Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Chat

Join the discussion and chat with other Mumsnetters about everyday life, relationships and parenting.

Original poster

Tenants making viewings difficult

470 replies

areweonabreak · 03/03/2023 14:23

We have a flat that we rent out. It was my DH’s flat before we met. It’s been rented out for 10 years now (by only 2 tenants) but we’re now in a position where our own house needs a lot of money spending on it and we want to free up some capital.

we do feel bad for the current tenant, we offered them first refusal to buy the flat (it’s on the market for £90k) but they cannot afford it (even though a mortgage would probably be cheaper than the rent but they’d another thread)

we’ve had a few viewings now but all the feedback is that the tenants have told them that they don’t want to move so they’re put off as they don’t want the hassle.

we live about a 40 minute drive away from the flat so the agents are sorting out all of the viewings. The agents have suggested that it might be easier to sell if it’s empty.

We’re really not sure what to do, they’re on a rolling monthly contract at the moment.

has anyone else been in this position before?

would anyone else recommend selling as a vacant property?

OP posts:
Sugarplumfairy65 · 03/03/2023 16:33

SnackyOnassis · 03/03/2023 15:12

It's odd that they're in the house while viewings are taking place, when we've been tenants in this situation in the past we've always popped out for an hour as it's so awkward otherwise. Is that something your agent might be able to request of them?

Absolutely fucking not! I was selling a house once and allowed the agent to do viewings while I was on holiday. I got home to items missing and all the drawers and wardrobes had been rifled through. Even my new GHD's were gone from the bathroom cupboard.

5oclockclub · 03/03/2023 16:35

You want the best of both worlds, your tenant paying your mortgage, whilst making it easy for you to sell their home from under them.

EyesOnThePies · 03/03/2023 16:36

I have bought 5 times now, and would never make an offer on a property which had tenants in. I once considered it because it was clear that the tenants were in the middle of packing, and the EA told me that they had exchanged on their first flat - happily confirmed by the tenants when I viewed.

As a buyer it has always seemed greedy to me when a landlord wants to take rent until the last possible minute - and expects me to take the risk of making an offer and paying for surveys etc on a property where eviction might take months.

Give your tenants notice and sell vacant. I hope it all goes smoothly.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

Property Property legal advice
LumpyandBumps · 03/03/2023 16:37

I am a landlord and I think it is unfair to say the tenants are making viewings difficult. They could make things a lot more difficult by refusing access.

I don’t know your reasons for trying to market the property whilst they are still there, but in my opinion it is a fairly perilous way to do things.

You might be wishing to give them the maximum possible time to look for somewhere, or have someone look after your property and give you an income for the longest possible time, but in either case at some point you need to give the tenants formal notice, so that they have a date to work towards.

In their situation they must be hoping that the property doesn’t sell so they can remain there. They are in a sort of limbo, and that is not a pleasant position to be in.

I have seen posts from letting agents saying they only issue a notice to quit once an offer has been made. I totally disagree with this.
I assume your property is in the first time buyer bracket. Many will be put off by the tenants being there, either because of concern that they won’t vacate, or because they don’t want to force them out of their home.
As a landlord I don’t even consider properties sold subject to tenancies. I am sure some would be fine, but it’s a risk I don’t need.

The correct process in my opinion is to serve notice. Hopefully they will be able to move out without the matter going to court. It’s in your interests to do all you can to facilitate them moving. Don’t be picky with the deposit, and even consider things like making up any shortfall between it and the deposit charged on the new property.

Once they have moved out the property can be marketed properly.

x2boys · 03/03/2023 16:37

5oclockclub · 03/03/2023 16:35

You want the best of both worlds, your tenant paying your mortgage, whilst making it easy for you to sell their home from under them.

The tenant is paying rent for a place to live ,the Op is entitled to sell.the flat ,mumsnet is ridiculous about private landlords.

BlueHeelers · 03/03/2023 16:37

We aren’t some slum landlord who doesn’t give a shit, we’re a family who just happened to be in a position where we both had properties when we met.

But this is Mumsnet, where landlords eat tenants' babies.

On the other hand you are probably going to have to serve your tenant notice.

5oclockclub · 03/03/2023 16:38

x2boys · 03/03/2023 16:37

The tenant is paying rent for a place to live ,the Op is entitled to sell.the flat ,mumsnet is ridiculous about private landlords.

Show quote history

She is entitled to sell up, but she's complaining that the tenants aren't making it easy for her. Poor love. Serve them notice to go and then sell, problem solved.

Sugarplumfairy65 · 03/03/2023 16:39

areweonabreak · 03/03/2023 16:12

They’re on a rolling monthly contract, so each of us would have to give 2 months

Show quote history

The tenant only has to give one month

BashirWithTheGoodBeard · 03/03/2023 16:39

Many will be put off by the tenants being there, either because of concern that they won’t vacate, or because they don’t want to force them out of their home.

Exactly. This is why the criticism of the tenants for having given an honest account of the situation to people viewing is so stupid.

ShirleyPhallus · 03/03/2023 16:42

Mumsnet is absolutely nuts about private rentals. People always talk about renters being given notice as though it’s a huge surprise to them and not something that they’ve signed a legal contract for. Y’know, they give the landlord money, the landlord gives them somewhere to live, either party can end the agreement after a fixed term.

these renters do not have to give the EAs access but to do so then make comments is really petty. The other side is that the EA might be acting out of turn by giving them tiny amounts of notice / pressuring them - you’re sure that’s not the case OP?

evicting then sounds like the right step. Practically gifting them the flat definitely isn’t!

titchy · 03/03/2023 16:43

Why would you try and sell with them in situ in the first place? No buyer wants to spend on legal fees and not be guaranteed vacant possession within a reasonable timeframe so no one would have made you an offer anyway, unless you're aiming at landlords.

Thesharkradar · 03/03/2023 16:44

I think sell to another landlord!

Floomobal · 03/03/2023 16:45

I agree about giving notice. I suspect they will be difficult about moving out though… so best to get the ball rolling now, as it could take a while.

BashirWithTheGoodBeard · 03/03/2023 16:47

These renters do not have to give the EAs access but to do so then make comments is really petty.

You don't even know the context. If there've been multiple instances of this, bearing in mind a good number of potential buyers will have concerns at tenants being in situ, odds are at least some of them have asked. What would you have the tenants say if and when they're asked a direct question to suss out whether they're likely to go without a fuss? Lie? Refuse to answer?

ShirleyPhallus · 03/03/2023 16:49

BashirWithTheGoodBeard · 03/03/2023 16:47

These renters do not have to give the EAs access but to do so then make comments is really petty.

You don't even know the context. If there've been multiple instances of this, bearing in mind a good number of potential buyers will have concerns at tenants being in situ, odds are at least some of them have asked. What would you have the tenants say if and when they're asked a direct question to suss out whether they're likely to go without a fuss? Lie? Refuse to answer?

But you don’t know the context either

Basically anyone could make up any scenario to paint them either way and as no one was there we just don’t know!

johnd2 · 03/03/2023 16:50

Sugarplumfairy65 · 03/03/2023 16:39

The tenant only has to give one month

Show quote history

Agree,I came on to write that. And the month/two months start from the day before the rent is next due.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 03/03/2023 16:51

Mumsnet is absolutely nuts about private rentals

Very true, ShirleyPhallus, and the usual all-landlords-are-evil contingent haven't even showed up yet

So in many ways you'd do better on LandlordZone, @areweonabreak; the advice to sell once the house is empty will probably be the same, but the approach will be a lot more rational

BashirWithTheGoodBeard · 03/03/2023 16:52

ShirleyPhallus · 03/03/2023 16:49

But you don’t know the context either

Basically anyone could make up any scenario to paint them either way and as no one was there we just don’t know!

Show quote history

Yes, but only one of us is making a judgement on the tenants behaviour. If you agree we just don't know, that means you have zero idea whether they were being petty or not.

BigSkies2022 · 03/03/2023 16:53

Hi OP, yes, I agree that you should sell an empty property, that you've had an opportunity to clean thoroughly and redecorate if need be, rather than a tenanted one.

However, I was in your position 20 years ago - living in a house with a mortgage, in possession of a tenanted flat which was mine by virtue of my husband's death. My initial thought was, sell the flat to put into the house. But I didn't sell, and I'm very glad I didn't. I've put plenty of money into the flat over the years, but it's also earned me a lot of money, stabilised my income through various changes, will double my pension income and is an asset for my son to take over in his turn. In the end, I sold the house, paying no capital gains on it, as it was my residence, and bought a better house with my second husband.

So..as a PP has suggested, is this the best way to finance what you want to do? Might hanging on to the rental flat and raising money another way work better for you long term?

Puzzledandpissedoff · 03/03/2023 16:54

Basically anyone could make up any scenario to paint them either way and as no one was there we just don’t know!

Correct again, but this being MN scanarios will be painted which are said to absolutely "prove" whatever it is

HelpINeedSomeAdvicePlease · 03/03/2023 16:54

Definitely wait to sell until they've moved out.

We viewed a house recently that was being let out and it was disgustingly dirty inside. I couldn't wait to get out. Apparently the tenants were hoping to buy it so were trying to put people off and get the owners to reduce the price as it wasn't selling!

I'm interested to know where in the country you can buy a flat for £90k.

starfishmummy · 03/03/2023 16:55

Pemba · 03/03/2023 15:17

What position is the tenant in? Are they in employment? It does seem a shame that they can't afford to buy it at all as £90,000 is really on the low side, what region is this in?

Could you, like a pp has suggested, reduce the price or do anything to help them buy? I know as a pp said, they are not your kids but I am sure you as a decent person don't want them to be homeless. And the thing is, they obviously like living there. The market is not moving much so you may find it hard to find a buyer anyway. Someone in our family has been trying to sell a first time buyer type property since October, it is still on the market despite several price drops. First time buyers are wary, or can't get mortgages. Landlords and investors have practically disappeared from the market.

So if your tenants were helped a little by you to buy this might actually be in your interests as well as helping them.

Could it be they are just unused to the concept of buying, maybe all their family and friends rent etc?

It's not just a case of affordability to buy, the tenants might not want to buy.

I've been a tenant in perfectly nice properties, bit not ones I would have considered buying.

Justforlaffs · 03/03/2023 16:55

Why don’t you try and make it work so they CAN buy it? Any chance they can get a mortgage if you drop the price low enough?

Yes why not OP? In fact, why not just give it to them for free?

Im sure that’s what MzHz would do!

FFS.

Poscapen · 03/03/2023 16:56

Op, you need to serve notice properly. Hopefully you are letting through an agent and can just instruct them to do it. Anyway, it's called a Section 21 notice. If you are unsure about anything maybe join Landlordzone to make sure you get it right.

Gilmorehill · 03/03/2023 16:56

Skinnermarink · 03/03/2023 14:27

I’ve been on the other end if this when the letting agents pushed for multiple short notice viewings when I was at home with a six week old newborn. I offered them a few times when I’d be out, but then they took the piss. I went down to the letting office and demanded the keys back, blocked their number, and emailed the owner to tell them why. No more viewings until we’d vacated.

I was in exactly the same situation. I would even bloody clean the place even though I was also trying to pack up. I wish MN had been around then as I would have known I could say no.