Could I (potential) end up having to pay for one of my parents funeral?

[JustlookingNotbuying]

My parents are elderly (both 80). Dad is in good health (thankfully, atm) but mum has Alzheimer’s.
They have a lot of money invested and a house which worth quite a bit too.
My in-laws organised and pre-paid for their funeral (wishes, songs, hymns etc all organised) and their burial plots several years ago.
At the time (and since) my dad has scoffed at this saying it’s weird and macabre. It really isn’t, I see it as sensible (my friends mum has recently done the same).
When MIL passed away 2 years ago there was literally no stress for dh, bil or fil. The funeral company just got out a piece of paper which they signed and everything was dealt with.
Dad still thinks it is weird and will not discuss his or mums wishes. When I’ve asked he just says there is £10k in an account which will cover everything then it’s down to dsis and I to deal with it. He says he had to organise his parents and mum hers and it isn’t that much of an issue!
Anyhow, not much more I can say about that!?
But mum does have dementia, it is in the late early stages atm.
Dad doesn’t cope too well with her care and although I help most days there will come a time when mum will need to go into full time care and obviously this will be when their money will start to be eaten away including the £10k ‘funeral’ money as it’s not secured and will be taken into account with the rest of their money.
Anyway, my FIL was talking to his neighbours daughter the other day. The neighbour had gone into care some years ago due to dementia. Her savings were drawn down during this time and sadly the house also had to be sold. By the time she had passed away all her money (including the funds from house sale) had gone. The £23,500 which I believe ‘they’ can not touch was swallowed up with estate agent fees, legal and solicitor fees etc so in the end thendaughter and her dh had to pay for her mothers funeral.
This has worried me a little as I personally don’t have the money to pay for one of my parents funeral, neither has my dsis and tbh with my parents combined worth of roughly £800k (including current house prices), I don’t see why I should have too but still my dad refuses to even discuss a pre-paid plan.
I honestly don’t know if fil’s neighbour story is real or exaggerated but I am now a little concerned could this potentially happen? Can children end up having to foot one of their parents funeral bills if a care home drains all the money?
We (dad and I) have a meeting with his solicitor next week to clarify things in his will, I need to voice my concerns then.

I think reasonable funeral fees are the first thing to be paid out of the estate if there is one. If there is no estate I believe that the local authourity will pay for a basic funeral, so you shouldn't have to pay.

You don't actually have to have a funeral as such. Though you'd need to buy a coffin and pay for the cremation or burial (I assume you'd need a coffin - maybe you don't).
You don't need to have a service and a big do afterwards.

My FIL pre paid his funeral and my god it saved so much stress with songs etc. I would go to local funeral companies and get some information and give it to your dad.

is there anyway you can arrange it and pay for it out of the money saved just now without him having to do much?

I think funeral plans can sometimes be a bit of a con, so I wouldn’t worry about your parents not having one. The FCA has been on the case for a few years - www.fca.org.uk/consumers/funeral-plans/providers-list

What I would encourage your parents to put a little bit of thought into (not worry) is who is going to foot the immediate expenses of a funeral before their estate can refund that person. Eg caterers for a wake and a funeral director for the coffin/cremation fees can want payment within 30 days. Worst case scenario you could probably get a loan or credit card to pay for it. My H’s funeral came to about £5k 6 years ago and that was with about 100 people for sandwiches and a nice carved wood urn etc - so not basic but lovely, and spending less could still have been just as lovely.

I think it’s sensible to buy a plot as it can take a lot of the worry and uncertainty off the bereaved - it’s nice not to have to wander round a cemetery/burial site looking for a plot when you’re in the midst of grief (bitter experience!)

can you go along the lines of prompting your parents to think about you and your worries and needs, rather than them going along the more selfish route of thinking they won’t be there so why bother thinking about it? I think it can take some care and tact, because often at the root of defensiveness and arguments can be a genuine fear of facing the reality of death.

You’re being sensible to think about it all. But ultimately this is their problem. When the time comes, do what you can for them if they want, but if they’ve neglected to plan what they want it’s not your problem. Your work will be to focus on working through your grief and how you’d best like to say goodbye to them, and that can be with or without spending a lot of money on a funeral.

In short, don’t worry about it! What will be will be.

The funeral is one of the first things to be arranged and the bank can pay the funeral director directly even if accounts are frozen. They won’t pay for anything arranged after the funeral like a lunch/tea etc. this is exactly what happened when my mum died.

My dad had a direct cremation. Literally taken straight from the morgue to be cremated. My step-mum didn’t even organise a wake. Not saying that’s what you should do but it can be done as cheaply as that.

If there is any money left, the estate pays for the funeral. If there really isn't, the Local authority will arrange it, which isn't as bad as it sounds, it's still a "proper" funeral.

My parents would hate to be pressured into planning and pre-paying their own funerals. It reminds them of their mortality which they don't want to consider, even though they are relatively elderly. It would be upsetting for them if I insisted I didn't want to do it for them.

Funeral plans can be a bit of a con so I definitely would not encourage purchase of one of those. Anything advertised in that style on the telly is obviously lucrative!

Funeral costs can / will be paid for from my parents estate and it is very unlikely to be so eaten up by care fees that there won't be sufficient to cover it.

My parents have already bought their ‘plot’. Our local cemetery was getting full years ago, they want to be together in a certain space and close to other relatives. I think that’s nice and nothing macabre.

Yes, as long as there's enough cash to cover it.

are you worried there will literally be no cash?

my parents don't/didn't have plans either. I didn't have to pay dad's from a frozen account though and if there were any complications, sis and I could pay.

no one knew what dad wanted so his was a very simple service with me and a close friend of his speaking and a poem, plus a couple of songs mum chose.

none of us wanted a formal affair though, so it wasn't expensive either.

The bank can pay the funeral director before you have probate etc, so don't worry about it. If your mum does go into residential care, your dad could still take out a funeral plan then to protect that money out of her half of their liquid assets.
I did have to have a very difficult conversation with my dad about what sort of funeral he wanted for him and mum (she also had dementia), and I was very glad of that when he, then she died very close together that I was doing the right thing - they both had direct cremations due to covid but at least I knew dad wanted something small and not fussy

When my fil died last year mil was in such a terrible state as had been married for 62 years, she could not make any decisions at all andy DH and I went up and DH did it all from funeral directors, selecting a coffin, I sorted music and wrote eulogy and got his suit clean prior to burial, we sorted out caterers to bring prepared buffet to house as fil had a lot of friends who attended. Also mil had no idea about bills as fil had always paid them so we sorted out DD for bills for her. I am dreading mil dying as she has so much stuff in her home. I know I will end up having to go through it. She is a lovely mil though.

A similiar thing happened to a friend. Yes, there was considerable money in the estate but she couldn't pay for the meal/car/flowers etc that she knew they would have wanted.

The bank did allow direct transfer to funeral director but basics only.

She had poor credit (single mum, special needs child) & didn't gave a fabulous relationship with them.
They were of the "youve made your bed lie in it" "we've done our parenting" type

it was a fucking disgracr, the workload emotional and physically that she went through, endless phone calls, crisis loan applications etc and her ongoing embarrassment (jer parents were very 'naice/golf club types' ) that they got a really really cheap looking funeral without as much as a cup of tea type situation after. She was too proud to borrow from friends & frankly I would rather loan her for her & her dc or treat her to nice stuff for her than help towards those assholes funeral.

I now have ZERO sympathy for older generation that refuse to talk about/plan/pay for their funerals.

If my own mother doesn't address this then I'll be washing my hands of the issue frankly.
My every sympathy OP

I have organised three funerals now, one had a plan in place so was easy, the other two were paid upfront and then reimbursed from the deceased's estate. If your mother dies first, your father can pay. The problem will be if he dies first as his accounts will be frozen on death and won't unlock until probate is carried out - usually a while after the funeral.

The last thing you need to worry about when a family member dies is paying for a funeral and the other costs involved. Don't forget if you have a large family or your parents have a large social circle, you will need to organise a large wake too. You dont want to be making sandwiches etc the night before you say fareful to a parent. It's far easier to have this done externally, one less thing to worry about. That will need a deposit up front too.

Do you have PoAs in place for both parents? If not, get it done ASAP (if your mother still has capacity). You need Financial and Health & Welfare. You can then use the PoA to set up plans.

You should be speaking to your parents about their wishes anyway. When my mother died, it was far less stressful to organise as we knew what she wanted and we weren't left wondering if we had done the right thing for her. Not in the least macabre, in fact it was quite comforting.

Unless both of the parents end up in a care home the home won't be sold for costs, will it? I'm in Scotland but that's the case up here anyway.
These parents have planned ahead by putting money aside for the funeral. They could always give it to the dd but no guarantees what it would be spent on, and I think you can only gift so much a year.

My mil has alzeimers and had to go into a care home. Fil was very worried about her assets being used and there being nothing left for their funerals and he was advised by the assessor that a funeral plan was one of the things he was allowed to spend her money on without it being seen as deprivation of assets.

No, you won't have to pay for their funeral.

Even if they need a lot of care, the last £23k for the remaining spouse will be more than enough to pay for a funeral.

Before that, you say they have savings, investments and a house that is worth quite a bit, so it's quite unlikely that all that will get eaten up by care fees, which they won't have to pay if assets are reduced down to below £23k.

People who say they 'had' to pay for a relatives funeral and got into debt doing so were misinformed. No-one is legally obliged to pay for someone else's funeral. If this is something you are concerned about, it's best to read up about it before the time comes, so that you're not put on the spot when you're not in a position to think rationally.

As a last resort, there's the direct cremation or local authority funded funeral option at minimal or no cost to the relatives. If the deceased has no money, and neither do their relatives, the council will pay for a 'public health' funeral.

And YY, they could prepay their funeral with someone reputable and unlikely to go bust, like the Co-op, if this is something that concerns them.

Just want to point out that when assets or savings go down to £23000, the LA will start to make a contribution towards care costs but only pay the full amount once funds drop to around £14,000.

We did this a couple of years ago. If your parents aren't fussed, you don't need to pre-pay for any funeral plans. DH and I emailed a couple of funeral directors. I don't know what package he got. But they collected the body from the morgue, creamted it and then delivered the ashes in a box to us. They can scatter it in the crematorium for you too. It is as easy to organise as email for quotes and phone call.

I agree with your father it’s not much to ask for you to arrange their funerals if they have put aside the money. If it gets to the post they go into care and that cares being paid for by your patents assets then you will then have to insist that money is put into a funeral plan. You may power if eternity by then anyway. You can set money aside for this we did it with our mum.

It's quite difficult. I'd say since they really don't seem to care, you can choose whatever funeral works for you, and that isn't expensive. My main difficulty when my father died was that I knew he would care, but had left no instructions because it was very sudden. I'm still a bit haunted by whether he really wanted to be cremated. As a result I've written pages of instructions with my will and I'm in my 40s! Want to spare the kids.

When my dad passed away the funeral fees were paid by his estate before it was paid out. So yes I paid but not in advance.

Funeral fees have priority on the estate so as long as they don't die destitute you will be fine.

In her shoes, I'd have done a direct cremation.

I am hoping mum will give permission for us to do that. I can't face organising another funeral. A simple one for dad was bad enough.