Death certificate cause of death

[asblindasabat]

My question is based on the fact the Queen’s death certificate has been released and it says the cause of death was “old age”

Obviously, that is true but I didn’t think an official record of a person’s death would record the cause using such a basic term?

I thought it would have to be the actual scientific/medical cause of death?

Just curious!

many many old people have some cancerous cells doesn't mean it was a cause of death,

we knew my dad was dying there were district nurses in twice a day for last few days and a hospital bed provided
if a doctor has seen and treated the patient within 14 days of death ie they know what they died from there is no need for a post mortem as Dr can sign death certificate,
only a coroners post mortem is compulsory if the hospital want to do one to say learn more the patient or next of kin can refuse

This would be absolutely fine were it not for the fact that other factors did seem to be involved. She had been suffering 'mobility problems' for several months.
Are there any consequences for medics if they don't fully note all causes of death?
(for example, if she had had a stroke or MI recently? Or even not that recently but it had a prolonged impact on her health)
My late DM's death certificate noted 1/pneumonia 2/shingles and 3/dementia. She was 90 so surely all these could have come under the 'old age' umbrella. But it didn't say that.

To just put old age in this case raises far more questions than it answers.

Yes I agree.
My grandmother had old age recorded on her death certificate and she was 90!

To just put old age in this case raises far more questions than it answers.

For whom though?

Surely if the family are satisfied that's it?

We know that she was ill. She probably had a number of different (perhaps age-related) conditions. To find out exactly which one killed her, a post-mortum would be required. Such a procedure would just be a matter of curiosity. Her death was natural and expected.

This would be absolutely fine were it not for the fact that other factors did seem to be involved. She had been suffering 'mobility problems' for several months.

You mean mobility problems like a lot of very old people...?

To just put old age in this case raises far more questions than it answers.

no it doesn't.

There will be medical notes about the Queen which are confidential but will document her medical conditions. Mobility issues can be a sign of ongoing frailty and decline. Doctors are allowed to put old age on somebody above the age of 80. They will have noticed a progressive decline and would have been a somewhat expected death. Some doctors practice differently, there's no conspiracy sometimes the very old decline and pass very quickly. She had a good death IMO much better than it being drawn out.

My late DM's death certificate noted 1/pneumonia 2/shingles and 3/dementia. She was 90 so surely all these could have come under the 'old age' umbrella.

Those were conditions the medics identified as contributing to your mother's death. But presumably the Queen did not have such things.
As I described with my father he had mobility problems that resulted directly from the aging process not a separate diagnosable condition. They weren't the cause of death.
So I have no problem accepting the cause as Old Age for the Queen. I don't see why it creates any unanswered questions.

Lol 😂 keep her away from David Attenborough!

If it wasn't anything obvious like cancer, kidney failure etc. I think they don't go in too much detail.

The Queen was under medical supervision for last 24 hours so foul play can be ruled out and old age granted. My fil was 86 but as he had not been seen by GP for over a year due to Covid when he died of old age he had to have autopsy even though my mil was distraught at thought of him being cut open. Nothing in particular was found mil told he just stopped breathing. Old age then recorded. She was furious.

In a lot of cases, you'd have to do an autopsy to find out exactly what killed someone. It'd be a complete waste of time to do an autopsy on every 96 year old woman who'd been visibly getting frailer and weaker for the last few years.

My Mum died of cancer. But that's only true at a general level. Having cancer itself doesn't kill you. Reduced blood flow to the brain from a tumour pressing on an artery, or her lungs filling up with fluid as an immune response to her lung tumours, or her kidneys giving up the ghost. One of them will have killed her, and even if you bothered to do an autopsy you might not find out which, so cancer goes on the death certificate.

At 96, you've likely got about 50 different things wrong, with you, and it's likely a combination of them that killed you. So again, you don't bother finding out the specific thing, it's a waste of time, even for the queen. So old age goes on the death certificate

That's so sad @caringcarer.

but it shows that even after a post mortem old age can be given as cause of death. Thankfully most old people don't need to go through that for a death certificate.

Besides, it's probably bad form to put "Having to spend an afternoon with Boris Johnson and Liz Truss instead of being where she should have been - lying in bed watching The Only Way is Essex" on the death certificate

Why @diddl?

Not being goady just interested:)

My mums death certificate states dementia as cause of death. The doctor who certified her death asked me if I was happy with that as apparently many families are not happy and was a more specific cause. To do that, there has to be an autopsy. My siblings and I were fine with the dc saying dementia, we did felt mum had been through enough and should not have to have an autopsy, thus delaying the funeral. She had no physical illnesses, was otherwise very healthy but once her dementia became advanced, she pretty much gave up.

I can understand that the Queen dies of old age, yes, she managed to undertake a few engagements that week but the strain undoubtedly took it out of her and her body just gave up. It’s usually a very peaceful way to die, my mum just fell asleep and stopped breathing after an hour or so with no apparent discomfort or pain.

The doctor said that some families are embarrassed to have dementia on the dc which I don’t really understand.

Exactly what was listed for both my mum and aunt when they each died at 96. Old age. Didn't surprise me at all that that's what the Queen died of too.

I was surprised that Anne was the one who registered the death. Not because I don’t think she is hardworking, I do but I thought they’d have had a royal staff member to register the death but it just must be down to relatives like it is for ordinary people.

When dm died the dr put dehydration because he insisted he couldn’t put old age. We had the devil of a job getting out of a pm, heartbreaking interview with the registrar, who had to get a letter from the doctor to change it.(she’d been in palliative care) He said it was very common to put old age.

Exactly. Mobility problems could be anything, like a dodgy hip or knee that she didn’t want to have an operation for to painful bunions or other issues with her feet. . I am glad they put old age, the fact that the relatives were called in such a hurry seems to point to a very sudden deterioration in her health which could have been for a number of reasons , a stroke, heart failure, aneurism, doesn’t matter what it was, the outcome is the same.

If I get to 96 I hope I go the same way I don’t want to gradually descend into senility, or become so frail that I am bed bound, or dependent on oxygen. I think it sounds as though she had the sort of death that many old people pray for, quick, in her own bed at home, with people she loved.

The registrar probably came to them, and it's normal to have someone who was present at the death as the official informant. Princess Anne was the one who remained with the late Queen throughout the time in Scotland

Can't the frailty of old age thing effectively mean that lots of body systems were failing and you can't attribute death to one isolated cause?

My nans said that to. Other causes listed underneath. Even though without the other causes she would have most likely still been around. She was in good health before Covid.

My friend's grandmother had the same thing on her death cert recently. She was 91 and she wasn't ill, she just sat down for a rest after lunch and stopped being alive, so it seems appropriate.

When people are very elderly, at some point their body just says ‘enough’ and everything stops working. Think of it like a watch winding down. There doesn’t have to be an illness or event to precipitate the end of life if you’re very old. Bodies aren’t designed to live forever unless cut down by illness or accident. Haven’t you heard of people just dying in their sleep?