Antibreastfeeding?

[Redebs]

Having just browsed some of the 'Help articles' on here, I'm shocked at how Mumsnet is discouraging breastfeeding.

There's one on how normal it is to wean off the breast at two months because of all the 'problems you will have'.

There's one on 'combi feeding', which is about giving formula feeds to breastfed babies - the surest way to reduce your milk supply in reality.

There's another one about packing dummies and bottles in your hospital labour bag. This is definitely going to interfere with newborns getting colostrum and learning to latch. If a baby needs anything, the hospital will provide it in reality.

I know some women choose to formula feed, but these are insidious, supposedly helpful, undermining tactics aimed at new mothers trying to breastfeed. Most of these are sponsored by the baby bottle manufacturer MAM.

If formula companies were promoting this, they would be, rightly, in contravention of advertising rules.

All medical and scientific advice is to give exclusively breastmilk for the first six months and to continue to at least twelve months or longer.

You seem nice.

I had to push to get DS assessed for tongue tie, 5 appointments. 5. It was ridiculous, locally there was no scope to pay privately which I would have happily done. There are definitely efficiencies that wouldn't actually cost more or require more staff on balance.

But if there were less of them and they were less specialised, then they would effectively provide the sort of service that health visitors and feeding midwives already do, and that is deemed as not enough.

The benefit to the health system of breastfeeding is moderate that it’s worth putting some money into it, as they already do, but not throwing the kitchen sink at it.

The main issue is time though. There are plenty of very knowledgeable MSWs for example who if they were allocated 100% of their time to BF support would make a world of difference, but there isnt capacity for that and only a small part of their role is doing that. Same as with HVs and the like, it's not that they don't have the knowledge (debatable though), but that their role is broad and there's only finite amount of time plus there are shortages as there are across the board. A role like this would no doubt appeal to many people who perhaps wouldn't find training to be a HV and all that entails as desirable.

Lots of posters on here say they don’t feel they’re at all knowledgable, particularly health visitors (not trying to be difficult, just saying).

But again it’s the cost/benefit ratio, it simply isn’t worth it financially for the health system.

That's why a role focused on it would be beneficial. I disagree, I left midwifery last year (the same as 29 out of every 30 that train do) because its impossible to provide even a basic level of care, the benefit of having someone whose focus was breastfeeding support would make the world of difference not just to women, but also to staff who currently have to emotionally deal with saying sorry I don't have time basically to women who reach out. Its soul destroying, knowing there was somewhere to refer on would at least alleviate part of that. It wouldn't solve all problems, but rates are rock bottom and we know this isn't just down to women choosing formula (which is of course a valid choice).

Not what I said at all. You asked what a lactation consultant could have done, I explained what lactation consultants help mothers with I do not know your individual circumstances you said your baby couldn't digest your milk. One reason babies struggle to digest milk is a dairy and soya allergy (you didnt confirm the reason your baby couldnt digest your milk). Both these proteins pass through breastmilk and are known to cause poor weight gain.
The knowledge about feeding babies with severe allergies has come on a lactation consultants help many women out as it is difficult to get past GP level and get the right support for a allergy baby which includes careful guidance with a dietician.
You seem to completely rubbish them like some sort of hippy dippy breastfeeding warrior. They are far from this and extremely supportive to mothers.

Do you think a lactation curating knows more than the very many specialists we had input from. Got it.

What specialists did you see?

Specialist paediatricians - more than one (in patient and outpatients) and this has carried on to adulthood as they continue to have input

Specialist paeds hospital dietitians (in patient and out patient)

Specialist immunologists (out patient now discharged)

Specialist geneticists (outpatient appointments now discharged)

Orthopaedics (in patient and out patient). This has carried on to adulthood.

ENT input as well (in patient and outpatients - now discharged)

SLT input (outpatient appointments - now discharged)

But we needed a lactation consultant. As I said. I get it. I didn't do enough. I didn't try hard enough to BF. I should've tried harder.

The specialists didn't do enough. What we needed was a lactation consultant. I get it. I understand. I was a shit mother who didn't try hard enough and I let my child down. Because I didn't BF them. I fucking get it.

I think it's fair to say that visible formula advertising normalises formula feeding.

Don't know if it's just me but I didn't realise that follow on milk was something different to the formula you give from birth. I didn't have any experience with babies before having mine.

My perception before being pregnant was that you were supposed to "move on" to formula and bottles at some point and the majority did unless you were "a bit wacky" and wanted to breastfeed long term. The breastfeeding push from the NHS came as a shock to be honest.

What is an MSW?

Im sorry you had to leave midwifery, and thank you for sharing your experience - that sounds horrible and so frustrating.

On lactation consultants - my son was born overseas. I had a lactation consultant who came every day from day one to day four (C section) to check I was trying to breast feed. She was a total bitch who did nothing to help, just kept telling me to try harder and that feeding my son formula was like feeding him fast food. It was awful. It was incredibly painful for me and she made it so, so much worse. So much for specialised care improving things.

I saw a different private consultant a few weeks later and she did help but the damage of this awful woman and of every other healthcare professional I encountered telling me I ‘had to at least try’ - as if I wasn’t! - had already done the psychological damage. Talking about breast feeding was so triggering for a good year afterwards.

I pumped for 4-5 hours every day, so guilty I felt - had been made to feel. So much time I could have spent with my son, cuddling and holding and playing with and stimulating and loving him. When I stopped at 3 months I still felt guilty but my goodness it was a relief.

It was like a cheese grater on my nipples. And the constant refrain of ‘breast is best’ made me feel constantly incredibly guilty. NOT ‘best for the mother’ at all.

I was just curious as often women get little support in regard to this from specialists, so that's good they did in your case. I've had many battles trying to get support for women that have been under my care, most of the time the only people who actually help are volunteers like lactation consultants.

Lots of mothers unfairly punish themselves and carry a burden of guilt where there needn't be any. Sounds like you did amazing and you gave your child a fantastic start in life, formula is brilliant. I know this won't help and don't want to seem like I am minimising it, the trauma from it is very real for many women.

Midwife support worker, some trusts call them midwife support assistants or similar. I agree many 'interventions' aren't helpful, and much of the support available doesn't help at all, simply telling people to try is counter productive. It would be important for any service to be there but not forced. Its tricky for us in many ways though as saying to woman who is struggling formula is a great option (which it is) quite often leads to complaints down the line of not supporting enough etc; but then of course encouraging someone to continue there's a fine line between encouraging and seeming like there's pressure.

Countries with high breastfeeding rates have female relatives passing on knowledge about breastfeeding.
We do not have that inter generational knowledge to pass on. We also have a culture where mothers disparage childrearing tips they try to pass down.

No they just tend to be poor. If there was any ‘secret breastfeeding hacks’ that worked we would all know about them by now.

That is a really good point about balance. Yes, you’re right, that would be ideal - and I can see that it is very hard to strike that balance now you put it like that.

I had a lactation helper/consultant? appear on the ward (from reading these threads, this is rare?). She was very firmly asked to leave by DH when she started criticising me for using formula.

We didn’t have any family living in the uk but my wonderful DMil used her holidays (teacher) to spend the summer with us helping get DT’s into a routine. She had breastfed DH and his sister but was totally supportive of our decision to use formula - she did most of the early night feeding.

She was perfect help for new parents - non critical and totally supportive.

No, this isn’t about ´hacks’ it’s about intergenerational knowledge about what successful breastfeeding looks like. I should know. I benefited from it. When the information I was hearing from the medical community wasn’t matching my reality, I was able to draw on the knowledge and encouragement of women from older generations in my family to interpret that reality. To be more precise, when my baby was feeding more often than his dr thought was normal for his age, I was able to discuss that with my mum and grandma and conclude that my drs data was based on formula fed babies, and that as my baby was healthy and growing well, and I was coping fine with the sleep I was getting, there was no problem. If I hadn’t had that intergenerational knowledge, I may have worried that someone was wrong and my baby wasn’t getting enough. As it was, I stopped counting the number of feeds my baby was having per 24 hours and relaxed.

Read my posts back I have never suggested any such thing nor that you didn't try hard enough. You asked about lactation consultants I simply summarised what they offer and how they can support women. There is always going to be cases where there are other elements going on.

I have stated very clearly it should be mothers choice and mothers support.
I'm sorry you had a tough time but projecting your upset onto me and swearing at me for providing a response is misplaced

That’s just regular knowledge of cluster feeding. It isn’t ‘inter generational’ it just isn’t really discussed with pregnant women intending to bf enough.

The problem is there aren't really any hacks for breastfeeding. It usually works well but it can be very time consuming and only mum can do it.

www.nhs.uk/conditions/baby/breastfeeding-and-bottle-feeding/breastfeeding/the-first-few-days/

lots of available information