based on ability. There were only 24 of us in total so each streamed class was only 12 people so got a lot of individual attention. The top stream would be really pushed and the bottom stream would have more supportive types of intervention.

I find this 2 years ahead thing very strange in that an average state school class will have a very broad spread of ability, with some children working at a much lower level and some 'ahead' it seems prep schools are very narrow and all ahead?

I also dont really get the advantage of being ahead, apart from maybe languages? The exams at 16 dont put them all ahead so what happens next.

Smaller classes so much more individual attention
Higher expectations from parents and teachers
Less disruption / stronger discipline
Better resources at home and in school

At an individual level there will always be state pupils who can compete with and match the achievements of privately educated students. At a population level, it's the above factors that make the difference between state and private.

Private schools are self selected even if not selective. By that I mean you have to firstly be able to afford the fees (so have a good job, most good jobs require a higher level of education, academic ability is partly genetic) and secondly prioritise the spending of money on education giving their kids the soft support they need to achieve. Both points combined mean that kids in private schools are more likely to be naturally higher achievers so transplant them to the state sector and they do well.

My kids were state educated but had the background and advantages I mentioned above, both got top GCSEs, both went to Russell group universities. It's not just the school basically but private schools are full of pushy parents!

Exactly this. Parents who value education and actually like their children or at least want to see them achieve.
Some parents of state educated children just see it as free child care. They don’t see any value in the education and don’t bother to help their children in any way. Then you’ve got children living in poverty etc.

GCSEs are easy for them so you end up with long strings of 9s or all 8 and 9s considered perfectly normal, this supports applications for Russel group Universities. That why there are contextual offers.

Smaller class sizes, high expectations and an encouragement to do your best rather than just be ok/average, academic streaming for maths and English from an early age (this benefits both ends of the spectrum), less disruptive behaviour. The teaching during covid was poles apart. Speaking from experience at primary level, local private schools had a full day of work provided (live lessons and recorded lessons), whereas a lot of state schools barely got any work set. Obviously there were exceptions to this.

A large majority of private school parents are often highly educated themselves and value education so push their children (that’s not saying these parents don’t exist in state schools).

Unfortunately, state schools are measured on how many pupils reach the “expected standard”. Looking at Y6 SATS as an example, teachers are more likely to spend more time with the lower ability children trying to get them up to the expected standard than they are trying to stretch the most able pupils, because that’s what the league tables and statistics encourage.

As people have pointed out, ultimately this could be of benefit to your DD if the bar is now set a bit higher and she is not so much of an outlier. While it may come as a shock at first no longer to be miles ahead of everyone else, long-term it is likely to benefit her if the overall effect of this change is that she has a more advanced/motivated peer group that keeps her on her toes. In an ideal world, I would not want my child to attend a school where they were the brightest by miles but one with a true mix of abilities, including at the top end.

Also worth mentioning lots of private primaries got most of the children back in school in May 2020

My son goes to a bog standard Scottish state school and they teach and recite poetry from primary 1, usually tying in with Burns Day, totally normal!

Also the fact that the parents who chose to send their children to private school are by definition very interested in education, so the kids may be getting more support at home than some children do.

I hope my experience gives you some optimism, OP. I was state school educated and went to a very well-regarded university, studying a course that requires top grades. The course had a HUGE number of students from private schools. So yes, the private schooling had given them a leg up in achieving the sorts of grades required to get in to the course. However, come graduation, the First Class Honours Degrees were achieved almost entirely by the state school pupils. Private schools are great, I understand, at teaching kids their subjects and coaching them in how to pass exams. Without that level of more intense education, most struggled to compete and achieve the same as those who had achieved their grades through the same hard graft as the state school pupils. Your daughter is bright and I would see this as a temporary blip as these kids have had the benefit of private education for several years. It will even out as they all go through the state system together and the brighter minds will prevail

My children are at a private school and they have been getting an hour a night of homework almost since the start.

They’re not cleverer than anybody else but they will have been worked harder I assume. And that’s not the same as working harder - more homework more pressure. For example they didn’t suffer any disruptions through Covid whereas my nephew and niece were next high and dry which I found completely awful.

The comparison between my friend’s child (state senior school) and mine (private) during lockdown was immense. My friend would tell me proper structured schooling from home was pretty much non existent at their state school, our independent one was full on structured days. This could be a reason. Conversely, when mine started independent seniors they had gone to state primary and were by far the cleverest in their year 7 private school.

They really don't. 80% is about admissions. LSE blog on this.

If she is self motivated, at a huge cost to those DC who aren't.

Yes in lockdown we had a a 9-3.30 online lesson schedule all live with their subject teachers. We even did PE online. I know from friends that this did not happen everywhere. One of my friends took her year 4 out of the local school and sent him to ours mid-lockdown because he was getting a single page worksheet on Mondays that he had to send back on fridays and nothing else. Clearly this was NOT the same everywhere and we were of course still paying fees so there was more emphasis on live work. This will have had a huge knockon effect for the students who did not receive this provision I am sure.