Is this normal? Visits and kids' routines

[ElizabethinherGermanGarden]

I don't have kids; all my siblings do. One has two little ones (3 and 1) and I find their routines really strange. I can't tell whether this is just a young family doing what's right for their kids or quite rigid/difficult. For example, as a Christmas visit to give their kids presents, I've been invited at 9am. It is such a weird time to be invited round and - to me - it feels almost deliberately unwelcoming, as if they would rather we didn't come round or can only be bothered to squeeze us in at a time no one else wants. I was hoping they would come to us and spend a day together or at least come for a meal.

Is this just what people have to do when they have small kids? Is it normal to be restricted to small windows of time at odd hours that aren't normally visiting times? I've been quite hurt by this over the last year or so because it has very definitely felt as if they just don't see me and DP as 'proper' people who deserve to spend time with them at sociable hours

If they were older and you wanted to watch them opening presents then maybe 9am is okay. And I have got up early when sister staying also at my parents with their kid and given then a wick break to grab coffee /shower etc.

But I'd not go and visit them then, after lunch maybe or 12-2, whatever fitted in with both our days/guests. Or I'd see them Boxing Day. No harm them getting presents next day.

We have always got along pretty well but since lockdown and then the arrival of their youngest It's basically 'we can see you if you come to the play park at 9am'. If I pop round and it hasn't been arranged - I have popped round to drop off birthday presents or just to say hi because I was at the shop round the corner, for example - they stand at the door and don't invite me in. This mainly happens when they are both home. I was once invited in by my brother for a quick coffee but it was literally one time. It isn't that we don't like or care about each other and I have always got on well with SIL but I just don't understand why they are so unwelcoming to their home.

I know there's a level of anxiety going on but I always assume that this is part and parcel of parenting little ones and that the pandemic didn't help. Just don't understand why it hasn't eased up. It's really sad. It measures out our relationship in coffee spoons.

This is what I'm afraid of. I'm honestly not toxic! Or at least, I genuinely can't think of a reason why they might think that. I don't want to be difficult or make their life harder. I just want a normal family relationship.

I dont know if its nomal but i van totally understand this! I have toddlers who are nearly two. Family very often turn up to see us between 11 and 12 which doesn't work very well for us, but I've always assumed it would be seen as rude to tell them to come at a different time.

The reason its difficult is that the biys generally nap between about 12 and 2. So when somone turns up at like 11.45, either we keep them awake and they socialise an hour or so, which means they aren't at their best because they are knackered and they will often end up just wanting to sit on my lap and not interact with the new person, unless they know them really well. Or we try to crack on with the nap regardless which is difficult because they know somethings going on, plus we look really rude to disappear off just as someone walks through the door.

This thread has kind of confirmed that it would be seen as rude for me to actually say anything about the above though...

I was never one for strict routine. I suppose I did expect my lot to adapt to suit the majority and I managed naps and so forth as necessary.
I think Christmas is about the whole family not just the children.
But some mums get really stressed so they're inflexible for that sole reason and it's no reflection of their feelings for relatives. They're simply trying to protect themselves from a day from hell. And that's fair enough if they think tempers will be frayed and kids miserable otherwise.
Try not to take it personally. You may find they loosen up a bit once they're out of the trenches

I have two young kids and I would never expect someone else to have to come and see us at 9am during the Christmas holidays just to fit in with our routine!I mean, sure, it would work really well as the kids are rested and energetic in a good way rather than grumpy and tired etc, but it's not all about them. I would probably ask you to come "late morning" and in my head hope you understand that as 10 but expect you at 11....

Put it this way, I've got three kids so I've been through the whole baby/toddler thing and I wouldn't take a 9 am slot for a visit. I'd graciously decline and suggest lunch out another time.

I wouldn’t necessarily take it personally - they will likely have been up from 6am if not earlier and working around multiple nap times, leaving not a lot of time when both children are simultaneously awake.

Afternoon - evening is normally quite intensive with children that age and they will probably be tired and cranky to the point where socialising with them then might not actually be fun for

I think if you’re keen to see them, you might need to lower your expectations a bit about what they can do at this stage- a whole day in someone else’s house where the children may not nap and a sit down meal could be really hard for them. Perhaps they’ve chosen 9am because that’s the time the children are most likely to want to play with you and not melt down…but if it doesn’t work for you you could always just say so and see if there is any other time they can do?

Maybe they've picked 9am because they know it fits into their routine easily.

Later visits could mean you interrupt nap times, or the bedtime routine, meaning they're left dealing with overtired children when you leave.

Likewise maybe they don't like you dropping round unexpectedly because it hypes up the children or throws their plans out of the window.

It could be loads of innocent reasons - why automatically assume it's something bad?

I wasn’t strict with routines when I had one child, much stricter now I have two otherwise it’s chaos.
9am is a sweet spot for compliant children but it wouldn’t bother me if you turned up later although I wouldn’t be able to change meal times etc to suit a guest.
Our day usually starts at 4am so 9am is quite a civilised time

Like non-parents, every parent is different. Some are happy to go with the flow, some need a super strict routine because their kids need it or because they need it just to get through each day sane (that was me and DH!). Some parents like a loose routine, some babies and toddlers need a massively tight routine to not have tantrums at bedtime. And you don’t know what type of parent you will be, or child you will have, until it’s too late!

That said, having had the super tight routines, we never expected other people to work around us. 9am would have been super rude to us! As a consequence we practically vanished from society for 4 years 😂. Almost everyone thought we were being ridiculous, but eh. Our kids, our lives, our careers and jobs, our home. Our problems, which we solved. We’re whack to normal now, promise!

3 and 1 is pretty much the worst combo. See how it is when they’re 8 and 5, I bet it’ll be very different.

I have a 1 and 3 year old and from about 8.30am - 11.30am is the only clear gap in the day where I'm not feeding them/clearing up/putting down for a nap/preparing the next meal etc... so it does make it easier to have a conversation without having to disappear and sort them out. I personally wouldn't ever tell people they can only visit during those hours, however it does make things more difficult if we fall out of routine and they get hungry or if the 1 year old is woken up by loud conversation during her nap

I'd just go, hopefully have a nice coffee and try not to overthink it. It's probably not about you.

If the children sleep poorly then one of the adults may want to go back to bed after your visit....

Yeah, I've said I'll go then and I'll pass over presents, play with the kids and go home by 10.30. It all feels so unfestive and joyless! But that's me, not them, and doesn't matter that much. I want to have a sustainable relationship with them so that we still get to see them when they're out the other side of this bit. That's the important thing.

For me, regardless of the kids’ routine, if both me and oh were home then I’d be more flexible on times as I could always put the baby to sleep while oh talked to you and vice versa.

if I was giving you a strict time I’d be explaining why. At least that’s what I did when my kids were young and my youngest was a bad sleeper/napper.

No not normal. I know a few families who are a bit like this (ie, you've got to come for lunch at 10.30 as I need to put the baby for a nap at 12 so we're eating at 11) but they're honestly miserable people who resent their kids and there's no real need for it 😂
And yes people use it as an excuse if they don't really want to see you too (a bit like when people say "oh we've got to go home and let the dog out" when they've had enough at a party- people do it with kids too 🤣🤣)

Have they said the only time you can come is at 9, or did you ask what time and they suggested 9?

m you mentioned playing with the kids and giving presents . If the emphasis of the visits is about the kids maybe the chose 9 as the time the kids will be in the best kids for a visit?

I think they have said 9am because it is a good time before nap time. Loads of people have confirmed that this is normal and not necessarily a 'fuck off we hate you' visit slot (with a couple of worrying exceptions!) so am going to take it completely at face value and just turn up, do a short bit of aunty-ing and smile nicely.

9am is a reasonable time for a visit when you have children. That said, I would prefer 10 or 11 myself.

Very odd to insist on a 9am visit from your sibling though. My siblings are welcome in my house at any time...9am, 9pm, 12am, whenever! But I wouldn't interrupt my children's routine for them. They'd have to take us as they found us.

The only thing I can think of is... are you a difficult visitor who expects to be waited on or entertained? If you turned up at naptime/mealtimes in our house, we wouldn't be in visit mode and fetching you cups of tea. You'd be given a grumpy baby to rock to sleep or asked to bung some fish fingers in the oven. Or left to entertain the older one.

I would say it's something like this. My times are 10ish and after 3ish, I always apologise to friends about the weird times! In between feeding and naps, there isn't much time to actually socialise

No, I'm low maintenance. I probably would expect a cup of coffee but am happy to make it myself for everyone. That's about it.

It’s probably nothing personal at all. It really depends what kind of child you have-temperament/good/bad sleeper etc.
9 does seem a bit early, but if the little one naps say around 11/11.30, they may want to make the most of your time there.
It can be hard for others to understand if you have children who react badly to a change in routine etc, also it’s so stressful to have guests/visitors when the children are playing up and then might be difficult for the whole day due to over excitement/lack of sleep etc. It really can be a pain in the arse 🙈spontaneity just goes sometimes.
Likewise with the not letting you in, who knows what’s going on in the house, could be a complete mess, the kids are kicking off or it’s been a difficult morning..ah the joys of parenthood 🤣

I'm so utterly exhausted with my one year old who is a terrible sleeper that's its a case of fit in around his nap times or fuck off. I don't care if I seem like I'm being unreasonable, it's not hard for people to change their routine if they want to come over, they're adults. It is hard for children to do it.

I sort of get it, unexpected visits are not great for me, with 2 kids, and several ongoing diy projects in the house, I probably wouldn't let you in if I didn't know you were coming. On top of that the kids are sick half their lives at the moment, so that would put me off letting you in too.

9am isn't a crazy time to visit, especially if young kids need naps, when ds was 1 he would be ready for a nap by about 10.30, and he'd be a cranky baby for a good half an hour after he woke too. With kids that age, and Christmas, it's tricky to catch them at a good time where the kids are happy, fed, not coming up to nap time, and the grown ups feel up to having visitors too.

That's the absolute best way to approach, and it will be lovely if you go with this mood.
Just be aware that after kids, I can't think of any family member that got a full day long of our family time in their home, so maybe expect shorter slots too.