"High earners"

[JoanThursday1972]

I see this a lot on here. Exactly what makes someone a high earner? Over a specific figure? A high earner in Hartlepool will not be the same as one in the City of London. How high is high?

I would consider 50K plus a high earner!

Context matters if comparing say, Mali with New York.
But when we are talking about Sussex vs Birmingham, for example, not so much.

I think it’s easy to get hung up on figures, when figures only have meaning relative to value/averages.

Just like there’s a thread going on currently about a tin of Heinz beans being £1.40 now. The figure means something relative to other food items, historic prices of beans, peoples buying power and what that is relative to consumables and services.

To repeat myself, generally, earners = workers. So In any given tax year, there’s a system of categorising a sector of society, not every individual within the state.
I think the most recent stats say that 32 million citizens are ‘earning’ out of a population of 67 million. You could be in the top 5/10% of earners, but be in the lower end of relative wealth. Wealth distribution is becoming more unequal, and creating a massive gulf.

I believe all workers should have a fairer division of (and access) to wealth. Ultimately, the vast majority of people who are on PAYE can be lumped together in the ‘little people’ category. We’re small fry, and there’s clear orchestration to create division and squabbling.

OP, you don't say anything about whether you are currently renting, or if you already have equity in your current home?

To be honest, with mortgage rates where they are now, it's probably not a great time to be stretching yourselves on a house move. God knows when rates will fall though.

Are your kids in school? What's the plan there? Surely access to good schools would be a first priority when looking at potential areas? If you are considering independent schools, this will also have an impact on where / what you can afford on that salary.

Personally, I would put location over size of house. Living in the suburbs can be very bland. My advice in your scenario would be to wait a while to see what's happening with mortgage rates and then move to SW London and just decide to make do with what you can afford (with schools factored in) - even if it's a three bedroom terrace.

This question needs reframing as “high/low disposable income”

I don’t think it does at all.

Someone who is massively high earner can have low disposable income because of the choices they make. That doesn’t make them no longer a high earner - in fact being a high earner likely gives them the option to make the spending options that they do.

DH and BIL do basically the same job, very similar salaries. They are both high earners. Both SIL and I are SAHP (I do get carers allowance for our youngest which she doesn’t).

They are skint by month end and would argue that they’re not high earning, but they are. They’re just high spending as well.

My income puts me in the top 83%.
Is that high? I suppose it is, and I'm happy enough with it, but then I earn a fraction of what most of my friends do!

The fact you can even be "prudent" and do this, is indicative of the high earner status you hold.

The fact you don't recognise your privileged state is awful.

@Talkingtomyhouseplants

The question doesn't need reframing.

Earning are irrelevant to outgoings

It is relative though, it can't be denied. My dp earns in the top 10% but here in London it genuinely doesn't go that far. If he were back where he grew up (South Wales Valleys) then he would be able to afford a lot more. You just can't compare it when you can rent a house for £300-400 a month somewhere vs the cheapest being around £1,500 here.

Areas of the UK are poorer than rural Romania and large swathes of Eastern Europe. People just don't see it you don't want to see it.

We’ve got a household income of around £73k. This has only changed in the last couple of years and our children no longer live at home.

We over pay in our mortgage and save a lot. I do most of our grocery shopping in Aldi. I can get my hair and nails done whenever I like, and I do. I get acupuncture every couple of weeks. I needed dental care recently, couldn’t get an appointment with an NHS dentist so going private it was, and our income meant I could do that. It’s these choices that make my life so much easier now.

When our children were smaller we were quite skint, and I’d lay awake at night worrying about money, so I completely understand the privilege of where I sit now.

@righthands

It isn't relative.

You can afford to live in an expensive area because you're a higher earner.

I think you have me confused with someone else. I've no kids, haven't talked about moving house or moving to London!

But your £1500 is NOT the cheapest. I always find this amusing about people like this who live in London. they seem to think all their minimum wage cleaners, baristas, junior admin staff etc etc don't ALSO live in London? Do they just beam in from Yorkshire every day?

You ARE a high earner. You make choices to live in more expensive environments. It is absolutely true that your £1500 rent is higher than a similar home might be in Wales, but it doesn't change the fact that it's still significantly more than what most people are paying, yes, even in London. Just because you only see the ones earning the same or more than more, doesn't mean the rest don't exist.

Also, maybe, based on London rates, your DH's top 10% overall is only top 20% in London and that level of relativity is fair enough. But it's still at the top end!

I think a big issue when discussing wealth and inequality currently, is the big push from media/government that talks about money mostly in terms of annual taxable income. Most of the wealth in the country/world is not held as earned salary income, but through holding assets such as property, shares, natural resources etc. it’s very much about letting the ‘little people’ squabble amongst themselves.

this

I’m in the 40% tax bracket so I know that puts me in a fortunate position. However, I’m crap with money and inevitably up my outgoings whenever I get a pay rise with one thing or another.

I will never be ‘rich’ because of my spendy ways 😩

@TiredButDancing no, they don't beam in, they are in social housing or housing that is subsidised by benefits or house shares.

A high earner is over about 50K (50260 I think)

Having high outgoings, high debt, not managing your money, living in an expensive area does not magically make you a low earner.

Not been to the Valleys for a while then, have you 😉 😁

Rents on my (very normal) estate are around the £1k a month mark.

Gone are the days where rents this way were under £500, sadly.

That being said, you’re right and it’s relative to your outgoings.

Also salaries have really stagnated & tax bands haven't moved. 50k today is the equivalent to approx 35k in 2010, did people class that as a high salary then?

I think it depends on age and where you live - all relative really.

I think along the lines of:

'above average' as £50K+
'higher' as £75-£125K
but I would expect someone who specifically mentions being a 'high earner' to be on at least £125K - especially if over the age of late thirties+
Very high earner - at least £200K?

Agreed.

A high earner, forgetting context and outgoings, is to me over 100k - the jobs in my sector that are director level and above (executive director etc), so no set pay spine, where salary is negotiated and they get a bonus. This is a sector that would pay the same regardless of location, maybe there would be a small London weighting, but regardless of where you live such earnings should achieve a very good standard of living.

And the over 100k would probably be in reality at least 125k - up to 180k.

I think to some extent the top 5% aren't the top 5%. It's the top 5% according to whats reported. The smart top 5% are self empolyed and 'pay themselves' much less while taking their actual wealth through other avenues. I bet the actual top 5% are probably managing to set themselves up looking like they're much further down the pole!

Back when EMA was available to college students, I remember there was one kid who would turn up for registration every day in the brand new audi his parents got him for his birthday, having driven from their 6 bed detached house, to collect his registration tick to get his EMA. The EMA you could supposedly only get if your household income was less than £20K ish a year. Both parents self employed.