If you've seen someone die, what happened? (TW: trauma, loss, death, terminal illness)

[HangingOver]

This is quite difficult to write, as I have OCD and, ever since I was small, it has relentlessly latched on to the idea that if I talk about the idea of a loved one dying, write it, or even think the words, that it will somehow cause it to happen and it will be my fault. Therefore, like a lot of people, I imagine, I try to completely avoid talking or thinking about it at all, and if you have similar issues, I'm warning you in advance this thread will upset you.

But here goes, inspired by all the talk about dear Deborah James and her latest news, I wanted to try to talk about it becasue I really, really fear death and never talk about it with anyone IRL.

The thing that got me thinking this morning was a very clever and kind sounding palliative care doctor on Radio Five Live this morning talking about what generally happens at the end of someone's life in a hospice. She made it sound quite gentle, slow and peaceful and made sure to point out that physiological changes, such as changes in breathing patterns etc. aren't signs of distress, they're more involuntary noises of unconsciousness that the person doesn't know they're making (like when you snore, I guess).

I know she's generalising and of course this is what most people want to hear...and perhaps it is what happens for a lot of people...but that wasn't my experience of losing my Mum AT ALL. At least, it was up to a point, but at the actual moment of death, having been unconscious for many many days, she bloody 'woke up', for about 30 seconds. She appeared to be crying (or at least her eyes were heavily watering) and basically suffocated in front of us while seeming to stare at me with a terrified look in her eyes.

It was so, so, so bloody awful and I will never get over it. I can still see it in my mind's eye with absolute clarity. I feel so so sorry for what she must have been feeling in that moment. I've spoken to two friends who also lost a parent who was about the same age (60-ish) and they have said the same thing; and also said that they weren't aware this was a thing that happened and it was an awful shock.

So what gives? Were our relatives just unlucky or is this actually more common than people realise? Or is it actually all purely physical and she wouldn't have know anything clutching at straws-

I've googled it but most people seem to refer to a 'non-peaceful death' as one where the person was very upset towards/about the end of their life, rather than this 'waking up' thing.

Sorry in advance for starting possibly the most depressing and awful thread imaginable! I just find it so difficult to talk to anyone IRL about becasue of aforementioned problems (this has taken a long time to write as you can imagine!!)

These stories are all very interesting and moving. Thank you to everyone for contributing.

I was with my sister when she died 9 years ago. I believe it triggered some sort of PTSD and I have been plagued with the realisation of my own mortality ever since. However that's a different story. My sister died of CF so the medical equipment, drugs, hospital were a familiar setting. She was scared, I was scared. She was sleeping and all of a sudden sat up gasping from breath. A nurse ran in and gave her something to relax her then she lay on her side, laboured breathing until she just stopped. My brother was stroking her arm and he turned to the nurse and said 'is that it?' We had known it was coming all of our lives but in that moment my brother couldn't believe it. He was in shock. It took me a while to get it out of my head but I've made peace with it. I may have a more troublesome death than my sister, I may have a more peaceful one, that fact remains none of us are exempt from death and this thread has been a fascinating, sad, inspiring and bittersweet read OP so thank you for raising the subject. Its been very cathartic to read for someone with death anxiety.

My mum had a peaceful death but the second she had died a load of red/brown fluid came out of her nose & mouth, it was very upsetting. She had kidney failure at the end & I've always assumed it was because she had fluid in her lungs due to the kidney failure.
My dad drifted away over a number of days, which was torture for us but he knew nothing about it.

It seems like this fluid regurgitation is quite common! I've never heard of it before.

My sister’s actual death was reasonably peaceful - actually, it felt a little like Beth’s death in Good Wives.

But In the few days before her death I remember standing in the corridors as she was cleaned and changed, and her screams sounded as though she was being flayed alive.

I suspect things might have been a little better in a hospice, but even if a bed had been available my sister preferred to die in the ward she’d been a patient on for many, many weeks (including one stay of a year).

Thank you all for sharing your experiences. One of my parents is currently very unwell and close to death and it has really helped reading all of these posts.

When my daughter was "dying" she slept almost all the time. She woke occasionally for a sip of water. She said once "I wish this was all just a dream" but there was no crying flailing or fighting. She had had the brown vomiting earlier in the course of the illness but it all subsided in the latter part.

She didn't die. She had emergency surgery at 1am and made a full recovery (intestinal blockage). However she was within 24 -48 hours of death by the time the operation finally happened. She was 6. I have never fully recovered from that day helplessly watching her fading away.

I was a nurse and have been at numerous deaths , some peaceful , some not . My own mother died very peacefully surrounded by family but had had a truly horrific few months leading up to it .

This.
After thirteen years as a district nurse, seeing disjointed services and limited help you have to wait and wait for, I would never ever choose to die at home.

Thank you so much for writing these messages. This thread is full of love. I think and read about death a lot, especially since becoming a mum, but never talk about it with anyone. I’m very moved. I’m so sorry for those who lost loved ones too soon.

My partner had been unable to speak or move for quite a few days, but he suddenly woke up and shouted my name. I rushed over, he said I love you and then he closed his eyes and took his last breath. For me the experience tells me that we know when it's time. Beyond that I don't know.

I've worked in a hospital for about 16 years and seen a lot of deaths.

Some were peaceful and some were awful.

I don't want to go into details but 1 death still makes me cry when I think about them.. one lady in 2008, who died of acute pulmonary oedema following a routine op. Her resus was unsuccessful and it was horrific. I was left traumatised and angry as I tried to help her but couldn't. I strongly believe that she died due to medical negligence.
Her death would not occur now hopefully as protocols regarding intravenous fluids peri & post op have changed.

I’ve been present at 2 deaths- firstly my dad’s- he died very peacefully in hospital and received the best end of life care he could have wished for
Very recently, my father in law died very suddenly, at a family dinner. It was incredibly traumatic for us (failed CPR), but very quick for him (cardiac arrest) and he died doing what he loved best- drinking good wine and eating good food, so there are far worse ways to go!

I definitely have issues wrt death of loved ones, but incredibly, I work in a role that necessitates talking about end of life issues and dealing with bereavement- and when it’s not a loved one, I am very comfortable in talking about it…..

I sat with my mum when she was sent home on palliative care. She had the “rattle” for days. But no one warned me about this fluid, in this case it was yellow. And again, sorry for this detail, but my goodness it was the worst thing I’ve ever smelt. I felt so bad as I couldn’t even stay in the room. Again she was given an injection and it stopped.
Over the weekend before she died all my children came to see her, apart from my daughter they were all adults. Her breathing was loud and unsettled. She was unresponsive.Then my second son sat in the room with me and we just talked. Over the course of the conversation we realised her breathing was quieter. I was sure she was listening.

I’ve seen quite a few patients die, the actual dying part is always peaceful, but the events leading up to it might not be and can be quite traumatic. During the dying process they usually go unconscious and then agonal breathing starts and eventually they stop breathing and pass away.

My mum died in March from terminal cancer. It was peaceful. She just got weaker and weaker and eventually stopped breathing.

But I had many conversations with the palliative care nurses and they likened death with birth. It looks much worse to the onlookers than it is for the person it's happening to.

My friends dad died last year from cancer and she described the same as you did.

But my friend felt her dad was looking through her towards a relative who had come to take her dad and that brings her comfort.

Perhaps that is what happened with your mum. What you saw as fear was actually your mum seeing a passed relative who had come to collect her.

I hope thinking of this might give you some comfort.

Not quite - I saw my grandfather just a few hours before he died. He was unconscious most of the time and breathing in a very laboured way. I believe he went peacefully with my stepgrandma there.

The 'Death' part of this podcast offers some really interesting insights from a palliative care nurse and relatives of dying people - it might be helpful to listen to if you have fears about dying, or those close to you dying: www.thisamericanlife.org/523/death-and-taxes

I sat with my auntie for a week when she was in hospital dying. I just felt so sad that she was led in that horrid hospital bed with no one with her . Not sure if she knew I was there as there as she would drift in and out consciousness a lot. Just so sad that she retired and planned to do so much stuff but then fell ill. The worst part was they kept trying to take her off of the oxygen to see if she could breath on her own and when they did lots of loud alarms went off. Very sad and I sat in the hospital car park for ages when she finally passed away wailing my heart out.

@Nopeasinapasty I keep replaying her last moments in my mind, which is not healthy. I said to my sister that the sanitised Hollywood version of death from cancer, where the mum is wan but ethereally beautiful, and she drifts away to the sounds of a string quartet in a sun-kissed room, are so far from reality

In a nutshell this👆I felt shocked when I saw my Dad die as I had no idea what could happen, I'd only seen sanitised versions on TV. In his case it took a couple of days and was made worse as the place he ended up in the hospital was chaotic and upsetting (other patients shouting obscenities, a staff member completely out of their depth, an awful room, it felt like they had nowhere to put him & I felt/feel terrible that he was dying in such an awful setting) it was horrible watching him struggle when you knew the outcome. Just like there are traumatic births there are traumatic deaths and we tend to gloss over both as they aren't pleasant to think about.

@HangingOver I hope you are ok. In the immediate aftermath of my Dad's death I kept replaying the last horrible hours & immediate moments of death when he seemed to be choking / drowning in my mind. Now a few years later when I think of him I think of him alive rather than his death. I hope that time will lessen the trauma for you too.

Oh and the smell of a dying person, I'd obviously never experienced that before, but once smelt not forgotten.

My mum died of cancer (pneumonia as well) and was hallucinating, and they never seemed to be able to give her enough pain killers - said there was a point it becomes euthanasia which they couldn’t do. When my dad died 22 year later, he was sedated and was therefore completely sedated like he was having an operation. He agreed to have this done and he had one painful and really bad night before they got the pain under control and he just slept until he eventually died days later. He death was so much better than my mum’s and we were really grateful for these improvements.

I tried CPR on someone for 40 minutes whilst waiting for an ambulance. They were clearly already dead.

My mum is currently in same situation as Deborah James with same cancer. It's hard watching someone get thinner and weaker but in our case she is at peace with it so I'm reassured to know that.

I stayed with my great aunt when she was dying. She was dosed up on morphine and quite peaceful and I was dozing as it was the middle of the night. We both woke together and she sat bolt upright in bed, held her arms out to someone/something I couldn't see and I went to her, touched her and told her it was fine and to go to sleep and she made a few rasping breaths then died - I would say peacefully. It wasn't a disturbing experience for me. I was 19/20 at the time - she had been an absolute harridan to my parents and I chose to be with her because I didn't think they, or she would like it otherwise.

If it was Rachel Clarke you heard speaking, she has written a lovely book called Dear Life about her job in end of life care and losing her father. She was a journalist before retraining and it is beautifully written.

Both my parents died at home, 30 years apart almost to the day. My DF had been ill for a number of years but one evening suddenly went downhill and passed away peacefully surrounded by extended family (who'd all come over for a Chinese!). My DM died last year during lockdown and once medication was sorted and then a syringe driver, we had a beautiful week sitting with her while she gradually slipped away. Her breathing got more laboured as the week went on but she seemed peaceful and aware we were there. I'm so grateful we got that time together and my dsis managed to fly over from Australia. My DM was adamant she wasn't going to die in hospital.

I was with my infant son when he died under home hospice. He woke up and was really unsettled. He was on a SATS monitor and we could see his oxygen levels dropping. We administered a hospice drug under his tongue. He settled immediately and his SATS dropped over approx 15 minutes and passed. A hospice nurse told me that everyone suffers in the end unless you die in your sleep.