If you've seen someone die, what happened? (TW: trauma, loss, death, terminal illness)

[HangingOver]

This is quite difficult to write, as I have OCD and, ever since I was small, it has relentlessly latched on to the idea that if I talk about the idea of a loved one dying, write it, or even think the words, that it will somehow cause it to happen and it will be my fault. Therefore, like a lot of people, I imagine, I try to completely avoid talking or thinking about it at all, and if you have similar issues, I'm warning you in advance this thread will upset you.

But here goes, inspired by all the talk about dear Deborah James and her latest news, I wanted to try to talk about it becasue I really, really fear death and never talk about it with anyone IRL.

The thing that got me thinking this morning was a very clever and kind sounding palliative care doctor on Radio Five Live this morning talking about what generally happens at the end of someone's life in a hospice. She made it sound quite gentle, slow and peaceful and made sure to point out that physiological changes, such as changes in breathing patterns etc. aren't signs of distress, they're more involuntary noises of unconsciousness that the person doesn't know they're making (like when you snore, I guess).

I know she's generalising and of course this is what most people want to hear...and perhaps it is what happens for a lot of people...but that wasn't my experience of losing my Mum AT ALL. At least, it was up to a point, but at the actual moment of death, having been unconscious for many many days, she bloody 'woke up', for about 30 seconds. She appeared to be crying (or at least her eyes were heavily watering) and basically suffocated in front of us while seeming to stare at me with a terrified look in her eyes.

It was so, so, so bloody awful and I will never get over it. I can still see it in my mind's eye with absolute clarity. I feel so so sorry for what she must have been feeling in that moment. I've spoken to two friends who also lost a parent who was about the same age (60-ish) and they have said the same thing; and also said that they weren't aware this was a thing that happened and it was an awful shock.

So what gives? Were our relatives just unlucky or is this actually more common than people realise? Or is it actually all purely physical and she wouldn't have know anything clutching at straws-

I've googled it but most people seem to refer to a 'non-peaceful death' as one where the person was very upset towards/about the end of their life, rather than this 'waking up' thing.

Sorry in advance for starting possibly the most depressing and awful thread imaginable! I just find it so difficult to talk to anyone IRL about becasue of aforementioned problems (this has taken a long time to write as you can imagine!!)

I was with my Mum and Grandad when they died.

My grandad wasn't peaceful, he had a very late cancer diagnosis and went downhill in the space of days. His liver gave out causing him to struggle. The hospital staff kindly topped up his morphine which helped him settle and a few minutes later he was gone.

My Mum I watched die of cancer, she had dwindled for 18months but we were never ready (not sure you ever are). She went very peacefully at home, thanks in most part to some amazing medications and a syringe driver that had been set up to keep her comfortable in her final days. We spent the last day with her, surrounding her with love, laughter and memories. My Dad sat with her overnight and she just quietly let go. Utterly at peace.
My final words to her were see you later, knowing full well I never would.

2 years on from losing my Mum and to this day I know she went the way she wanted. But I cannot shift her image soon after from my mind. It was her, but not her.

I’ve not read the whole thread, but I’ll add my tuppence in. I saw my dad pass away (6 months after stomach cancer diagnosis). Cancer is an absolute rollercoaster of emotions, one minute you think they are going to recover, the next you get devastating news. He’d been in hospital for a good few weeks and only seemed agitated (not necessarily in pain) on the last day. We knew by this point he was going to die so we took shifts at the hospital to be with him. My mum had been staying overnight but went home to get a shower. He’d been thrashing about a bit and talking nonsense all day during my stay with him. And then as clear as day, he said to me ‘get your mother back, get your mother back’. So I called her and got her back to the hospital. I apologised and said I didn’t know if it was best, but at least the choice was hers. He seemed to get a bit more agitated, so I asked him if he wanted anymore pain relief - he nodded. Shortly after that my mum was talking to a nurse outside the room and his breathing changed - I just knew. So I got her back in the room, even though she was trying to brush me off/tell me it meant nothing. He passed very shortly after that, but before he did, he sat bolt upright, his eyes looked so clear rather than yellow, and the pain/agitation seemed to have drained from his face, he also reached out (my mum reckons he saw his mum, but idk about that). Her last words to him were ‘god speed’. In all honesty, I feel it was the best death in the circumstances, I am glad I was there, mum thinks he saw his mum so she got some comfort and I got to say everything I needed to and I did the best thing I’ve ever done by getting her back in that room with him. He was ready to go, but I think the extra pain relief probably made it happen faster. I’m agnostic - but he did come to me in the
most vivid dream I’ve ever had a few weeks later. I asked him why he doesn’t visit me and he said ‘it’s quite difficult to get away’.

Mine was strange as in it was a complete stranger. A man in his 80's lovely gentleman. He'd been hit by a car on a country road while walking his dog, my husband rang ambulance and police etc while he stayed with the driver who was in shock. He had serious leg injuries but despite that he talked as if he had no pain. He chatted about how his two adult children didn't seem to care and hadn't visited him in years, he explained he'd been told he had stage 4 cancer not long before and his kids reaction was to tell him to try and get him to transfer everything to them. When he refused they insisted he made sure there was a will made out to them. They still didn't visit and most of this was done over the phone. He told me how he lived in a lovely little period cottage that was worth a canny bit "his own words" how he drove a brand new range rover and had a 54inch TV that his kids had their eye on. They thought they would benefit from everything and assumed he was loaded. But didn't want to visit him they clearly wanted his money. Throughout our chat I reassured him he'd be fine and the ambulance wouldn't be long but he shook his head and told me. "No I always said pet, cancer won't take me" ambulance wasn't showing during pandemic there was a 2 hour wait supposingly. I only realised he was dying when he began to get weaker and weaker although he still tried to talk, I even told him I'd visit him, told him about my child and dog trying to keep his moral up. His own dog hovered round and had began to whine as if he knew. We had just started to hear sirens when he began to close his eyes. I tried to wake him he briefly opened them and told me. "I had the last laugh you know?" When I asked how he replied "The cottage is rented, I'm on basic state pension and have £4.70 to my name, everything else is on tick" he then smiled. "Pass a message on for me will you pet, tell my kids to enjoy sorting out that mess" then he smiled and held my hand and just slipped away. I was distraught about the way he died, although he didn't seem in physical pain he felt unloved. By the two people he brought into the world. I never got to pass the message on personally I believe the police did though as I gave them the statement and the officer I spoke to found it equally sad that he'd felt like that. I wish I'd been a fly on the wall when his two money grabbing kids who couldn't be arsed even visiting him realises there was nothing. That there wasn't even enough for the funeral. I hope they gave him a decent one but from what he seemed to imply he didn't seem to think it mattered once he was gone. I'm eased I never got to meet them.
I think the saddest part was when his dog realised he was gone it just started howling. I pray it found an equally kind home.

I wasn't there for the deaths of either my mum OR my dad. My mother died on the operating table of endocarditis. My dad died of old age in a nursing home: the last time I saw him, he was pleading with me to stay, but we had a plane to catch, and I just told him cheerfully, "We'll be back!" Of course, WE came back, but he had gone. They even cremated him before I got there. It was his wish and the law in his state says the crematoriums have to honor that. He'd even paid for being cremated.
Actually, I don't even remember for sure when the last time I saw my mum, because she lived far away and I didn't keep the flight confirmations for the times I visited her. I'm not even sure, but I guess the last time I saw her, she was waving me good-bye as I boarded the plane.

I'm just telling you this because maybe you will understand how I can feel it is a privilege that you could have been there for your parent at the moment of death. Maybe it was painful to watch your parent die, but it is natural to live past your parent's death. What is really painful is if you have to a watch your CHILD die. I'm glad I haven't had to experience that, and I hope I never do.

More than you realize, your presence gave your parent solace at the end. Perhaps that is why some people have children.

As a night nurse with occasional terminally Ill patients to care for, I was able to say to relatives in all honesty that their loved one had died in their sleep. Peaceful deaths were the norm when it was expected. Shortly before my father died he called for his mum several times, which I thought was terribly sad as though he was seeking comfort from her but just maybe she was coming for him.

If it helps at all… I’ve been reading Life After Life by Ron Moody - about near death experiences. In every single case people who technically “died” but came back explained that at the point of dying they felt very calm and the most incredible feeling of love and warmth… There’s also a programme on TV called Surviving Death I think - a lot of the same thing. If anything I felt comforted that death is actually just another stage - Not something horrible to fear.

I've been present at several deaths and I've never experienced anything like you've described. It's most like your mother had no awareness of the last minute or so of her death. Her nervous system may have had a reaction whilst passing away.

I am a nurse, and have cared for people at the end of their life for over a decade- it’s real privilege and I love my job.

I am so sorry to hear about your experience- I hope you can access the resources you need to move forward- it seems like you’re being proactive and talking, that’s great.

No two deaths are the same, much as no two births are- there are many similarities to be drawn there. But…there is a typical pattern and trajectory [in expected death], it’s generally quite peaceful and predictable- and where there are symptoms (pain, agitation, nausea, difficulties with breathing) we have many ways to manage them (in a home setting).

There are a few reasons a person may become or appear agitated where they hadn’t been, as things come nearer to their death. Scant reassurance for you, but lot of symptoms can seem more distressing to us as caregivers, than to the person themselves, but we would treat anything we possibly could, of course.

I should add, I have seen people die promptly after laughing, crying, and eating! It’s not usually that way though…

Safe, was the perfect word to use. Well done xx

My Dad’s eyes watered when he was dying too- we were told this was common. Also when your heart stops we were told it’s not the same as suffocating. My Dad was conscious but unable to talk for about an hour before, then his eyes closed and his breathing became shallow and would stop and start. Then eventually it stopped. After about a minute his whole body seems to exhale. I thought he was still alive but apparently this can happen. It was strange and beautiful and I’m really glad I was there. I was able to say what I needed to say.

I have OCD, it developed after my daughter died. I also PTSD, I did a lot of trauma work for PTSD and as that improved the OCD reared it’s ugly head. I think on reflection some of the OCD thoughts have always been there, but they have been magnified. For example I’ve always thought that if something good happens, then something bad will happen to “even” it up. But when it actually developed into OCD. It was stuff like - I found something I wanted quickly.. so someone might die. I know it sounds weird and unbelievable, the way it takes hold of you, it’s so strange!

when my daughter died, she was basically brain dead. She had HIE. We had
tk withdraw her life support. I suppose
we thought she’d just slip away naturally, and it would be quick due to the severity of the hypoxia. That’s not what happened. When you have Brian damage, but new and working heart and lungs, they carry on working. No one told us that. After about 18 hours we were told “if she’s still alive tomorrow we may have to restart fluids” that made me worry and feel that it was cruel.

Due to the brain damage she had some really awful seizures. They stopped her anti-epileptic meds, (despite her having seizures while having it), they left her just on morphine. When her care was withdrawn and she had a fit, she went blue, her eyes rolled in the back of her head and her tongue came out: we thought she was dying at that point, but she wasn’t. After several more fits over several more hours they did restart the medication.

she died after 22 hours of being without the life support. We weren’t expecting that at all. It’s like you think it will happen like it does in the movies…

it was strange though, at one point some odd calm came over us, we had been hysterical before. Didn’t last as long as I would have liked. I think because it’s so surreal. It doesn’t sink in for a very very long time!?

Both my uncle and one grandma died peacefully at home after long drawn out, painfully illnesses. Most of the family was involved to some level. After the last breath was taken the windows were opened, bodies washed down (I didn't do this part) and a small posy of flowers placed on their chests.

Another relative died after a massive heart attack whilst in hospital for cancer and the staff weren't aware that there was a DNR on their file. It caused quite a bit of distress for the relatives who were visiting. Not a nice last memory of your loved one collapsing on a toilet floor and then being worked on.

My dad died in hospital, he’d had cancer and chemo for a few years. The night before he died, my mum assured me that he’d seemed fine, he’d told her to go home as he just wanted to sleep. He just drifted down into deeper and deeper unconsciousness, I held his hand. It was peaceful but the shock of losing him took years to ease.

My mum died at home, also cancer, hers was terminal and she had lost a lot of weight. The palliative care team managed her pain. I’ve never really understood what happened when she died. We were told she’d most likely just slip away in her sleep but that didn’t happen. I think she had a seizure due to a drop in blood pressure. It upset me at the time because I didn’t know if she was aware of what was happening to her. I have a good friend who knows about seizures and I finally plucked up the courage to ask her if a person knows what’s happing during one and my friend said that they don’t.

Yeah. The way they know that is because people with epilepsy don’t remember what’s happened. They aren’t aware of it. When they come round they can be very tired and they have gaps in memory. So when alone, that’s how they know they’ve had one - not cos they remember, but because they dont. IYSWIM

A very good friend knew she was dying (cancer) and had asked her close family and my husband and I to be with her when it happened. When the hospital called us, she looked as if she was in a coma and completely unresponsive. Most of us are Christians. I suddenly thought 'I'll read her the 23rd Psalm'. As I began to read the first verse, a huge smile spread over her face though her eyes were shut. A few minutes later, she'd gone. It was so incredibly peaceful.

My Mums death was peaceful at the end. My father fell to absolute pieces and screamed - but she had gone, we were at the stage where she was rattling. She'd had a good night sleeping after a lot of battling it all, right to the last. I lifted her up gently onto pillows, more for Dad so he could feel I was doing something when I knew it was already done. She was gently propped up, and I am sure she was comfortable and out of pain, oblivious to it. Dad is now so grateful it happened that way. I am terribly sorry for anyone who witnessed an unsettling death. She looked so peaceful in the hours after and I will miss her, all my days.

Just the once, and it was a patient when I was on placement in operating theatres. They bled to death on the table during what should have been a routine and straight forward operation.
It was chaotic and ugly, and I will never forget the sound of the beeping of the monitoring sounding like a dying Walkman.
I guess the only blessing was that the patient was totally unaware.

I have been a nurse and also sat with some of my relatives when they have died. Every death is different but for me it feels like a privilege to be with someone in their last moments. I think where possible it feels better if the person does not die alone. Most deaths are peaceful especially when they have been given adequate pain relief where it is needed. Occasionally people do become distressed and giving them some comforting words or changing their position if that makes it easier for them to breath can help but not always. I think even when they open their eyes often their oxygen levels are low so they are not fully conscious or aware of what is happening. The moment of death feels significant to me as the person that was in the body has gone and the body is left lifeless. Death can mean we question our beliefs. Everyone is different and if being with someone when they are at the end of their life is not for you that is how it is. When someone dies it can feel very empty or it can be a relief and as some have described it is not unusual to have a vivid dream or picture of your loved one being fully alive. When someone is being resuscitated it is very hard that despite all that has been done to try and revive them that they die. The most difficult deaths are when someone is very young. We all have to die and death is part of life so coming to terms with this is helpful. I am sorry you have had such a difficult experience Hangingover.

I was with my beloved MIL, who died far too young after years of cancer.

It was (I am so grateful, for my own sake and hers) very peaceful when it actually happened - she had been unconscious for a few days and her breathing had been getting slower, she just seemed less 'there' (in the way that someone who was just asleep doesn't) and then one night her breathing just sounded different?

By this point we had a reasonably good idea of what we might be able to expect so I looked at the hospice nurse who'd been chatting to us and went - "Is that...?" and she said "Yep, I think we're there - do you want me to stay?". And she stayed with me & DH while we held MIL's hand, she made a few more of those deeper, odd-sounding breaths over a minute or so, and then she stopped.

We didn't talk, neither of us knew what to say to her in the moment after anticipating it for so long, but I hope she could feel us holding her hands.

Then the hospice nurse said she needed to do some official bits - I presume confirm the death with the doctor etc - so we left and went and got a cup of tea (where we couldn't stop hysterically laughing, I think it was a kind of shock - we were in stitches of guilty laughter about what if the hospice nurse came back to see us pissing ourselves, and then she DID and we immediately must have looked guilty and she very kindly said people getting post-death-panic-giggles happened all the time - which weirdly immediately made us stop laughing. So strange).

And then DH went back and sat with her for a bit longer, before we went home.

(TW here for slightly panicked 'death as a concept is scary')

It was as calm as I could have hoped for her but even so, talking about it now makes me feel panicky and sad and kind of... disgusted (?) and scared?

I think that's probably just a gut reaction to the weirdness and sadness of it, but I find it hard to think about. It was a profoundly odd experience, but I'm glad I was there as we were very close.

Strangely, I didn't fear death much/at all before, but now I do more despite it having been so peaceful - I think seeing it happen, and witnessing the moment someone stopped existing in a way that was both definite and yet - she was still there, right in front of us??? How is that possible, how does a person stop being a person when they're physically right there and ...not??? It messed with my head a bit.

(okay that bit's over)

That said, I think we're quite odd about death as a society in the UK, or at least these days. We don't want to see or think or hear about it, and I think that leads to a lot of fear - if we were more used to it, it'd be less terrifying. A Catholic friend of mine who lives abroad described her grandpa's body being at the house for a day (maybe 2? I can't remember exactly) after he died and me being utterly horrified and scared of the thought, but she was so casual and "it's just what we do" - much less scary to her.

I've been at my late mom's and my late husband end of there time on earth. I was also at a death which wasn't expected.

My mom and husband passing were very peaceful. They simply slipped away. My mom was 85. My husband just 60, which was 4 year ago.

My husband just looked like he was sleeping. I wasn't even sure he had passed. I had to get the nurses to confirm.

The 3rd passing was with a service user whom we were supporting. He literally keeled over on us and died. I was ringing 999 as a colleague was doing CPR

That was a shock. He died with his eyes wide open which wasn't pleasant however it was quick and simple

I think you the OP have been unlucky

MIL woke up at 7am howling for morphine. FIL gave it to her. She fell back to sleep. I got there with my son at 9.30am and noticed her hands and arms were purple, her breathing was very shallow and she has a waxy appearance. Hospice nurse arrived and checked her over. Told me her legs and feet were also purple where the blood supply to her extremities was shutting down. Gave her some end of life medication and told me we would lose her today. I called my husband, told him to come home from work quickly. He’d gone into London because we thought she had days left, not hours. He arrived 45 minutes later. I went in with my son and he told nanny it was ok to go now. We’d be ok without her and that he didn’t want her to stay and be in pain anymore. She had stage 4 bone cancer. He was 10 yo at the time. My husband spent some time alone with his mum. Came out of the room, him, me and FIL sat in the lounge with a coffee talking about the funeral MIL had herself planned. Husband suddenly got up, ran into the bedroom then shouted that she was gone. It felt like she had waited until we’d all said goodbye and left the room before she went. She knew my husband and I were terrified about watching her pass. Between hospice nurse giving MIL drugs to keep her comfortable, my son saying goodbye and leaving with my mum, and husband arriving, it couldn’t have been more that 90 minutes. I truly believe she had just waited for my husband as he was her only child and they were best friends.

i will never forget that day. The image of her dying was just so awful. And it deeply affected my son for years afterwards. We hadn’t realised we’d lose her that day and she was meant to be transferred to a hospice so I’d taken my son over to say goodbye thinking she would stil be “nanny”. We’d only seen her 24 hours before and she’d been up chatting to the kids. FIL hasn’t warned me that she’d deteriorated overnight. Just so so awful what I walked into with a child. 😢

for me it was the not knowing what to do after she had died in the bed. The funeral director was missing in action and I wasn’t able to talk to him until hours later, and he didn’t collect her body until 9pm. I was paranoid about “preserving her body” so kept the room cool. Took hours to get a doctor out to record time of death. Hospice nurse came back mid afternoon and helped to clean and dress my MIL.

Yes, after I had seen my dad die I did go in to see the body afterwards. But although it looked like my dad…I knew he had long gone if that makes sense. I know some people find comfort in seeing the body, but I didn’t because I knew he was no longer there. And yes, it has questioned my beliefs…I remain open to ideas now. The world is far too amazing and unknown to stick steadfastly to one view/religion in my opinion.

My dad had been fighting a losing battle with cancer for a few years but went downhill drastically very quickly. I was there when he died, he had been in and out of consciousness for about a week, prob due to the concoction of tablets and pain relievers he was on, when he was awake if you could call it that he was barely with us. I was only 19 at the time and it was many many years ago, the thing that haunts me was the sound of his breathing, it was horrendous. But when the time came, well it was the weirdest thing I have ever experienced and I can’t explain it. His breathing went back to normal, he woke up, looked at us individually and smiled and then it looked like he was looking at something that none of us could see. But his face was at peace, where as before he face showed pain and suffering, I can’t explain it at all and it did really freak me out, but I like to think that at the end he was at peace.

It made me feel a lot more at peace with death seeing my FIL pass (not a traumatic death). I am in Ireland and I think that people generally have a pretty good relationship with/ acceptance of death here.

I saw my mum die. She had hospice care at home and I would say that it was a fairly peaceful death but she didn’t just sleep away like I thought she would.
She did make some wailing noises during the last hours but I don’t think she was in pain. She also opened her eyes wide (after having had them closed for days) just before she took her last breaths. Apparently this is common and there is a reason for it. My Dad was terribly distressed by her eyes being open.