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Thread 22. Sunak: Taxes, Truth and Tories

983 replies

pointythings · 23/03/2023 17:43

The previous thread filled up fast, so here's another one with a reasonably topical title!

OP posts:
Thread gallery
32
jgw1 · 20/04/2023 08:08

itsgettingweird · 20/04/2023 07:26

Ah yes.

Limited and specific.

And

Where reasonably possible.

I forgot that's the rules we ran our country under now 🙄

The government of the country is certainly limited at the moment.

Notonthestairs · 20/04/2023 08:10

Odd lead story in The Times. Braverman tabling amendment to Rwanda bill to block asylum seekers from relying on an interim injunctions to suspend deportation i.e ignore the law. These "concessions" have been included to stop a Tory rebellion in Parliament.
Reading on it becomes clear that any rebellion would have been small and highly unlikely to have stopped the initial bill.
So essentially pandering to a small segment of the party.

"However, The Times understands that Simon Hart, the government chief whip, had argued against offering concessions. According to one government insider, he said ministers should defy the rebels to table their amendments as there was no risk of being defeated, after estimating that fewer than two dozen Tories would hold out.

One MP who discussed the strategy with Hart warned that the compromises risked the bill being defeated in the House of Lords. The MP added: “They want this bill hardened up so they risk losing the entire bill.”

So we will be left with a bill which is illegal and will be amended again in the Lords.
So why do it? Braverman gets her headline and by the time it gets to the Lords it wont be reported on in the same way.
A waste of Parliamentary time and a cynical ploy to grab some attention.
Again.
When are they actually going to do their jobs and spend less time trying to hold on to them?

DuncinToffee · 20/04/2023 08:36

It's all about the headlines and appeasing the racists but don't put the prison barge in their backyard

DuncinToffee · 20/04/2023 08:57

Headlines say that the government caved in to rightwing backbenchers.

Not sure about that, we all know about Braverman's dream.

Will any conservative come out and condemn the plans?

Notonthestairs · 20/04/2023 09:10

Yes they know it won't work and will be stripped out.
It's similar to the "Rwanda flights before the summer" gibberish.
It's a dumb bit of theatre to appease Braverman's far right supporters and scrape back a few votes from Tice/Refirm.

Notonthestairs · 20/04/2023 09:13

And if Prentice had given positive advice regarding the amendment they'd have been shouting it from the rooftops. Another AG willing to ditch her commitment to the law to keep her job.

jgw1 · 20/04/2023 09:28

Notonthestairs · 20/04/2023 08:10

Odd lead story in The Times. Braverman tabling amendment to Rwanda bill to block asylum seekers from relying on an interim injunctions to suspend deportation i.e ignore the law. These "concessions" have been included to stop a Tory rebellion in Parliament.
Reading on it becomes clear that any rebellion would have been small and highly unlikely to have stopped the initial bill.
So essentially pandering to a small segment of the party.

"However, The Times understands that Simon Hart, the government chief whip, had argued against offering concessions. According to one government insider, he said ministers should defy the rebels to table their amendments as there was no risk of being defeated, after estimating that fewer than two dozen Tories would hold out.

One MP who discussed the strategy with Hart warned that the compromises risked the bill being defeated in the House of Lords. The MP added: “They want this bill hardened up so they risk losing the entire bill.”

So we will be left with a bill which is illegal and will be amended again in the Lords.
So why do it? Braverman gets her headline and by the time it gets to the Lords it wont be reported on in the same way.
A waste of Parliamentary time and a cynical ploy to grab some attention.
Again.
When are they actually going to do their jobs and spend less time trying to hold on to them?

I'm confused. Is this some kind of strange attempt to create an argument with the House of Lords?
But surely that would play into Labour's hands as they have already come out and stated their policy on House of Lords?

DuncinToffee · 20/04/2023 09:37

Secondary headteachers (ASCL) and the senior civil service (FDA) are both balloting for strike action for the first time in decades. Hospital consultants may join them (not decided yet).

We've never had a rebellion from the professional elite of the public sector like this.

https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1648966670637998080?t=Gtef3pdfG4sFfbWcZ5QDtQ&s=19

DuncinToffee · 20/04/2023 10:13

All perfectly normal

https://twitter.com/TLDRNewsUK/status/1648976065858076674?s=20

NEW: Suella Braverman says she considered posing as a radio phone-in caller to defend herself from racism accusations.

In a Spectator column Braverman said "Last week a radio show had a phone-in asking listeners to debate whether I’m a racist. I thought about calling in as Margaret from Fareham, to suggest the Home Secretary take courage from another Margaret’s words"

Notonthestairs · 20/04/2023 10:29

"I'm confused. Is this some kind of strange attempt to create an argument with the House of Lords?
But surely that would play into Labour's hands as they have already come out and stated their policy on House of Lords?"

It might play in to Labour's hands but it reinforces (to me at least) that they sometimes they can do a valuable job. Debates in the Lords rartely get as much attention as HoC so it will vanish much more quietly than 24 Tory MPs going rogue.
It means Sunak can give Braverman a free hand and lots of lovely pre election publicity in the knowledge that the Lords are doing the job that the HoC should do. IMO anyway.

Notonthestairs · 20/04/2023 10:30

DuncinToffee · 20/04/2023 10:13

All perfectly normal

https://twitter.com/TLDRNewsUK/status/1648976065858076674?s=20

NEW: Suella Braverman says she considered posing as a radio phone-in caller to defend herself from racism accusations.

In a Spectator column Braverman said "Last week a radio show had a phone-in asking listeners to debate whether I’m a racist. I thought about calling in as Margaret from Fareham, to suggest the Home Secretary take courage from another Margaret’s words"

What???

Notonthestairs · 20/04/2023 10:31

Does she have a regular column in the Spectator? Or was this confected to give her more airtime? Good grief.

TokyoSushi · 20/04/2023 10:47

Raab decision in the next hour according to Times Radio.

DuncinToffee · 20/04/2023 11:07

Expectation in Downing Street is PM will get it around 11:30am - so when we see the findings and response depends on how long he takes to make a decision.

Shall we take bets?

I say 24 hours

AdamRyan · 20/04/2023 11:17

DuncinToffee · 20/04/2023 10:13

All perfectly normal

https://twitter.com/TLDRNewsUK/status/1648976065858076674?s=20

NEW: Suella Braverman says she considered posing as a radio phone-in caller to defend herself from racism accusations.

In a Spectator column Braverman said "Last week a radio show had a phone-in asking listeners to debate whether I’m a racist. I thought about calling in as Margaret from Fareham, to suggest the Home Secretary take courage from another Margaret’s words"

Radio 5 - Nick Campbell, I love him

Didn't hear this one but generally there is plenty of rabid right wing support so I'm sure Braverman was fine

https://twitter.com/bbc5live/status/1582994838064095233

https://twitter.com/bbc5live/status/1582994838064095233

AdamRyan · 20/04/2023 11:19

Oops, I'm embarassed now - that was an old one Blush

RafaistheKingofClay · 20/04/2023 11:30

DuncinToffee · 20/04/2023 11:07

Expectation in Downing Street is PM will get it around 11:30am - so when we see the findings and response depends on how long he takes to make a decision.

Shall we take bets?

I say 24 hours

Sunday.

That gives us a couple of days of insisting he’s definitely not being sacked before sacking him.

Zonder · 20/04/2023 11:31

DuncinToffee · 20/04/2023 11:07

Expectation in Downing Street is PM will get it around 11:30am - so when we see the findings and response depends on how long he takes to make a decision.

Shall we take bets?

I say 24 hours

He should be ready to give a response by noon. He will already know exactly what is in it and I bet he has already got a plan for how to respond.

DuncinToffee · 20/04/2023 11:44

He had nearly 150 days to think about it

Notonthestairs · 20/04/2023 11:47

Yes I think he's know the contents of the report for a very long time. Maybe not the precise wording but the overall picture.
Lets face it, he knew all of this before he appointed Raab.

DuncinToffee · 20/04/2023 11:54

He had both Raab and Braverman sitting next to him at PMQs

jgw1 · 20/04/2023 12:34

RafaistheKingofClay · 20/04/2023 11:30

Sunday.

That gives us a couple of days of insisting he’s definitely not being sacked before sacking him.

Honesty, integrity, accountability.

TokyoSushi · 20/04/2023 14:09

I think that Raab will be 'allowed to resign' today.

jgw1 · 20/04/2023 14:30

TokyoSushi · 20/04/2023 14:09

I think that Raab will be 'allowed to resign' today.

Whilst apologising for being a distraction to the government, years of loyal service, dedicated public servant. Oh and I'm terribly sorry if my behaviour has upset anyone its just I have high standards and certainly not that I am a thug

AdamRyan · 20/04/2023 14:51

Boris already set precedence over dealing with "bullying" with priti Patel

Can't believe this is taking Sunak so long when surely he'd figured out his options in advance