To think that a lot of talk about 'boundaries '

[Skelligsfeathers]

Is just shorthand for being really selfish?

I am staggered on here sometimes when I read about how little people will do for each other, how little they will put others first.
And it's always dressed up as ' having boundaries'.
Well, you know what, your boundaries won't help you when you're n the shit and YOU need some help. Just be prepared.

I think it is really . Sad

I am staggered on here sometimes when I read about how little people will do for each other, how little they will put others first.

Put your own oxygen mask on first.

I think that putting others first isn't necessarily laudible or healthy. You cannot pour from an empty cup. Self care absolutely does matter. And women are definitely socialised to be people pleasers. High time some of us said 'fuck that'.

Spent the last xx years being run ragged by people taking the piss - people who would disappear if I ever needed anything.

Ended up with mental health problems so went to see a therapist. That involved working on my boundaries...there's no way I'm giving them up now.

Not a selfish person either - just give what I can when I can. But now it's my choice.

Sometimes you have to assert your boundaries to stop people walking all over you. My boundaries are shite but people who have good boundaries will take advantage and hurt me

Users and takers, I need for my own health ( recently diagnosed Parkinson’s), others offer help, I just remember to be respectful of their time and other factors.
boundaries is about respect and self presavation

Well it all depends on where the boundaries lie doesn’t it?

If all your boundaries come down to not entertaining requests or behaviours that cause you any inconvenience or departure from your own preferences then yes, they amount to being selfish.

If your boundaries have been laid to help you protect you or others in your family from selfishness or unintended consequences of even kindly actions of others then they may not be selfish, just protective. For example if you are having debilitating cancer treatment and trying to save your little energy for your children, setting boundaries of asking everyone to send their kind enquires to a WhatsApp group that your DH will set up and update regularly and he will pass on their messages which you are really grateful for, - that’s a reasonable boundary. Rather than struggling to respond individually to the well-intentioned avalanche of incoming texts, emails, WhatsApps and Facebook messages and having your Auntie Julie tip up at the house all emotional because she’s been so worried because you haven’t replied to her messages since yesterday and she thought something terrible had happened…

If you have a new baby and some family have taken to dropping in without warning at any time and staying hours; setting a boundary asking people to check before coming over and being able to say “Sorry dad, we’re not up to a visit today, she is cluster feeding and we’re all shattered” - that’s a reasonable boundary.

Many good insights here.
I find it helpful to think of boundaries as what is & isn't OK for me personally. Somethings are fixed (it's not OK for a partner to be unfaithful), some are more fluid (if I can help a friend with something). This means my boundaries may align with you in some areas but not others - everybody's boundaries are different.

Of course you have boundaries Op.

There will be thousands of examples in which someone will ask you for help and you can't or won't do it for whatever reason.
It doesn't make you selfish.

In fact, over the course of your life, I'm sure you have said no to helpling someone because of the boundaries you have set in your life.

It is probably an over-used expression, and there are better ways of describing how you are making sure your own health does not suffer, but I don't think it is a bad thing or selfish to have some things you will or won't do.

This.

I agree 100% OP. It's the sheer outrage when someone is asked for a favour that would cost them nothing and not put them out at all and we get the "No is a complete sentence" and CF accusations.

The worse ones are on the SM board where SM are aghast if asked to look after their own DC's siblings for an afternoon or so. All that "they're not your DCs hun" and other bullshit.

I instituted “boundaries” I suppose when it finally dawned on me that I did quite a lot for people who did bugger all for me. Took til my mid-40s though.

Really? I only see ‘no is a complete sentence’ advice given when the person that’s asked was expecting a yes, and continues to try and push it.

the problem isn’t that someone asks, the problem is that they don’t take ‘no’ for an answer and respect someone’s right to decline. That’s where it crosses into entitlement and cheeky fucker territory.

funnily enough I don’t think I’ve ever seen the people that say no take issue with those that would say yes, or tell them what they should do. It’s usually the ‘be kind’ squad that are outraged at refusal, berate the OP, and readily tell people how they should behave.

"She's the sort of woman who lives for others—you can always tell the others by their hunted expression." C. S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters (1942).

Well we do need to set some boundaries and some of us aren't very good at doing so in all circumstances. But I do agree that this seems to often be going too far now and Well, you know what, your boundaries won't help you when you're in the shit and YOU need some help. Just be prepared. < < < this.

Someone “eye-rolling at the idea of boundaries” is a huge red flag to me.

Complete bullshit.
Having boundaries is normal, crossing them and demanding constant favours is CFery.
No one ever posts about the normal taking in one parcel, looking after DC once as a favour etc
Its always endless requests for cash, child care etc

Sone people have a wide field and others a small field when it comes to boundaries. I've often found that people can take the piss if you don't have boundaries.
Saying that I'm shit with putting up boundaries and can be a bit of a walk over so I need more lol

I agree. I often see messages on here basically saying that people should NEVER put themselves out for others, never do anything they don't want etc. I do understand its important not to be taken advantage of, definitely! However, from Mumsnet, I'm getting the impression that people are becoming increasingly selfish, pleasing themselves only. Sometimes you have to do things for others out of kindness even if you don't really want to.

Totally & completely agree OP. There are so many selfish women on here that it genuinely saddens me. So many people who say they wouldn't help a random child in need or an adult they don't know who knocks on their door in distress as an example.

Also some (not all!!) stepmothers who refuse to even have any emotional care or concern for their step child. Despite agreeing to become their Stepmother!
Just the other day one Stepmum on here referred to how she "doesn't give a shit" in the context of showing an interest in how her DSC's parents evenings go or DH's meetings with their child's mother about their DSC!!! Another one said she regularly leaves out her resident DSS when taking her own children out somewhere just because their DH isn't going! Heartbreaking 💔

You've confused 'not caring' with 'having boundaries' and think you are proving a point.

It just means don’t put others first AT THE EXPENSE OF YOURSELF.

liek the age old parenting saying - ‘you can’t pour from an empty cup’.

to help others, you have to sometimes help yourself first and foremost .

Yet you’re the one handwringing and devoting headspace to it, while the ‘selfish women’ are minding their business and getting on with their lives.

Another win for having boundaries.

Perhaps it's a question of interpretation- so many people seem to think of boundaries as hard brick walls, then they police the exterior of the wall (often using the language of self-care) so no one can even approach.

They never consider that a boundary can be softer, like a hedge, so it has some give and take, and that their policing the outside of their wall actually means they are trespassing on someone else's land, so they are breaking someone else's boundary.

Well no, there’s no ‘have to’ about it. That’s the point.

what I’ve seen on here is people saying just that, that it’s your choice whether to put yourself out or not. Because it is. Respecting the fact it’s someone’s choice that should be freely made is not the same as never putting yourself out. You can freely choose to put yourself out, which is better than doing it because you’ve been emotionally blackmailed into it and invariably ending up seething with resentment and feeling taken advantage of.