I envy people who have Faith

[BlueBloodedBlue]

I don't but it must be a real comfort to believe in a higher power and have something that gives a meaning to everything.

That's it really.

SnoozyLucy7 I have read through this thread again and find I agree with your post so much that I have copied it and stuck it into my diary, thank you 🙂

I can’t answer for other religions but the Judeo - Christian God is the eternal creator without beginning and end. That shouldn’t be too much of a mind stretch because until recently most scientists believed that matter itself was eternal.

I’m a Muslim and my faith is what keeps me strong and keeps me going. People talk about love making the world go round but people are fickle and when there are so many feelings invested in a person who then let’s you down, it can be crippling. Whereas with true faith, You’re never let down by God. Everything is His decision and we are pleased with whatever He decides. He has wisdom and insight and power and I fully devote my mind, soul and heart to Him.

That, is such a big comfort to me and gets me through everything. My daughter recently went through a difficult divorce and I feel our trust in God and hope for betterment got us all through it without any hard feelings. My husbands business is on the verge of collapse but we all have faith and trust that God will look after us. Its such a good mental state to be in when things are going tits up and I’m very grateful for it.

Theres also the comfort of eternal reward and paradise. It means there is always something to look forward to and be hopeful of. God rewards the believers for all adversity and especially so when it’s dealt with patience. So it means every minus can be turned into a plus.

I went to Mecca to the pilgrimage a few years ago and met with Muslims from all around the world. People with different cultures, lifestyles, backgrounds and upbringings yet talking to them and seeing them pray shows that it’s the same for all practising, believing Muslims- your faith carries you through everything and I am so, so happy that I’m a Muslim. Where would I be without my faith.

@GoldenOmber it isn't possible to have enough spiritual input in schools to represent all faiths equally, is it? I would love to see that happen, I really would, but it's logistically not possible. My local secondary had people visit to speak in assemblies, but they were always Christian (and sadly of a very unpleasant anti LGBT/sexist evangelical denomination) because we live in a very white conservative area. I would have loved to see Muslim, Hindu, Jewish, Sikh and pagan speakers, but it was never going to happen.

So I would have preferred none.

And I'm fine with religious schools existing, I just don't think they should get state funding. My children went to our local C of E primary because out of the two schools in our town, it was the best fit for them. I chose it because of the academics, not the religion. As I said, I was totally upfront with them about our lack of belief. I also didn't opt them out of assemblies because no, I don't think religion is a danger to them. When my DD1 came home aged 5 and told me I had to believe in God we had a discussion about faith, how it should be a free choice and how she couldn't tell me what I had to believe just as I couldn't tell her what to believe. She went through a very religious phase which lasted about a year and then it stopped.

@Malie you believe the Judaeo-Christian god is the creator. There's no evidence of that though. It could be any one of a lot of other deities that people believe in, or none at all. Ultimately you have taken that leap of faith, but it doesn't make what you believe into universal truth that applies to all of us. Your belief is just that - a belief. As indeed is my choice not to believe.

There is of course plenty of evidence. That doesn’t mean there is ultimate proof. That is where Faith comes in. However there is absolutely no evidence for atheism, the extraordinary belief that something can be made by nothing. That to me is blind faith. But as I said, God gives us a choice whether to believe.

What is the evidence? Because without evidence this god you talk of does not exist.

@BoviTraci You might find the thread 'God is the creator so who created god?' interesting, although I'm afraid it did get hijacked like a lot of them. No idea how to link it.

@Lulooo Thank you for your thoughts, it's nice to have someone from a different faith join in.

💛

@Malie what evidence? I don 't see any evidence for the existence of god. Nor, to be fair do I see any for the non-existence of god. The lack is equal on both sides. The bottom line is that we don't know - as an atheist I am happy not to know and I don't feel the need to fill that gap with something.

Can I ask you first what the evidence is for atheism? Interesting that even humanists like Brian Cox and David Attenborough when pressed will not rule out a creator God. And even Richard Dawkins has said that he is only ‘70% sure’ that God doesn’t exist. So evidence?

That's your choice of course and I've made mine. I shouldn't have to prove to you or anyone else why I believe certain things and vice versa.

Thanks but I don’t like to base my life on things I don’t know

That was directed towards pointythings Malie.

I agree. I work in an area with a Muslim community and I see people, especially on a Friday going to the mosque in droves. I never see the same with Christian churches on a Sunday. In fact the beautiful Christian church was closed for many years until the Muslim community turned it into a mosque.

@TroysMammy Sorry, could you clarify what you agree with?

The burden of proof is on the believer. So you say there is a god but yet no one has ever seen he/she/it. So in order to make that an actual fact, in order for it be true there has to be tangible proof. Just because someone said that there is a god 2 thousand years ago, and that statement has been regurgitated ever since then still doe’s make it true. Atheism isn’t a religion, it just states there is no god as there is no proof. And so, how can you prove something doesn’t exist if it hasn’t been proven to exist in the first place?

@Malie there is no evidence for the non-existence of a god, That's the whole point. Atheism is a belief position just as much as faith is. There is also no evidence that god exists. The difference is that I am at peace with not knowing and believers are not. That isn't a value judgement, it's just how things are.

I base my life on the belief that as humans, we do not need a deity to be good people. So I live my life being the best human I can be, with the aim of leaving the world a slightly better place than I found it. And I am content. You do not need religious faith to be a decent moral human being.

Respect, compassion and loving your neighbour are not values associated exclusively with faith. That is a delusion.

You do not need religious faith to be a decent moral human being.

Nobody said you can't be a good, upstanding member of society without faith. I can't speak for everyone but Christians generally don't rock up to church on a Sunday thinking they're the bee's knees and that everybody else is rubbish.

The burden of proof is on the believer.

@SnoozyLucy7 But why do you want proof if you don't have faith? Believers aren't obliged to prove anything.

As the proof is all around you - the very fact that you are here! One would think it obvious! Atheism is a religion. It is blind faith in nothing. It is believing with our 3lb brain that if there is anything in this universe (96% of which we do not know about) that is beyond our tiny minds then it can’t exist. Like the so-called ‘age of reason’ guys believed.

Exactly Malie, we are currently on a huge chunk of rock, spinning around an enormous burning star, in the great vacuum of space - surely anything is possible.

@Malie I agree that atheism is a faith position. I disagree that our existence is evidence of a god. Isaac Asimov wrote an excellent short story in which a group of scientists find out and prove that our universe is in fact a petrie dish containing an experiment - which is set to end the moment its subject realise what they are. And the universe ends.

This could be true. We don't know. We do not (currently) have the means to find out. Therefore your belief and my belief are equal in terms of plausibility. As a believer, you fill the gap in your knowledge with a god. As an atheist, I am happy to not fill it at all. Both positions give us comfort and solace in our lives. And that's fine.

@Vincitveritas that was the wrong word so I came back into this thread to say I don't envy, I admire those who do have faith. I don't, never had and never will.