People blaming their upbringing on poor life choices

[Train007]

I have friends from many backgrounds and a few of us met up today.
Normal problems with adult children and the difference between generations.
what I cannot understand is why young people nowadays think that their problems are caused by their parents!!
Absolutely no parents have made mistakes and I just find it all a big yawn that kids spend their time justifying their own adult mistakes on their parents! …luckily I have not been pounced on by my own children….yet !!

I feel the difference lies in what a person does after identifying the influence and impact of a difficult childhood/attachments.

I think failure to grieve can keep a person stuck in blame and it is ultimately disempowering.

The power lies in owning and grieving it snd realising it is only you who can do something about your life now and then doing it, however imperfectly.

Would love to see that article, was it quality research or some academic wanting to make a name for themselves?
if true how does this explain that a third of our prison population (surely the epitome of poor choices) consists of people who have been in care at some.point as children. Whereas only around 3% if the whole population has?
Many studies showing links between childhood trauma and high rates of substance abuse, homelessness, living in abusive relationships have been made. I spent 10 years working with people experiencing homelessness. Many had come from abusive backgrounds, chaotic home lives etc.

Same.
One disinterested that didn't want any responsibility, and one with a penchant for smack addicts.
I'm a little bitter.

There comes a time when you have to take responsibility for your own life.
I had a pretty usual basic upbringing no abuse, just two people doing their best. That’s makes me very lucky.
But if we are blaming parents how far back do we go?
Not parent’s fault? Must be grandparents? Or great grandparents?
I don’t know the answer like I said I’m very lucky, but we do need to take responsibility. Abuse excepted.

I've linked that interview upthread. You can watch it and assess the value for yourself.

I think - and I'm not making any bold claims that I have this right - that the working assumptions might suggest that parents who are driven by a genetic hand that results in the kind of chaotic homes so dangerous that children must be saved from them - also lumber their children with a genetic hand that pre-disposes them to criminality?

But he doesn't say that this means that there are any 100% certainties - that anyone is entirely elevated or doomed by their genetic hand - just that genes play an important role in behaviour and that nature and nurture determiners are easily mistaken.

I hate the saying ‘check your privilege’ but it has its uses

If you think it's the genes, you can find peace by accepting that you are born this way. If you think it was your upbringing you can find peace by accepting that your parents did the best they could/ they were under the influence of ...... and didn't know what they were doing and never meant to hurt you/ had MH issues and couldn't help it.

It will be interesting to see what things that are common parenting practices now will be blamed in the future.

I think the tendency to lawnmower parent and sort out all your children's problems will be blamed my many for them making bad decisions in life because they never got any practise.

We haven't had the supernanny cohort of kids come through yet to blame the calm down corner for their emotional distance and the endless charts for their reward based motivational strategies.

Then we are due a cohort of kids who endured the trauma of gentle parenting and being frogmarched into endless introspection. They go into spasm whenever anyone says, "Tell me why you did that?" and get an eye twitch with the words, "natural consequence".

God knows what after that, I'm out of the loop.

I think your title is the wrong way around: you meant blaming life choices on upbringing?

Clearly it is a complex issue. Nature and nurture, plus free will.

Obviously some parents are horrific, abusive and neglectful. The impact of this on a child is lifelong.

That said, they still do have a choice. Many of the very best parents are the ones who had the very worst childhoods, because they were determined to be the complete opposite of their parents.

Likewise many with lazy, feckless parents who can't be bothered to work become very successful financially because they determine from a young age to study and work extremely hard for a different life.

However, many do not, and repeat their parents' patterns. It's certainly far easier to become financially successful or be a good parent if you have grown up with those things and have a model to follow, rather than just a determination of what not to be.

Genetics play a large role. Some people are "dandelions" and can thrive anywhere. Others are "orchids" so will outperform the dandelions given the same positive environment and nurture, but be far more susceptible to collapse into mental health difficulties etc than a dandelion in the same negative environment. There is always choice, but the choices are much harder for some than for others. If you add in autism or ADHD, that compounds this effect: to excel or completely collapse depending on environment. Epigenetics is also very interesting.

So no, nobody can entirely blame their circumstances on their upbringing. Their upbringing, combined with other factors like genetics, can make things much, much harder for them though, to achieve stability and a decent life.

It is not possible to completely unpick the relative influence of the various factors on a specific individual. Therefore it makes more sense to focus on putting the right social, educational and healthcare supports in place to reduce the impacts of negative environments before they do so much damage.

This. Such an ignorant post OP.

This is dubious. Genetic research suggests otherwise, at least for the proportion of the population who are "orchids" not "dandelions", for whom nurture has a disproportionate impact. This is an old article but explains it very well (mostly in relation to genes that entail a predisposition to depression - which obviously have a potential upside as well otherwise they would not be so prevalent in the population - but it also applies to genes predisposing people to other larger downsides AND upsides than others in the population without those genes. More vilatility of outcome in either direction basically, than average, depending on nurture. So for these people nurture is a much more important factor in outcome). It's an old article but explain it very well and subsequent research has backed up its conclusions.

www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2009/12/the-science-of-success/307761/

100%.

Parenting is a monumentally bigger responsibility than a lot people realise; it is incredibly easy to imprint our own trauma on young children and be completely oblivious to doing it.

I think I know what you mean. Social media is full of 'self-help' type stuff that encourages viewers to blame every single bad feeling or mistake they have made on their parents. It's a way of people avoiding responsibility for themselves.

Yes, there are people with genuinely awful upbringings. My mother, for example. I am not excusing abuse.

But some of this stuff online would have people believing they are damaged for life because their parents once or twice gave them a smacked bottom, or they were one of four kids and sometimes had to wait their turn.

I sometimes wonder how these adult kids will feel when they become parents themselves and realise that no parent is a saint.

I mean @Luckydip1 you're not entirely wrong in that the genes are in fact a major influence, as you say. What I mean is that the issue is complicated by the fact that certain genes - as well as bringing higher intelligence etc - also mean the individual is impacted by nurture in a disproportionately large way, so there is an interaction between genes and the impact of nurture or lack of it. Certain individuals will outperform their peers by miles with positive nurture, but be far more likely than their peers to become mentally ill etc with negative nurture.

Parenting is a huge responsibility for anyone. Not taken seriously enough by many. And if your children are "orchid" children, the effect you have on them will be ever greater.

So your generation made no mistakes but the next generation did?

And you know 100% what your friends did as parents?

Unlikely? I think so.

Also people have always done this. It’s nothing new.

I am not excusing abuse.

But some of this stuff online would have people believing they are damaged for life because their parents once or twice gave them a smacked bottom

Hitting a child IS abuse.

This is inline with the fashionable ‘power and oppression’ extreme left view that is becoming so rife in western culture.

the issue is much larger and is the mindset behind radical feminism, racism, trans activism. Etc etc.

did you not see the Harry and Meghan South Park?

”Kyle: outdoorsy, confident, kind to animals, victim”. And so on. His ‘brand’ always ended in ‘victim’.

we have bred this into our kids over a couple of generations and now we are at the point where any hierarchy is to blame for our shortcomings. This is even true of the family unit. The oppressive nature of the patriarchy is at the centre of everything. Absolutely no personal responsibility required.

critical social justice. Look it up. The communist mindset.

I don't have a subscription but here is part of the article www.newscientist.com/article/mg24232310-800-the-parenting-myth-how-kids-are-raised-matters-less-than-you-think/

Also this:

I wish my parents had been able to understand how their upbringings had impacted them.

that @musingsinmidlife said is so important: to do the work on yourself before becoming a parent; to recognise how your (obviously imperfect because no parenting is ever perfect or can be) childhood impacted you; to address those issues so you do not compound or pass them on. This is why it is so unhelpful when defensive people of older generations who do not like the increased understanding and focus on mental health now, make comments slating "introspection", or accuse people being reflective of "navel gazing", or people being sensitive to individual children's needs as "indulging" them. No. Different children will need different parenting. Many parents may find it harder to give one of their children the parenting they need than another. Understanding their needs, our own, and how our own upbringing affected our own development is essential to this. Why would we not want this to improve? To squash self-reflection, healing and learning and reduce unintentional consequences of trauma passed on to future generations, to avoid hurting older people's feelings because they feel that their parenting should be beyond any criticism? How ridiculous and selfish. Nobody is perfect. Of course every generation of children will criticise their upbringing when they reflect on it because of course people can't get everything right. Reflecting on this is healthy and part of learning and improving things for the children and grandchildren. To try to shut it down seems to stem from some bizarre idea that somehow people should never, ever apologise or acknowledge they got some things wrong. So must believe they are what, some kind of superhero? 🤣 It seems like a huge ego-driven and selfish nonsense to me.

I fully expect my children to think I got many things wrong and will be prepared to acknowledge this and discuss it, and apologise. And then hope they can do better than me for their children as a result of this reflection, and so on.

Thanks, will take a look!

Very interesting topic, OP.

My DS1 is convinced his life would have been so much better if he had not had 3 siblings. I have told him maybe one day he will appreciate having 3 younger siblings even though we probably could have given him more materially had we not ! I think he just sees friends who are only kids getting everything thrown at them- house deposits etc.

Oh my God.

This is exactly the type of badly informed nonsense I was referring to. No understanding of the impact of genetics or their variable interaction with nurture, no interest in looking at sociology and psychology and the impacts across cultures and time, no grasp of the data. Just spouting nonsense about "victim" mentality and no interest in the science or outcomes at all. Why even comment if you've no real interest in the research on the topic?

He isn't wrong though is he, I'm the eldest of 5 and agree with your DS1.