Middle class identifiers 2022

[Pullandpush]

I read a similar thread a few years ago & the main middle class markers were hummus, organic food, private education, boden, ski trips etc, farrow & ball..
Are these unchanged for 2022 or have the identifiers shifted?
Since the pandemic I've seen a rise in the "hipster" style MC especially the men, maybe the working from home has allowed them to relax into the unshaven, casual look which wasn't there a few years ago...
Private education seems to be on the wane but that may be due to the cost of living..
Any other main MC identifiers I missed?

Yes BBC vs ITV is/was definitely a peak class identifier.

@ThanksItHasPockets except for those who live in social housing. It's still a thing (thank goodness) and means that even the leafiest comp has a more comprehensive mix in its population than the local private or grammar.
Leafy comp is often a term which is used to bash those who might choose to go down the state route. Areas with leafy comps sti have plenty of private schools!

Chickens. Growing a cut flower patch. Renting designer clothes for “functions”, wild swimming. Shopping at Waitrose but boasting about shopping at Lidl/Aldi (the novelty).

Teenagers taking part in Duke of Edinburgh. However. DS attends a state academy which is extremely mixed and most of his DofE friends are more likely to be working class. The Bronze has cost us £25 with many items being provided by the school. it's been heavily subsided to encourage the less less fortunate to take part.

So...I'm going to say...teenagers at private / grammar schools taking part in DofE. it's highly likely they've had to pay over £300 per child to take part and are expected to buy all the branded gear to wear on expedition. that's another £300 per child.

I'm also aware that a friend's child at a prv school hasn't missed any DofE activities and the whole thing has been run with military precision. DS however hasn't had much input from school and has largely been asked to just get on with it because of staff shortages.

so there's definitely a different feel depending on state or private education. IMO anyway.

@Lois345 , Income doesn't define class

@LouisCatorze i would have thought Gucci trainers were on par with a scouse brow in terms of clear indicators that someone is not MC

This thread made me realise I’m not as middle class as I thought I was. Back to the mines I go.

Wine society, not laithwaites

Gucci trainers were on par with a scouse brow in terms of clear indicators that someone is not MC these were not your bog standard Gucci trainers though (the signature branding was not visible at all initially) but the different 'floral' backs were just very unusual and caught my attention so I looked closer!) and everything else about them shouted monied MC, the teenage daughter particularly. They didn't look 'naff' and it's entirely possible to differentiate between those that look and don't look the part.

Leafy comps by their very definition tend to be desirable and generally much further up league tables. So they attract lots of naice families who would otherwise go private or send their DC to grammar schools (if they live in those parts of the country), thus pushing out WC families who become less and less able to afford 'catchment area' housing.

This.
I’m surprised so many focus on items people own when so much is knowledge, culture etc to me when defining class.

Our DCs did bronze 4 years ago at State School it cost £100 each. The school offered silver at £300 but no one wanted to do it. For £100 is was run by the daftest teacher in the school - totally shambles - how she ever gets up in the morning never mind getting a job is beyond me. It was a waste of time - should have done it with the Scouts!

IME DofE is pretty egalitarian. World Challenge is the MC marker.

It's all bonkers isn't it? The main thing I've noticed is the more money we have - we've slogged to found and develop a very successful business, which now probably puts us in the top 10% of earners - the less I care about and of these "markers". Our cars are old, the house is a tip and in need of redecoration, the kids wear nearly entirely secondhand and about 80% of mine and my partner clothes have some sort of hole in them

I wonder if money just brings the ability to just not give a toss what other people think? And not need to conform and keep up with what everyone rose thinks is cool?

The MC is surely is just a consumerist dream?

All countries have social hierarchies though. I was born on the bottom rung of the Irish socio-economic ladder and believe me I grew up knowing that. The small Irish city I grew up in was very very stratified & everyone knew exactly where their particular part of town stood in relation to others. Also IME Irish people are much less PC when talking about 'lower' class people - they really don't pull their punches.

Wow. Now that’s what I call middle class.

more like 40k now

I don't think class has anything to do with shopping or money. It is about education (not necessarily private education, but having a wide knowledge of the world that comes from ones own experiences), culture, language and family history

I disagree, it's all about money, or the outward trappings of it. However, I discussed this thread with my DH and he said it's all about education. I am still not sure, you can be well educated and still live in a council flat so better off people will look down on you.

And well educated people who have a garden room can still drive cheap cars and be looked down on for the car they drive (I mentioned on a thread about parents controlling kids' friendships that they judge possible friendships based on car ownership where I live).

I always think it silly to judge "class" on hobbies, too. Who says that attending Ascot and opera is more classy than going to an athletics event or a pop concert?

A houseful of books is probably about the most bonafide MC proof of status you can get. If you don't have too many books cluttering up every room, then you're not the real deal

well by this marker we are definitely middle class

I’m surprised so many focus on items people own when so much is knowledge, culture etc to me when defining class.

indeed 'Cultural capital' which has been often mentioned.

But if you were walking through an area you had never been before what assumptions of class would you make ( if you had to ) because of what you saw. Of the people around you and the place.

No one saying that people should have or need to have those identifications. It's just they often do. That's where possessions, brands, clothing come into it.

Although habits, hobbies, jobs have also come into it.

Posters seem quite persistent about books being a marker. Though I'd question that in the digital/kindle age. I'd just say 'reading'

Well I'm reassured to be definitely not MC (or is that just London/SE MC?) but wonder what will happen if I don't fit working class either?

I find all this stuff weirdly fascinating

I'm the daughter of a very working class father and a middle class mother, I'm usually perceived as middle class (established middle class in the quiz) despite my father being very working class. I think my lack of accent is one of the main reasons I seem middle class, although I can see a lot of other markers on this thread that apply to me, although its kind of weird too, I thought I grew veg and had an orchard and hens because I like gardening but it turns out its because I'm middle class 😂

My DH has a similarish background to me. His father is middle class, his mother is working class but from a family with more money than my fathers.

My DH is usually perceived as working class although he would also come out as established middle class in the quiz and has many of the same markers in the thread as I do. But he has a broad regional accent and a slight speech impediment which (because he pauses a lot and speaks a little slower to cope with it) means he can sound less clever than he is.

We used to live in a solidly WC area and I noticed people used to warm to my DH more and be more immediately friendly with him and it would take them awhile to get used to me. I genuinely thought it was because he is more likeable (he totally is likeable!)

However now we live in a more MC area and he has mentioned himself how he notices people seem to warm to me more quickly etc and I've had a few comments from people which make me realise they think my DH isn't very clever (they are wrong he's hugely intelligent)

So its interesting how people can be more comfortable around people they 'perceive' to be the same as them

you can’t buy things to be middle class or I could just go out and buy everything on these lists and then stick on radio 4 and be middle class, which I’m not.

I was very financially lucky growing up but I’m not middle class, and I don’t think I really noticed / understood until I was older. My parents simply weren’t interested in us learning languages or instruments or sports or culture - probably because they didn’t do any of that growing up and you don’t know what you don’t know.

As much as we pretend it doesn’t, class and connections massively determine your life.

If you've ever read Our Mutual Friend the description of the Veneerings says it all about money rather than class. Has much changed over 150 years?

As I've said previously, my paternal line is solidly MC going back to the mid 19th century. Sort of like Pa Middleton's family although we had talented bluestockings rather than the odd aristo woman who married in. We have been brought up to value education above money for sure. If we have a wider tribe it's not one that would outwardly shout MC because we don't value most of the wealth identifiers mentioned. We are quite 'scruffy' and likely eco-warriors ahead of our time.

This sounds a lot like Ireland. There's a much parodied Irish equivalent of RP (sometimes referred to as 'D4' after a particular posh Dublin postcode) which is very definitively not RP and would just sound 'Irish' to foreigners. Funnily enough I've ended up with a very D4 accent (thanks posh university!) despite having grown up on a dog rough council estate.

But we have loads of books and our cultural capital is strong.