My payslip as a doctor in Feb 2021 during COVID

[Juniordoc]

See attached image. Yes this is for full-time work with weekends and nights in the currently stretched working conditions that the NHS provides.

This does not include the expenses and sacrifices of a six year medical degree. On top of that, we have to pay out of pocket for our own GMC membership, medical defence union, postgrad exams and revision courses, conferences and courses.

Please get behind us and support the strikes. We are burnout, exhausted and struggling to live

A trainee police officer with the Met Police gets £33500 a year. Medical professionals are appallingly paid.

I agree, but the most vocal definitely won't.

Inner London medical staff get London weighting too - for nurses it's +20% of salary, min £4,888 and max payment of £7,377. Outer London is slightly less.

For doctors, it's a flat £4k. A grad starting salary of £29k plus LW, and progression after 3 years to £40k doesn't sound too bad, tbh. https://www.ucl.ac.uk/human-resources/policies-advice/clinical-staff/clinical-staff-salary-scales/junior-doctors-pay-scale

Why don't you ask @Juniordoc to share a current payslip, three years post-grad, for comparison, and share that too? Is it because progressing to about £40k after 3 years might look a tad well-paid?

Apologies if this has already been posted, but there's 26 pages of the thread now.

Carlos Tevez (Manchester City) payslip for the month of March 2010.

There's something not right with society.

Is it really that attractive to you?

When considering the progression and opportunities for doctors?

This is a rather interesting read. It shows, in real time, pay progression, additional allowances and enhancements, training premiums. It obviously leaves off the value of the NHS pension contribution, but as it is counted as part of most employees' total remuneration package, that's a bit remiss.
https://www.bma.org.uk/media/5504/bma-junior-doctors-contracts-pay-tables-apr-2022-2023.pdf

Yes go for it, feel free!

Being a police officer is an incredibly difficult and dangerous job, working with the most awful people in society at considerable physical and mental risk. Also working really unsociable hours, like junior doctors, so I am glad that they are also well paid for training. That is obviously the amount that is needed to attract people to train.

You’ ve also got to look at the progression when you are comparing salaries.

There is great competition for every place to study medicine, so it’s clear that there are still people who realise that the possibility of starting out of uni on up to 39k and rising up to 100k+ after 6-8 years is an excellent salary prospect. Police inspectors in London earn 56k, for comparison.

I support you. Thank you for the work you do.

My cleaner earns £18 an hour. If she worked 60 hours a week - like an F1 doctor - she'd earn £56,000. About double what the OP does. On what planet is that reasonable?

Your cleaner earns that because she works privately in people’s houses, and that 18 gbp is covering the time she takes travelling to and from different houses throughout the day, running her own car and petrol, paying for her own insurance and invoicing and business accounting etc etc, possibly her own equipment and supplies too. She could never earn for 60 hours straight in a week. That would be a commercial cleaning job, such as an nhs cleaner, who are paid about 20k pa. As PP said, some of you are completely out of touch with reality.

fully support striking- you undertake complex work FGS!

@user4567890754 not to mention covering a pension, fully paid sick leave, a career structure with advancing pay and 6-7 weeks paid holiday.

I support junior drs but some of these hourly wage comparisons are extremely redactive and incomparable.

If it's ok for MPs to have had a 30% pay rise in the last 10 years, then I don't see how a request for pay restoration by junior doctors is unreasonable. Steve Barclay should start negotiations to meet the junior doctors somewhere in the middle but where is he? No point some posters on here directing their anger at the doctors for the government's failure to address pay issues of NHS doctors and other healthcare staff. They have kept treating us, our families and friends as best as they can while their numbers dwindle due to the cost of living crisis impacting them in ways not felt before. Let's support them 100% in their demands for pay restoration so that we have a safer, happier, well rested workforce treating us when we turn up needing their care. No need to question their payslips. You haven't been in their shoes doing their jobs daily so any comparisons are unfair.

Is the 9.3% pension contribution a defined contribution scheme. Or is your pension based on final salary in which case I think it would be more fair to look at the pay package for doctors rather than just "pay".

Neither. It’s career average. Quite how it will have been further downgraded by the time the OP retires is anyone’s guess.

Absolutely. I couldn’t agree more @OneMorePiece.

@pingugopoo

I am another junior doctor. Not fully qualified?!!!

F1 doctors are provisionally registered but if you’re on a hospital ward at 4am and have a heart attack it will be the F1 who is called by the nurses to see you. If you’re relative is dying there’s a good chance it’ll be the F1 who calls you to tell you on a weekend.

And in fact an F2 is fully registered with the GMC.

I will be a doctor in training into my 40s. I’m about to become a registrar. We are literally holding the crumbling nhs together, we are a massive proportion of the medical workforce. Telling us we’re in “training” as we assist in surgery (or perform independent surgery), run cardiac arrests and tell people they are dying is very unfair.

It doesn’t matter what the public think at this point. The fact is that we are haemorrhaging doctors to Australia/NZ/big pharma because the nhs is trying to pay us 26% less than in 2008 (in real terms). We are incredibly hard working and dedicated but we are not martyrs. We do a job that most people couldn’t and if you want a consultant to care for you in 10 years time then we need to be paid fairly.

I am paid less than a trainee nurse practitioner (very skilled but supernumary and in uni 2 days per week) and I am a registrar in August and have done my membership exams (cost me £4k of my own money).

If the govt don’t think we’re worth paying fairly we will leave.

I have to say I'm not convinced by the pension stuff. I pay 13.7% (I think?) into an NHS pension.

I'm on a high band but work part time so earn an amount that should pay 9.3%. It's not defined contribution so that money is not mine being saved into a pot for me, it's paying the pensions of those currently retired.

I actually don't have a lot of faith that when I come to retire in 30+ years time I'll see any of it, and I've started to look at a separate private pension just in case.

I fully support them on the question of conditions, work life balance, burnout etc. These are massive issues that must be rectified with more investment in the NHS.

But OP didn’t post about that. She posted her payslip and invited us to be horrified at a graduate starting salary of 34k. Mumsnet has a large proportion of users who, like OP, will be headed towards or already inside the top 5-3 percent of earners in the UK (about 80k pa).

The other 95 percent of the population might see it a bit differently.

@user4567890754 very few doctors rise up the ranks as fast as the bbc says. The govt have created a shortage of registrars and consultants as they cap the number of “training numbers” that you need to enter a training programme. Countless friends stuck applying year after year for registrar training, working the medical equivalent of a dead end job with rubbish conditions and no progression.

Consultant jobs are not guaranteed and I cannot begin to describe the unpaid labour that goes into doing extra projects, getting publications paying to attend conferences etc to get a shot at it.

I’m 30. Not expecting to become a consultant before I’m 40.

What people also forget is that a junior doctors contract is usually between 44-48 hours weekly for our contracted hours. This does not include over time on the wards. It does not include late night studying sessions for compulsory exams we’ve paid for out of our own pocket.

If our conditions and progression are so juicy then why does the latest research show that 40% of us are actively looking to leave?

@user4567890754 the other 95% might see it differently yes.

But I cannot think of another job with so much responsibility that is paid so little.

I’ve worked minimum wage, it was proper hard graft in hospitality. But I didn’t have >£100k student debt, I wasn’t at a cardiac arrest at 2am, I wasn’t telling anyone their loved one had died, I wasn’t studying for incredibly rigorous professional exams and I did not work nearly as many hours as I do as a doctor. The work was nowhere near as technically difficult or skilled.

I risk being prosecuted for manslaughter if I make a mistake (google Bawa Garba case).

If you want excellence (and I do want a consultant caring for me to be good enough to do their difficult job) then you must pay us at the market rate. We don’t want a pay rise. We want to be paid what we were in 2008. All of the public sector have had a real terms pay cut but doctors in particular have had the biggest! Yes we are well paid but no one would do a job that is this hard if not well rewarded financially.

There are doctors being paid less than physician associates who cannot prescribe or even order an XR!

Ultimately does it matter if you think we are poorly paid? Just because some people on here think we are well paid does not change our staffing crisis and loss of doctors.

If our pay doesn’t improve we will continue to leave and the public will suffer. I am terrified for the nhs, the staff ARE the nhs. And doctors (and my nursing colleagues) are on the brink.

I don't think you can speak for 95% of the population so please don't. Don't we want the best, most empathetic individuals treating us? I certainly would. Then we have to pay accordingly or they will leave for countries that value them if they keep being demonised like they are by some on here. After training them here, it would be foolish to lose them.

But when choosing to study to be a doctor; you knew you’d be informing family of death, you knew you’d be attending cardiac arrests, you knew you’d have exams and long hours.
You chose that career knowing those things. Getting a 35% payrise won’t stop patients dying. It won’t stop the long hours. It won’t stop the exams. It won’t stop grieving relatives.
You want a payrise and that’s fine to want, so do many. But you wanted this job. You chose this job.

MP salaries rose 30% over last 10 years...