Ukraine Invasion: Part 23

[MagicFox]

Welcome all, thanks for the company

The tweet says from Mariupol and other areas. It does not specify the steelworks.

I don't think these people were from there. However there are still thought to be thousands still in Mariupol, who shouldn't be forgotten either.

There's still 100,000 in Mariupol outside of the steel works

I just saw aerial shots in the Daily Mail of the Mariupol steel works being bombed by a whole load of thermobaric weapons. It does not look good.

I am devastated.

I honestly don't know why we are holding back letting this atrocities happen blue

It's pretty obvious now Russia is full of threats, hot air and bullshit and not much else.

@blueshoes · 04/05/2022 23:23
I just saw aerial shots in the Daily Mail of the Mariupol steel works being bombed by a whole load of thermobaric weapons. It does not look good.

I am devastated.

Hell-bent.

The video seemed to be a few hours before communication with the soldiers inside was came back. Is there any hope in that?

Do we know for sure those were thermostatic bombs? I couldn’t see balls of fire. If they were, if they hadn’t penetrated the bunkers would they still be able to suck oxygen out?

Thermobaric

Ok I'm hawkish on these threads and I'm sure most know this by now. My grandad was a Japanese pow. The effect of that optimised my father and in turn me. So I have a very rigid though process and belief. My father and me both served in the British army too.

I try to be sedate but from pretty much the beginning I couldn't understand why we let history repeat itself.

Then there was bucha. That was it for me, I was done. I cannot understand why anyone would excuse that with "but nukes though" and believe those threats could mean we'd stand back so he could, AND HAS, carried on. In fact he's got worse and is taking the piss out of all of us.

But still, we carry on trying to appease but be strong. He knows it hence why he keeps threatening

Am I scared? No. Not in the slightest. I'd rather die than live in a world where killing children, raping them and their mothers, tying peoples hands behind their backs, shooting them then kicking them into a mass grave but as long as it isn't us?

NO THANKS

It'll be us next

Trigger warning on this link. It's reality though

www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/04/20/kyiv-coroner-nonstop-autopsies/

I’m wondering if it really is the end for those brave soldiers and poor civilians in the steelworks.

I agree with @TiddyTidTwo it was obvious the Russians weren’t going to be defeated on the steelworks, yet the West stood by and let it happen.

How is everybody feeling about May 9th? I oscillate between feeling sick and feeling hopeful that Putin may declare a victory and look for the off ramp. I know he's more of the escalation school of thought than not, but his position is looking worse and worse. I'm also wondering about these surgery rumours - does he really want to go under the knife with this going on, letting other leaders (that hideous fsb guy) taking charge.

This Belarus thing seems a bit weird. One breath it says it's a bad thing and that it means something and the next breath they have said this is the normal time of year that this happens so is not out of character?

Ok no idea what you're talking about re Belarus despite googling. Is it the drills mentioned yesterday?

I hope you don't mind me asking @TiddyTidTwo, but do you have children? I ask as I could think of nothing worse than this potentially escalating beyond Ukraine. Of course it's bloody atrocious what's happening there but I don't see how sending in NATO troops etc will help. It'll end in thousands of more lives lost. Call me selfish but I think it's an instinct to protect your own. This doesn't mean that I believe we should sit back and watch but there are experts trying their best not to let this spill over past Ukraine. We're arming the UA, training their troops and enforcing sanctions. I don't really see how we could do more without endangering the lives of many, many more. Sorry, I know most wouldn't agree but this is my stance.

@katem98
The Kremlin wants to escalate beyond Ukraine. They want the Baltic states back, Finland, Poland, Romania and what used to be called Yugoslavia. They want to colonise Africa.
The ‘west’ has to stop that. By any means.
you don’t have to support your neighbours children who may join the armed forces. They will fight for your freedom anyway.
just be thankful which country you are waking up this morning.

Am I scared? No. Not in the slightest. I'd rather die than live in a world where killing children, raping them and their mothers, tying peoples hands behind their backs, shooting them then kicking them into a mass grave but as long as it isn't us?

NO THANKS

I agree. I'd rather die trying to beat the tyrant than sit back helplessly watching the Russians destroy country after country holding governments in their grip with threats, raping women and murdering DC.

I have DC we'd all die together.

I'd like to see other presidents speaking out like Boris and coming together united.

There are holes throughout Europe they need to come together, hard and strong.

This is highly relevant. On my way to vote this morning I will buy some flowers. Before I reach the polling station I will reach the war memorial. I will read the names of the local men who gave their lives in WW1 and WW2. I will thank them for the freedom I have today to vote which way I like because they made sacrifices for me yesterday.

Sorry @MagicFox typed this whilst sorting DS whose decided he doesn't like sleep again! Below was from sky news this morning 'UK Ministry of Defence says "Belarusian land forces have been observed deploying from garrison to the field, for exercises" and adds that "Russia will likely seek to inflate the threat posed to Ukraine by these exercises in order to fix Ukrainian forces in the North"' however Sky also stated 'This is in line with seasonal norms as Belarus enters the culmination of its Winter Training cycle in the month of May."'

The Kremlin wants to escalate beyond Ukraine. They want the Baltic states back, Finland, Poland, Romania and what used to be called Yugoslavia. They want to colonise Africa

There's no doubt that's what they want but look at what's happened in Ukraine? How are they going to achieve that? Certainly they need to be curbed from future plans but I don't think they'll be able to get anywhere near those places for a long time

If we don't stand firm now, this WILL escalate beyond the Ukraine. Not immediately, but in a few years. Russia will take the Ukraine, and then absorb Belarus, or Moldova. A handy land corridor to Kaliningrad will be on the list and once you have that, well, the Baltic States are really part of Russia, aren't they?

As I said before, it's like watching a remake of 'Hitler in the Sudetenland'. Compromise and appeasement don't work with tyrants.

Don't forget the women who campaigned to get other women the vote too ... that was a hard courage, going up against what everyone else believed in. Like the Russians who protest the war, who have even more courage.

I've read some fairly nasty stuff from the Ukrainian ombudsman that Putin himself gave orders for Ukrainian women to be raped so savagely that they'd never want to go near another man. ON the one hand, that isn't verified but on the other, it comes from an official source and the Ukrainian govt seems to be building a reputation for reporting the truth, as far as they are aware of it.

And just why is that exactly............

This is why the sanctions and the weaning away from dependence on Russian gas and oil comes into play, as a long term strategy to starve the war machine. There can be no russia in the fold until putin is gone

The Kyiv Independent, [05/05/2022 05:10]
⚡️Russia boycotts UN Security Council meeting due to ‘Russophobic policies.’

Russia’s UN representative Dmitry Polyanskiy cited the alleged “warmongering” and “Russophobic policies” of EU leadership as the reason for the decision.

Polyanskiy said that the EU was “actively trying to extinguish the fire of the Ukrainian crisis by pouring gasoline on it.”

(I've reached the stage of sheer bemusement at the idea of Russia calling anyone else ' warmongering' and the DARVOing)

Kate yes I do have 2 adult DC and I do want to protect them and for them to live in a safe world. This will only happen if we stop Putin for good though.

I'd rather he just retreated and realised the error of his ways but that's never going to happen.

Guardian are reporting that Russia have been testing their nuclear capable missiles in Kaliningrad. Clearly decided they better dust them off and check they still work, unlike much of their shit.